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tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2

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johndeerejon

11-03-2007 00:13:18




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Now that I have been away from work for a couple of hours I have calmed down a little. In response to the posted messages in the first part of this saga..... .If you are traveling less that ten miles round trip with a truck, its not worth having a truck. I know this because when my dad and myself were farming, we did the math and it made more sense to have larger wagons. The picture of the IH truck is a great picture. IH doesn"t have many parts available for these any more (I work at an IH dealership). I know that your GM and Ford Dealers don"t have many parts left for there stuff eather (I do all the 2 ton work at my dealership and I have to find my own parts for anything older that 1985). If you are getting parts, your getting them at salvage yards, and that can be an insurance risk. Hydralic brakes on anything bigger that a pickup is just plain stupid in my opinion. They do not have the required capacity to stop a 2 ton loaded with beans. I don"t care who you talk to, they cannot stop efficiently. Say what you will, but the 2 tons gas, hydraulic trucks are going away just like the dodo bird.

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Eric SEI

11-04-2007 18:40:05




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Between where I live and the river terminal is a 7 lane highway past the riverboat casino and then a 5 lane highway through town to the terminal. I don't think I would want to take a tractor and several wagons there. While I am about 15 miles from the terminal there are plenty who are within 10 miles who would face the same conditions.



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HuskerMedic

11-04-2007 05:58:50




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Around here, big gravity boxes being pulled by large tractors were the in thing 20 years ago. Then no-till hit; people didn't need those big tractors for tillage anymore, and the trucks started seeing a comeback.

Was with a friend of mine at a farm show; he was looking at a big gooseneck trailer to hook onto his pickup to haul roundbales with. I made the observation that rather than spend 36k for the trailer (new ones are all he can find) to hook it up behind his 55k pickup (which, by the way, will be incredibly overloaded on the brakes, tires, and drivetrain) he could probably pick up an old cabover tractor and flatbed for less than 10k and be able to haul his bales more efficiently and safely.

I'm not saying everyone needs to go out and buy a semi, but I think there's a lot of utility to buying a cheap, retired over the road tractor, even for a small operator. Heck, just think of all the antique tractors you could haul with the thing.

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buickanddeere

11-04-2007 07:31:27




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 cheap single axle diesel tractor for 5th wheel trailer in reply to HuskerMedic, 11-04-2007 05:58:50  
ebay and everywhere else is loaded with 5-15 year old Isuzu/Izusu cab over single axle dually 5 ton trucks for $5,000-10,000. Slip a 5th wheel hitch on and go with far more brakes and suspension than your $65,000 2008 pickup.



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35A

11-03-2007 18:42:21




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
IH truck dealers don't want to hear about Loadstars, A models B models, C models, Rs, Ls, OR the BEST Looking truck they ever made, The K KB models. We run a 1976 1700 Loadstar dump truck every day in our buisness. 404 5+2 single axle dump. Parts men at the dealership is pretty much useless. There are places to get rebuilt parts for the old trucks no matter what make. It just takes a little looking. The small guys are still the back bone of this country and so are their old trucks. We still get out & get under because our trucks are not full of computers. OK, I'm done now

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buickanddeere

11-03-2007 13:40:15




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
How about the European method of hauling "semi" trailers behind their farm tractors? Rarely see a highway tractor in the country but 25mph and 38mph farm tractors hauling a 30+ ton air braked pintle hitch dump trailer are a dime a dozen.



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1206SWMO

11-03-2007 13:24:44




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
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Heres some old grain trucks that didnt go away.The top 4 trucks sold pretty darn good at an estate sale in Sept near Kimball,NE.I'll bet the people that bought them find some parts.

The bottom truck pulled a trailer hauling old Olivers to the recent Ottawa,KS show.

Gravity wagons have never been used in my area.Around here theres 3 ways to get grain to the grain elevator.

1 2 ton grain truck
2 10 wheel grain truck
3 Semi

Try and pencil out a high dollar 10 wheeler or a semi when you farm 320 acres or less.We have quite a few smaller farms in my area that all still use 2 ton trucks.Not all of us farm 10,000 acres and have 4 nearly new semis sitting in the yard.

