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This should be labeled abuse

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Fred Kobs

03-04-2003 04:06:49




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Poor ol MH44 gets used for pulling motors, stripping and loading junk vehicles, portable jack/ladder, boom truck, got 2 sickle mowers for it, ain't been mounted in 4 yrs. Oh yeah, it's origional purpose pushing snow. In 17 yrs all it's asked for is a valve job. Had it in the field when I was 12 pulling rotary hoe on 160 acres, put the uncles M in it's place. Got to love the old iron, it was designed to be used. Last forever.

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mike in mn

03-23-2003 10:13:22




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 Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to Fred Kobs, 03-04-2003 04:06:49  
a power packed m farmall would give your mh44 a run for its money.



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Hugh MacKay

04-20-2003 09:12:13




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 Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to mike in mn, 03-23-2003 10:13:22  
I wouldn't bet my money on either one over the other. I base this on what I saw in the 1950s.



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mike in mn

04-27-2003 18:55:51




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 Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to Hugh MacKay, 04-20-2003 09:12:13  
thats just what you saw.



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Hugh MacKay

04-27-2003 19:26:57




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to mike in mn, 04-27-2003 18:55:51  
I have a gut feeling it is more than you saw, in the 1950s That is when those tractors were new, or close to it.



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mike in mn

05-04-2003 18:24:58




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to Hugh MacKay, 04-27-2003 19:26:57  
that maybe so but 50 years later a power packed m farmall will out do a stock 44 massey gas. this is a fact. because my girlfriends dad has got a 44 gas and it'll hardly pull a small loaded gravity box up hill in third gear. My dad has got the power packed m and it will keep right up with our neighbors super m. our m will walk out of the field with a 16 ft silage box fully loaded with corn silage in fourth gear. so don't go saying it's more than what I have saw! no offence or anything. just what I have experienced.

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Hugh MacKay

05-04-2003 19:51:39




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to mike in mn, 05-04-2003 18:24:58  
I would never base any judgement on a tractor based on two tractors. By your own admission, you say power packed M and stock 44. When the M was a super and the 44 was a six cylinder, stock tractors, I will keep my money in my pocket. I have hauled one H^%$ of a lot of silage wagons, grain wagons and even highway trailers with a tow dolly, in my day and know a bit about what I am talking about.

When I was a teenager in the 1950s I knew of one only SM, 6 MH 44, about a dozen Cockshutt 40 and 3-4 Oliver 88. The guys that were buying those tractors bought them for one reason,"PERFORMANCE". The IH dealer in that area had probably 80% of smaller tractor business. Not so in the 50 hp class. 6 cylinder was king.

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mike

05-05-2003 19:37:29




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to Hugh MacKay, 05-04-2003 19:51:39  
actually the sm you refer to is a straight m that has been bored out to super m specs. and the stock 44 does not have a 6 cylinder in it. its got a 4cyl. gas. all those silage boxes you talk about must all be dakkon boxes with high side boards that you could pull with an h farmall. the ones I am talking about are big front unload, tandem axle, 16 ft long, and really freakin heavy. they'll even give them big 6 cylinders a run for their money.

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Hugh MacKay

05-06-2003 01:08:04




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to mike, 05-05-2003 19:37:29  
What else would you call an M bored out to SM specs but a beefed up tractor and should put out same as SM and your comparing that to a stock 44. By the time the SM came out the 44 was already a 6 cylinder. So lets compare tractors of equal hp ratings.

Actually the smallest silage box I ever had was a 16 footer and all self front unloaders. We managed to get those the barn with the Farmall 300, now I will admit we switched to 656 quite quickly as soon as it finished haybine duties and on corn we always used 656. I don't know where you got the idea of me using an H for this. My H was long gone before I started silage in the mid 60s. My last silage carts were fifth wheel highway trailers. We used them behind tractors and harvester with tow dollies normally used for making up trains on highway. Most of them were 24 to 30 footers and we moved them to silos with a highway tractor. Farm tractors are to slow, in this day and age. I lived on a heavily traveled truck route and there is only one way to fight truck traffic, that's with a truck.

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mike

05-06-2003 17:18:27




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to Hugh MacKay, 05-06-2003 01:08:04  
O kay lets say I was comparing my neighbors straight M with stock pistons and sleeves to the stock 44. the straight M still would out pull it.
Even our old 44 diesel had more power for pulling than the 44 gas.
I didn't say that you were using an H for this. I said you could pull a dakkon box with one to the silo. I never even saw a 44 with a six cyl. in it. I have saw a lot of 101's and 101 juniors with flat head sixes. never a 44. A 444 maybe. what did you take half loads of haylage with the 300? We use to use my H for pulling 14 footers out of the hayfield fully loaded to the silo. Since we are using bigger silage wagons we quit using the small tractors. we are using an 1800 oliver diesel, a G-900 MM diesel. with a 1066 on the blower.

