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Horse farms

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Spook

03-08-2008 18:11:41




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I see a lot of horses for sale around here, even some free to a good home kinda thing. I think the cost of feed, and the recession is really going reduce the number of small horse operations.




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bobinKY

03-10-2008 20:11:57




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
I heard on the news the other night that here in Kentucky, it is virtually impossible to find hay for the horses. We have horror stories every week on the news about abused and underfed horses being confiscated by the humane society. Our state owned horse park ran out of hay from its supplier and is now going out of state to buy hay for their stock. I would say it is going to continue to get worse until the first cutting. Our local feed store had straw at $8 a 50lb bale last fall. I can't imagine what alfalfa is going for, if you can find it.

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Old Iron

03-10-2008 08:41:50




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
Horses aren't "subsidized", so that may be the reason some of the larger farmers don't have a "use" for'em.



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Billy NY

03-10-2008 08:08:20




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
This economy ought to weed out some horse owners. Having been around them since a kid, today it seems like there is a lot of activity with horses in the area, and in Florida, hard to figure how everyone affords it. A couple of years ago and for several years before that, I think we had over 15 of our own, and had just as many boarders, all included, sometimes close to 40 at the place. Between the Vet., and the Blacksmith, meds, supplements, feed, hay, bedding, fences, gates, trucking, foaling, facility operating costs, riders, people with bad attitudes and the lame @ss help you can't find + all the other great perks, I'd almost think you need to see a shrink to figure out why you are in this business, have a farm or even just a couple sometimes. It can be even worse with the wrong kind of people running the place or unreliable help.

Our place is funded by the salaries of the 2 owners, who are family members + boarders and lessons. When money is tight and you have all those darned horses to deal with, I can remember the stress from being low on hay, bedding, etc. and the never ending distractions from unreliable help who would no sooner turn on you and report you for abuse just to be jerks. Glad to be away from it, and the fact that they have gotten rid of most of the horses, downsized to something managable at least. There are things you can do like compost that can supplement an operation with horses and at the right size, you should be able to pay something respectable for help, but people don't want to work, we have a decent person there now, with much less going on, I'll say it again, glad I'm not involved in it for the most part, probably so much easier now without a full house.

Hard to understand the people that let em starve, at our place they have always been fed before we are ! Their well being is always #1, even when times were tough, you just can't let that happen, stalls have to be clean, they need exercise and good feed, clean filled water buckets etc., can't lose sight of that ever, and if the funds won't support what you have and you have too many, you have a big problem headed your way at full speed, you have to know this before getting involved, it's common sense actually.

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JML755

03-10-2008 08:01:30




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
Interesting topic. My 3 daughters are equestrian riders (English Hunt) ever since they were 8 yrs old. 5 years ago, my wife and daughters cajoled me into getting our own horse. We adopted a race horse through an organization (CANTER) that seeks to provide a home to race horses rather than have them go to a slaughterhouse. Racing is a business. When we got our thoroughbred, he was sickly, ribs showing and would not earn a dime anymore for the owner. He is arthritic from the rigors of racing at a young age (he is now 9) but we spend thousands of dollars a year on his board and care (vet bills, supplements, shoeing, blankets, tack, cookies, carrots, etc). We wouldn't trade him for anything.

As others have said, a lot of that money goes to FARMERS (Hay) and others in the animal husbandry business. The same people we buy medicine from supply stuff for cattle, etc.

We bought some property (55 acres) and plan to retire there and get another 3 or 4 horses to raise along with some crops. No, we are not full-time farmers, but I'm buying farm equipment, spending money at TSC, etc.
Nearby, a developer is trying to put a motocross track and dragstrip on 200 acres. There would be NO trickle-down to farmers or agri-suppliers with that development.

So, before people start to bad-mouth the "city-folks" who move out to the country and start their "horse farms", consider who else would buy your property? Most people will not buy larger parcels just to put a house on it. So you (or someone else) will end up splitting it. Or a developer will put a subdivision on it, if it's close enough to a town.

As for the original post: Yes, I've noticed the price of hay (and consequently board) rising. I've also noticed the price of horses dropping. With rising prices for gas (and everything else), people have to cut back on the "discretionary" items and keeping horses as a hobby certainly falls in the discretionary category. Unfortunately, it's easy to stop going out to dinner or the movie or cut back on bowling, but it's not so easy to just "quit" owning a horse.
By the way, I live in southeastern Michigan where the economy stinks in general. Anyway, just my 2 cents.