I haul 12 miles one way and can turn a load every 45-50 minutes if theres no line.With a tractor and gravity wagons I'd be nearly 3 hours because I'm not going to pull one very fast.

What parts can you not get for an IH Loadstar?I have a 1968 IH 1800 Loadstar and a 1969 IH 1600 Loadstar.We havent ran in to a thing yet that we cant get new or rebuilt.We just put a new clutch in the 1800 plus it had an all new brake system several years ago.Granted they are a bear to bleed.A good friend has rebuilt the carbs on both of my Loadstars and they run good.

If I can get parts for an old IH Loadstar then you can still get them for a older Ford,Chevy,or Dodge.I was recently out in central Kansas and cant believe the amount of 2 ton trucks still in use.They arent going away for quite awhile.Not every truck I met was driven by an 80 year old man.

Brakes or no brakes I cant remember the last wreck caused by a 2 ton grain truck in this area.Thats probably why my insurance is only $80 per truck per year.

Maybe the dealership needs to get someone else to work on old trucks since they have you so baffled!! So now if its over 20 years old we throw it away.

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35A

11-03-2007 18:45:10




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to 1206SWMO, 11-03-2007 13:24:44  
What a GREAT bunch of trucks!!!! KB 5!!!!



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1206SWMO

11-03-2007 19:07:24




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to 35A, 11-03-2007 18:45:10  
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There were many more old trucks at this sale.



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Walt Davies

11-03-2007 13:10:13




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Grampa always told me the story about farming wheat in 1917/8 they were the last farm to get combined and it was getting late in the evening. The buyer came out from town and told Grampa he had to get the wheat to town before midnight or he was going to get a lot less money as the government man had put a price clamp on it starting the next day.
So Gramma and Grampa drove the two big wagons pulled by 8 horses into town just in time. Gramma always bragged about driving that big wagon pulled by 8 horses she was in her teens an was about 5'1" tall and didn't weigh a whole lot in those days.
And you worry about brakes on 2 ton truck. Walt

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FIXERUPPER

11-03-2007 09:31:09




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
All of my grain used to go to town with wagons pulled by a tractor, but after a near jacknifing on a downhill icy patch on a gravel road behind a farm grove, I put the wagons away and have hired trucks ever since. Around here big wagons are showing up more all the time in the fall but their axle weights are WAY too heavy and are doing damage to the roads and bridges. I can't believe their wimpy little surge brakes can do much good on one axle for a 50,000 pound-plus-load. Figure in the wear and tear on the tractor and tires plus the purchase price of the wagons and the wage for a good seasonal driver, if you can find a good one, and hiring a truck wins hands down. Wagons are better than trucks for hauling to the bins from the field, but when it comes to going down the road, hire a truck. You hand him a check when he's done and your worries are over.Jim

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4010guy

11-03-2007 09:03:37




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Hi This has been a very interesting post for me as a always thought up to this time that BRAKES and door handles on the INSIDE were just an unnecessary option. LOL



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the Unforgiven

11-03-2007 08:46:53




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
I never could understand people using wagons, but other than that, you are correct. Here in central NE, any kind of proggressive farmer has made the switch to semi tractor-trailers. Quite a few farmers are still using big tandem axle trucks, and it is not hard to see the writing on the wall. The only single axle trucks are old guys that are on the way out that are not going to spend a dime. When you have combines that can knock out ninety acres of 200+ bushel corn a day and 900 bushel auger wagons you need a herd of tandems to keep up, along with a driver for each one, because if there is ANY line at the elevators the combine will have to stop. I logged 190hrs. this fall hauling corn in two 22ft. tandems and two semis, and this was the last year for the tandems, they just can't keep up. Time is money boys, and it's all about the money. Single axle trucks are for gardeners.

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1206SWMO

11-03-2007 19:11:54




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to the Unforgiven, 11-03-2007 08:46:53  
Not all of us have huge combines.We use what we can afford.I love your put down of the small unprogessive farmers.



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Tradititonal Farmer

11-03-2007 08:54:38




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to the Unforgiven, 11-03-2007 08:46:53  
Don't want to hear no crying when the price of grain drops and you can't hack the payments on the new equipment while the 'gardeners' with their old paid for stuff are still going.Might update a few things from the bankruptcy sales though.



