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Implement Alley Discussion Forum

A History Lesson

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Hay DR

06-25-2005 10:35:31




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Vicon had in-line wheel rakes in the 1970's but not V-Rakes. Lely made the first wheel rakes as we know them today. Chester Meyer did get a patent for a horse drawn V Rake in 1954. Lely got the first patent for a 3 point V-rake in 1978 but the did not sell that many of them here in the USA. The foldable pull-type wheel V-Rakes as we now know them today showed up in the Late 1980's.




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RickB

06-25-2005 12:38:56




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 Some Lesson in reply to Hay DR, 06-25-2005 10:35:31  
You don't need to get all defensive. I asked a legit question based on the fact that around here, Vermeer has few sales and poor support. Gehl has always had decent numbers and good support. So based your "lesson", Lely had V rakes in 1978 but that doesn't count because they had low numbers. On the other hand "20 years ago, Vermeer was the only MFG with a V rake". According to the other side of your mouth, Lely beat Vermeer by at least 7 years with a V style rake. You seem to know a lot about hay making, but you spread a lot of crap on the stubble.

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Hay DR

06-25-2005 15:24:24




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 More History Lessons in reply to RickB, 06-25-2005 12:38:56  
In Feb. 1974 Vermeer introduced the R21 hydraulic driven pull-type roller bar V-Rake. The Lely V-Rake introduced & patented in 1978 was one 3 point Left Hand wheel rake and 3 point one Right Hand wheel rake mounted on a 3 point tool bar.



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RickB

06-25-2005 15:30:58




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 Re: More History Lessons in reply to Hay DR, 06-25-2005 15:24:24  
You are having quite a debate with yourself about who introduced what when.



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Tx Jim

06-25-2005 16:45:19




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 SALESMANSHIP or PROPAGADA in reply to RickB, 06-25-2005 15:30:58  
RickB,AMEN/DITTO Vermeer is the FIRST and Only manufacturer of hay equipment in the world.If you bale hay with a Vermeer baler all you need is a tractor a little larger than a lawn mower to make a 1000# bale!!!Tx Jim



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Hay Dr

06-26-2005 04:56:06




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 TXjim, Your prejudice has blinded you to the truth in reply to Tx Jim, 06-25-2005 16:45:19  
The Statement in question is "With every round baler known to man this statement is true. " The bigger the windrow the better the bale will be."

Just show me where I mentioned any MFG in this statement.



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Tx Jim

06-26-2005 05:14:29




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 The statement that Hay Dr made originally in reply to Hay Dr, 06-26-2005 04:56:06  
Hay Dr,you sound like the pot calling the kettle black.Your statement that I referred to is that a VERMEER R 21 rake caused a baler to make a 250# heavier bale than baling a smaller windrow.No you say I'm prejudice.Kim should charge you an advertising fee for all the Vermeer pictures you post as you are a DEALER.Tx Jim



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Hay Dr

06-26-2005 11:42:52




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 The Bigger the windrow the better the round bale w in reply to Tx Jim, 06-26-2005 05:14:29  
third party image

The test could have been done with a a John Deere 705 Twin Rake, as pictured below. Vermeer makes it for John Deere in Pella,Iowa.



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Tx Jim

06-26-2005 12:05:07




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  JD green(Vermeer R21)????????? in reply to Hay Dr, 06-26-2005 11:42:52  
Hay dr,are you saying that VERMEER sold rakes to JD way back when this bogus test was conducted.You stated VERMEER R 21 in test,surely with all your knowledge and facts you would know that the first "green" Vermeer(JD) rake was not an R 21.Next the rake in this test according to you could have been a JD 704(made by Tonnuti.Oh I also know that Vermeer made balers for Massey and Vermeer makes trenchers, I have been associated with agri. equipment since an early age so you can show your pictures to someone else. Facts are facts/fiction is fiction!!! TX Jim

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Hay Dr

06-26-2005 13:10:57




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 Deere round balers are Green Hesston's in reply to Tx Jim, 06-26-2005 12:05:07  
The JD 704 is a wheel rake that is made by Tonutti. JD started selling the 704 tonutti rake in the mid- 1990's. The JD 705 is a hydraulic Twin Rake and is the current model twin rake that Vermeer makes for JD. Vermeer did start makeing Twin rakes for JD back in the 1980's.

Vermeer make many products for CAT & John Deere.



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Tx Jim

06-26-2005 16:03:53




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 And you call me prejudice in reply to Hay Dr, 06-26-2005 13:10:57  
hay dr,now you have moved from bragging on Vermeer products to bashing JD products.Are you saying that Hesston builds JD balers or vice/versa.I can't figure how JD products have anything to do with your first raking mis-statement other than you're just trying to blow smoke up somewhere to cover your propaganda.At least no advertising pictures.Tx Jim



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Hay Dr

06-26-2005 18:04:07




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 JD Engineering Dept. Slogan: COPY OTHERS AND FIGHT in reply to Tx Jim, 06-26-2005 16:03:53  
In 1986 & 1988 Hesston & Vermeer filled a patent infringement suits against JD concerning their monitor and bale forming method patent #'s US4135352, US4145964, US4683815, US4702066. It was settled in 1990 and JD had to pay a war pension to both Vermeer and Hesston. JD also had to pay a patent licensing fee to Hesston for every baler they produced until the Hesston patents expired.



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Tx Jim

06-27-2005 03:34:06




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  JD Engineering Dept. Slogan: COPY OTHERS AND FIGH in reply to Hay Dr, 06-26-2005 18:04:07  
Hay Dr,may I ask what this has to do with your statement that hay raked by a Vermeer R 21 rake will weight 250# more than hay raked by NH256????I think JD didn't make this statement so why are you bashing JD again.Can you think of any more smoke screens.When Vermeer started making disc cutters and wheelrakes/caddy's did they copy any other manufacturer??Tx Jim



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