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31 Motor and head

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tab31

02-10-2008 08:59:24

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Hello,

I have a spare motor in the garage that came with my 31 model A pickup.

It's a 4 cyl ford block #3378209, produced around August of 1931. The head on it has these markings: F1 MF (stamped) and 4-28 (tagged). It's not a ford head, so I'm thinking that this motor came out of a Massey Ferguson tractor. The block and head were painted red.

Any info would be helpful!

Thanks, Tom

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noncompos

02-10-2008 17:35:05

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 08:59:24

Weren't there several different heads for these (aftermarket, I've always assumed)supposedly to increase power and performance, or were those for the "T's"??...Frontenac comes to mind, but that's just a guess.

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tab31

02-10-2008 19:08:47

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to noncompos, 02-10-2008 17:35:05

Yes, there were higher compression after market heads available. That's what I originally thought this may be, until I took it off the block. The higher comp head had different shaped expansion chambers. These chambers appear to be the standard Ford shaped. But I can only tell this from the photos I've seen.

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Bob Huntress

02-10-2008 20:43:01

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 19:08:47

Is one of those cylinders getting water in it?

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tab31

02-11-2008 06:55:09

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to Bob Huntress, 02-10-2008 20:43:01

Yes, at some point one must have gotten water inside. Looks like just some light surface rust though.

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Bob N.Y.

02-10-2008 15:40:57

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 08:59:24

I don't know of any Massey Ferguson tractors that used a flat head 4 cylinder engine. Like others have said, The Massey Ferguson name didn't exist until the 1950s.

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Bob Huntress

02-10-2008 12:07:01

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 08:59:24

Many years ago I was helping an elderly man with his model A. He shared how many a small farmer got their tractor in the 1910's and 1920's. They would purchase a model A as stripped as possible, and deliver it to their local machine works to have it converted into a tractor. The extent of work that was performed varied with each shop. Some shops would purchase a bare model A, perform the tractor build and sell their tractor as such. I am told that the practice was common, at that time. Remember that the goal would be to purchase the model A as cheaply as possible, with any extras removed. Could the markings on your head indicate that your engine was intended for such a sale?

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tab31

02-10-2008 12:22:57

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to Bob Huntress, 02-10-2008 12:07:01

Bob,

Thanks for your input. Someone else had also mentioned this to me & I'm starting to think that this is where the motor came from. If this is the case, I am curious why the different head, instead of a Ford head.

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Bob Huntress

02-10-2008 12:30:53

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 12:22:57

It is possibe that using a locally cast head was cheaper. This was clearly before my time, but from what I have heard, local foundaries were not uncommon in those days.

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Bob

02-10-2008 11:23:36

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 08:59:24

The "MF" is probably the "foundry mark" of the foundry that cast the head.

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Oldcraneguy

02-10-2008 10:07:46

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 08:59:24

Might try this site Tom, they should be better versed on that particular piece....Don

Link

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Oldcraneguy

02-10-2008 09:24:14

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 08:59:24

Im no expert but think Massey-Ferguson was formed in either the very late 40s or early 50s and Id kinda be surprised if a head from that era would fit a 31 model A, course Ive been surprised before...
What makes ya so sure its not a ford head? Kinda looks like an early Ford head to me...

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tab31

02-10-2008 09:43:03

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to Oldcraneguy, 02-10-2008 09:24:14

The Ford Heads had no markings on them except up by the water pump inlet. Maybe MF made after market heads for this motor?

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tab31

02-10-2008 09:02:21

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 08:59:24

A closer view of the head numbers...

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jhill52

02-10-2008 09:16:17

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 09:02:21

Sure looks like a Massey Ferguson logo but they weren't around until 1954 or so. Ford-Fergusons used front mount distributors not top. Later Ford tractors used side mount. True Fergusons used Continental motors.

Jerry

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ScottyHOMEy

02-10-2008 09:28:48

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to jhill52, 02-10-2008 09:16:17

I don't know enough to specual;te about what it is, but I'm watching with interest. I'm thinking. though, that it was in a '31 Ford. I would assume that the original '31 motor (if this is not it) ran for some number of years. If this is a replacemnt motor it could be anything, including a much later motor than a '31.

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tab31

02-10-2008 09:48:23

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to ScottyHOMEy, 02-10-2008 09:28:48

The block is stamped/tagged with a number that corresponds with the Ford production date of August 1931. Maybe the head is an after market?

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ScottyHOMEy

02-10-2008 10:10:27

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to tab31, 02-10-2008 09:48:23

Again, I'm speculatin', but it could be just that. I'm operatin' on the assumption(always a dangerous route!) that that MF stamp means it's an M-F head. I know Ford and Ferguson swapped out a lot of technology and parts befoe their falling out.

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Bob

02-10-2008 11:22:16

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Re: 31 Motor and head in reply to ScottyHOMEy, 02-10-2008 10:10:27

Not likely, as the first use of the "Massey-Ferguson" name was in 1958. Prior to that, the, the "MHF" was used.

From the official corporate link below:

"The name Massey Ferguson was coined in 1958 � a shortening of the name Massey-Harris-Ferguson. This company had been formed in 1953 after the merger of the famous North American company Massey Harris with Harry Ferguson Limited of England."

How Massey Ferguson came to be...

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