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RodInNS

11-03-2007 19:18:52




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to Tradititonal Farmer, 11-03-2007 08:54:38  
Actually, I think if you looked hard at what a lot of guys have invested in the 10-15 year old tandems and tractor/trailer setups you would find that it's not much more that it costs to keep these old gas jobs on the road for a couple years. BT/DT. Bought he tandem....
There may be a lot of reasons to run a single with hydraulic brakes, but I can guarntee you that around here, cost is not one of them. Anyone that truly believes that is deluding themselves. Mabey that's different elsewhere, but here.... those old trucks want into the thousands of dollars a year in brake repairs, engine work, etc... before you put 4 dollar gas in them at 50 cents a rev.... and then you can still only put half a load on them and haul it at half speed. We've got some old fire trucks in the station like that. I'm quite familiar with what they cost to run.


Rod

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1206SWMO

11-03-2007 20:12:29




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to RodInNS, 11-03-2007 19:18:52  
A 10-15 year old tandem diesel with a decent 22 ft bed and hoist around here is $17-20,000 plus and they have upkeep too.

A decent old road tractor with a decent hopper bottom is $20,000 plus.Try and justify them on 240 acres.You use what you can afford.

We dont rebuild the engines and brakes on our 2 ton trucks every year.The engines on my old IH Loadstars havent been touched in many years except for tuneups.

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RodInNS

11-04-2007 14:43:13




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to 1206SWMO, 11-03-2007 20:12:29  
Around here there's no shortage of road tractors around for 7-10 grand. These are good running light tractors. A trailer will cost you probably the same or more depending on what you're looking for. I'm not suggesting that you will find any grain trailers here... but you'll get some kind of end dump for that money.
Straight trucks can be had anywhere in the 5-15 grand range. Again, this is with an end dump body, not a grain body. If you want to get picky, you pay. I don't think it's beyond the means of most people to do some modest work on that gear to tighten it up for grain. If they can keep an old single axle gasser on the road, they can do some mods to a good used tandem or tractor. I know we used to spend close to 5 grand a year on the old ton between brakes, suspension work, front end work, frame work, cab work.... and on and on and on. That was all done in a shop because I didn't have the time to do it. Damn thing near ran us broke and it didn't come close to bringing that much money in throughout the year. We've got a 9400 IH now that does all the work the ton did, hauls 50-60 loads of gravel for our own use and sale, hauls firewood comercially, hauls our silage and grain, and a few other odd jobs. We've got about 15 grand in the truck, 10 of which was for the tractor itself before I stripped it and mounted the box on it.
Sure.... I need a CDL to drive it, and there's more hassle from the DOT, but it still made life a lot easier, and it's far less money to maintain... UNTIL something major blows in the drivetrain. That's the one downside, but I don't anticipate much going wrong there so long as it's looked after a bit.
I remember having the same argument with the old man about going to tandems. He didn't want to. He still doesn't want it. He'll argue until he's blue in the face that a single axle gas with a trailing axle would be better and cheaper to run and blah blah blah. It boils down to one simple fact. HE doesn't want a tandem and doesn't want to drive a tandem. Period. If only his pencil could show he's right, I might listen...
I s'pose everyones situation is different, but here the twin screw is the only way to go. It's just more economical 'here'.

Rod

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the Unforgiven

11-03-2007 09:39:50




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to Tradititonal Farmer, 11-03-2007 08:54:38  
Hey, make no mistake, I hear you as I am a "gardener" myself. I only have one quarter to raise crops, and the harsh reality is that I can make more by working for someone else while a "real" farmer harvests for me with a big combine and semis. Working by myself with my little straight truck and L2 combine just is not cost efficient anymore. Now it does not help that a local "big" farmer bought the local elevator for his own personal use, that one really set the nails in my one-man museum style operation, the only real elevator is 20 miles away. I would love to farm the whole place with an F30 and a five foot carpet beater, in my mind it is a romantic notion but it is just not cost-effective.

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buickanddeere

11-03-2007 07:01:51




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Every fall there are some old beater trucks or school bus chassis with a gravity bin baling wired on. And a slow moving sign hung from the back somewhere. These smoking one headlight wonders complete with a couple blocks of wood for a parking brake are found waiting inline at the area grain elevators.