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Hugh MacKay

05-07-2003 03:25:51




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to mike, 05-06-2003 17:18:27  
Mike: Actually hauling those wagons with 300 they were loaded, now it was quite flat land all the way to barn. I didn't do this for long as it wasn't fast and traffic was our real problem. Left hand turns are always nasty little vntures with a tractor and silage wagon. I pulled them a lot with 3/4 ton pickup with about 1500 lbs in back. In those days we were using a 1066 and 890 NH in field and a 560D set at 90 hp on blower. Even with three wagons tractors were just too slow pulling them, unless you were adjacent to silos. I had some silage that had to be hauled 3 miles, and the guy I had running harvester used to keep knives so sharp you could shave with them. He was a hard guy to keep up with. In the end I was using horizontal silos as well as uprights. I found those 22' aluminium dump trailers were no harder to pull behind harvester at least until loaded. I then used a John Deere 540A forestry skidder to level and pack silage. By then I was using one of my tower silos for high moisture corn grain When we wanted to fill those towers we just took back out of silage wagon and fed it with skid steer. My eventual plan was to use both towers as grain storage. With larger harvesters, horizontal silos were the only way I could see to keep up. I needed a few more kinks out of hitching and unhitching those dump trailers. I liked the idea of hi dump wagons but found they pulled harder than the dump trailer. I really wasn't satisfied I had found the ideal way to move silage. Dumps get rid of it fast and free the trailer up quickly.

As you can see I am a Farmall guy pretty much all the way. I don't know a lot about those old MH and I guess your suggestion on 6 cylinder actually being 444 is probably correct. And don't get me wrong I don't believe any of the 6 cylinder competition the SM had would run away on SM under same load. They were however tough competition.

If you go to tractor pulls today antique classes, and most of SM's competition is 6 cylinders. They are not leaving the SM in dust or anything of the kind. They are tough competition though. If I were in a pull today with a SM the one I would fear the most is the Cockshutt 40.

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mike

05-07-2003 12:19:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to Hugh MacKay, 05-07-2003 03:25:51  
Hugh,
we have hauled silage from 7 miles away with 1/2 ton pickups with no weight in the puckup box. With no problems. We run the same chopper but with a 3 row wide corn head behind a 7130 magnum. thats about enough chopper for that tractor. I am also a farmall guy too. But you gotta love those other makes of tractors too. they are pretty tough to beat. I think if a person were to be in a antique tractor pull with a super m the tractor to fear I think would be the G John deere. Have you ever tried pushing silage with a payloader? we have found they work pretty good in the pile. You can take pretty much the whole wagon load up the pile with it. And it is a heavy enough machine for packing. Your 560 did you put an M and W turbo oon it or something similar? when I was hauling silage with my H we had to go up hill then down again to the silo's. That was quite the pull with an H and silage box that was fully loaded. we had a hard time keeping up with three wagons seven miles away. The guy on the chopper spent more time sitting than he did chopping. That was hauling with pickups and thats no faster than a tractor when your pulling wagons.

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Hugh MacKay

05-07-2003 16:53:26




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to mike, 05-07-2003 12:19:44  
Mike:
The very first year I did silsge I had one 20x 50 tower silo and filled it with 560 and 717 harvester. Had a Cockshutt 540 on blower and pulled wagons with 300. Actually we did that two years, what a lame duck operation. Added the 656 on 3rd year and operated that way for 8 years. I had 500 acres of softwood forest and that was reason for skidder. It had the John Deere 8 speed power shift. Basically same as 4020. I had aux hydraulics and a drawbar for it and pulled a 20' Bushog disc and a chisel plow in fall. Used it in woodlot in winter months. It to would take a whole wagon load in one swipe. I bought the 1066 and NH 890 the same year. I always found that moving silage from field to barn was the real bottleneck in silage making. I tried many things. I borrowed a hi-dump, found I could get truck full. The aluminum dump trailers worked well as you had a heavy truck with air brakes and you could make time

My 560 did not have a turbo, we managed to get that hp out of it without. I did this very early on and ran the tractor that way 17 years 11,000 hours. It had pistons and sleeves at 7,500 hours. At the 11,000 mark on blower one day the old 560 gave the boys at silo a shower of engine block, rings, pistons, sleeves and oil. When the dust settled there was parts 30' from tractor. I sold the 560 to a guy for a puller. IH wanted $4,000. for a short block and I couldn't see spending that kind of money on a tractor without 3 point hitch.

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mike

05-07-2003 21:14:33




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to Hugh MacKay, 05-07-2003 16:53:26  
whatevever works. what did you do to get 90 hp out of your 560? did you turn the pump up on it and put bigger injectors in?



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Hugh MacKay

05-08-2003 02:24:26




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: this should be labeled abuse in reply to mike, 05-07-2003 21:14:33  
It was all done on pump.



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