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Bret4207

03-10-2008 05:12:12




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
As my friends in the feed store biz say, " The horse and hobby farmers pay my bills when the milk checks are down." What difference does it make what someone raises? Horse, Emus, hogs or deer. They all pay their taxes and add to the economy.

As for the abused horses- I wonder why it's always dogs and horses that get starved? Every town seems to have 1 or 2 starved dog/horse stories every few months.

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oscar80

03-09-2008 15:53:01




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to buickanddeere, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  

rrlund said: (quoted from post at 16:13:51 03/09/08) Or they're like my sister in law. Thought they'd eat lawn clippings and take care of themselves.


Sounds familiar to me. Until animal control step in the inlaws horses got 2 small scoop of oats and no hay each day for over 6 months. you could see bones.

third party image

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rrlund

03-09-2008 08:13:51




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
Or they're like my sister in law. Thought they'd eat lawn clippings and take care of themselves.



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dwrk

03-09-2008 07:48:33




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
Good riddance.



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jose bagge

03-09-2008 08:52:24




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to dwrk, 03-09-2008 07:48:33  
I've asked "crop" farmers about this before and never gotten an answer- why do you guys hold seem to hate horse operations? Cattle folks seem to appreciate a good horse...dirt farmers just grunt at the mention...

'course, all those small horse operations could get sold and turned into suburban subdivisions- I guess that would make ya happy



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dave2

03-09-2008 09:41:19




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to jose bagge, 03-09-2008 08:52:24  
You're just banging your head against the wall.....If there was an intelligent answer, I'd sure like to hear it myself. Horse owners/keepers are a part of what keeps farmers going and usually are appreciated. If someone would fess up, I'd be willing to bet that the "I hate horses" attitude stems from someone with horses moving on a piece of property that someone wanted to farm.

Or someone tried to do some price gouging and got caught at it, or just wasn't happy with what someone wanted to pay. I get along great with all the local farmers except one idiot that complains about my fences.

If there is a real answer to the question Jose asked, could someone fill us in? Without any smart assed comments if possible...

Dave

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John (C-IL)

03-09-2008 10:28:53




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to dave2, 03-09-2008 09:41:19  
For the record I make my living making and selling horse feed.

Hate may be a strong word, but there is a certain amount of disdain directed toward horse people. Some of that stems from jealousy as the horse owner has disposable income that they use to support their horses that most "farmers" see as a waste of resources. That 10 or 20 acre "hobby farm" could be used to produce crops. The same horse people that move to the country are the first to compalin about noise, dust, traffic from farm machinery, restrictive zoning, being expected to provide adequate fencing and security for their animals and the odors from hogs, cattle and sheep.

The ag community is full of stories about horse people that abused private property rights by riding on posted ground, didn't pay for hay, thought that they should pay less than market rates or were abusive when told what it would cost to board their horse or weren't allowed "free" pasture access.

Lately the stories of starving horses are truely appalling, Horses abandoned in the Shawnee National Forest or just plain abandoned.

I don't know the answers or have any solutions, but it should be required of prospective horse owners what the costs of feed, boarding, veterinary care, shoeing and general costs are. I know I have had several people decide not to buy a horse when they figured out what the costs were.

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jose bagge

03-09-2008 12:51:28




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to John (C-IL), 03-09-2008 10:28:53  
There's a big difference between a horse OWNER and a horse "farmer"- horse OWNERS are the people I deal with that pay me for board, training and lessons, and who bless their hearts buy my animals and keep me and the industry in business. They often have money, and (again) bless their hearts they pay (not enough) to play. Horse FARMERS are the people like me that seem to get the grief- from assorted "farmer" yahoos that usually don't have a pot to pee in, and who's place shows it. I have a great relationship with my hay guy, my feed guy, and my neighbors who are cattle and crop folk...what I don't have is the respect of some dip$tick like "Mr. Good Ridance" who probably can't plow a straight line anyway, and who badmouths us every chance he gets- and every town and every forum seems to have one or more of these jokers. 3rd generation farmers remember when grandaddy plowed with a team and appreciate a good horse the same way I appreciate all good livestock- the "posuers" are the ones that blow the steam and make trouble for horse people.
Fences-hey, It's my land, and I built 'em with out chrging you so it didn't you cost you a dime( even though the state says I COULD have chargesd you half!) . Trespassing? we both have more problems together with hunters than you'll ever have with my girls and riding (yeah, most horse owners and riders are women- COULD THAT BE THE REAL REASON THESE FOLKS HAVE PROBLEMS WITH HORSES?). When your cows get out, give us a call and we're there- when your junk's stuck in the mud, call us and we're there. WHY? because we're farmers, just like you- only we raise horses .