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Spook

11-03-2007 06:16:27




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Lets see, Ya get on an OLD tractor site, populated by OLD guys who like OLD stuff, are you surprised that they don't agree with ya? BTW, I think in a battle of wits, yer half armed....



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Spook

11-03-2007 06:15:53




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Lets see, Ya get on an OLD tractor site, populated by OLD guys who like OLD stuff, are you surprised that they don't agree with ya? BTW, I think in a battle of wits, yer half armed....



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35A

11-03-2007 18:48:06




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to Spook, 11-03-2007 06:15:53  
Well Said!!!!



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the tractor vet

11-03-2007 06:13:34




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Now i really want to get in the middle of this but myself i do not like juice brakes on anything bigger then a pickup . How many times do you here i can't stop my truck or if i pump my pedal three times it gets hard or i can't get brake pedal i have bleed and bleed and still no brakes . I use to work on them and i know how . The thing about alot of farm trucks is that they were never set up wright from the start To light of steering axle to light of rear axle and not enough brakes and no DUAL brakeing system . IF ya blow a line you have no brakes and the E brake on the drive shaft sure ain't going to stop ya . YEa they are cheap at the sales but they sure aren't cheap to keep running and road safe. Now this is my idea of a good farm truck , like i said MY idea . A tandem axle with atleast 44000 lbs rears atleast a 16000 steering axel at least 300 hp. under the hood nothing less then a 8 speed LL trans and a jake brake .

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Dr phil

11-03-2007 05:31:02




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
Did someone p in your corn flakes this AM? May be a CHANGE OF JOB is in order (burger king etc)



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MNredfarmer

11-03-2007 05:30:28




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
I don't know, around here it isn't worth it to go out and buy larger wagons if you are a smaller farmer. A 10 year old 365 Demco will sell for more than it cost new, around $3,200-3,600. A couple year old 550 will be around $7,000. A 650 will be about $8,000-8,500. A 10 year old J&M 500 bushell wagon sold on auction this fall for $5,800. Every situation is differant and it's always easier to spend someone else's money, isn't it?

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Uncle Ernie

11-03-2007 04:56:32




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
You are the only wrench in a truck dealership that will work on two ton trucks and you are calling OTHERS stupid? Your opinion is just that ,yours.Others have the right to theirs too. (Mine is that if you were hauling grain with tractors TEN miles its no wonder you USED to farm.) If you don't want to work on something , don't! You will be WAY happier in the end! On the other hand work is work so be glad to have it. Wake up and smell the coffee buddy! Remember when you point your finger , there are three fingers pointing back at you!!

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Tradititonal Farmer

11-03-2007 05:05:33




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to Uncle Ernie, 11-03-2007 04:56:32  
It never fails that those that USED to farm,have a grand dad that farmed,had a uncle that farmed etc etc ALWAYS think they know more about farming than those that are actually making a living at it.



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iowa_tire_guy

11-03-2007 04:51:44




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
For my business and personally when I need parts the dealership is that last place I go. NAPA or others seem to have what I need delivered to my door at less money. Just because IH, Ford and GM has abandoned their equipment doesn't mean that if there is a need someone won't be there to fill it.



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poogie

11-03-2007 03:26:09




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
A good mechanic likes a challenge. You should be pleased that you are the only one in the shop capable of working on gasoline engines and hydraulic brakes. Being able to work on the more challenging jobs is the best form of job security. Heavy truck mechanics are easy to find but someone of your experience and capability is very rare and can demand higher pay.



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Tom43

11-03-2007 09:43:40




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to poogie, 11-03-2007 03:26:09  
I love old trucks just like I love old tractors. There is absolutely nothing on my old trucks and combines that I can't fix myself. This gives me a tremdous amout of security and independence. I know several farmers that use well maintained older machinery that can buy or sell people with new semis and new combines. My hero is Alan in Nebraska!



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Are you

11-03-2007 03:15:28




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 Re: tis the season for junk farm trucks part 2 in reply to johndeerejon, 11-03-2007 00:13:18  
sure you've calmed down??



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