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John (C-IL)

03-09-2008 17:20:52




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to jose bagge, 03-09-2008 12:51:28  
I agree with you jose, and I wasn't pointing fingers. Unfortunately, few make a distinction between horse owners and horse farmers.

Where we are 2 hours south of Chicago a new cottage industry has been developed to board, train and transport race horses. It's cheaper than trying to keep them at the track.



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dave2

03-09-2008 12:06:36




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to John (C-IL), 03-09-2008 10:28:53  
Your answer is probably closest to the truth. I guess I have it a little different here than you folks have it in the States. I use land that cannot be used for anything else (orchards, land that cannot be used fow anything except pasture, and from Oct - Apr, land that cannot be used for anything at all) because of various programs. My fence issue, is not bad fences, but that the guy wants me to fence 1 meter back from the property line so he has room for his equipment in the joining field. I did what he asked one year and he plowed right up to my fence anyway. So now, I fence to the border. I have met some folks (horse owners) that can be pretty difficult though. Usually the ones that buy horses and want to board them somewhere else. We kept a horse for someone for 4 weeks before we kicked them out. After 2 more 4 week periods of other people doing the same, we bought the horse from them. Now, all they do is hang around horse shows and act like experts and badmouth people.

Anyway,

Thanks for a real answer.

Dave

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jose bagge

03-09-2008 05:32:34




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
There's several issues at work here-
1. hay and grain have gone up a pile- in VA feed is about 9 a bag and squares about 7-9 bucks (yikes!). They're expensive to keep...full care board is about $350 ( should be $450 if we wanted to make any money). Pastures all ragged because of poor weather last year, so even straight feild keep is not possible.
2. quality of feed and parasite control has gotten to the point where horses are living 30+ years. I have a horse that won at the ApHC world show at 32 years- still kicking at 35. So- they're not just dropping dead in the feilds anymore.
3. the slaughter house issue is legitimate- a LOT of horses (some near dead, some damn good ones) went to slaughter in years past.Now, their just like stray cats.
4. Horse OWNERS are getting old- and a lot of their kids have no interest. prefer skateboards, computers and guitars.

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Bob Huntress

03-09-2008 00:42:44




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
My wife places farm animals that the owners don't want, but she hasn't had a horse for almost six months, or more. The last horse that anyone here, in west Tenn, got sick of was last fall or so. Frankly, I could go for an old horse, the type that is on it's last few years, and has no issues walking around a pasture of goats looking big. In exchange for his scaring away dogs, I'ld be more than happy to feed and water him. My daughter would probably even give him baths. All in all, it wouldn't be a bad gig, but I'm not spending alot for a horse to just walk around, when I know that by summer, someone will want my wife to find a home for a horse or donkey anyway. It kills me that my wife has placed a horse and a mule, and I didn't even want them at the time. I didn't realize that by just being in the pasture with the goats, they were earning their keep. I've already told her that I want the next one she gets, exspecially if it's old.

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Will- Tx.-Mn.

03-08-2008 20:10:43




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
Hey guys,

Where the heck is "around here"?, "around the area I live in"?, and "around this area"?

~Will



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old art

03-08-2008 20:27:26




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Will- Tx.-Mn., 03-08-2008 20:10:43  
is that yonderway down the road a pice.or out back



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Leland

03-08-2008 20:04:48




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
And a lot of this is bacause they closed down the only horse slaughter house in the country near chicago bacause people protested processing pets into food ,but it's a meal in other countrys .



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Bendee

03-08-2008 21:07:37




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Leland, 03-08-2008 20:04:48  
yeah. so are those appendages which point south on a male animal.



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Larry59

03-08-2008 19:24:19




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
Around the area I live in. There are a quiet a lot of people who still use the carriage and horses. See a few everyday here. Kind of nice to see them trotting down the road.



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Animal

03-08-2008 18:14:22




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 Re: Horse farms in reply to Spook, 03-08-2008 18:11:41  
Around this area you can not give an old horse away.



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