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7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump

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francis pawelek

04-07-2007 20:19:26

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hi again,well she ran good for about 5 minutes again,but i either keep getting air in my injector pump,or either the pump is bad,yesterday,i pulled all lines loose,blew them out,blew air into fuel tank,put on new filters and filled them 1st,primed all up full,blewd the injectors,then the top fuel line,the tractor starts up good,but then starts losing power,then when i crack the side 1/2 inch nut on the injector pump it seems to run very well,but then it goes bad again,can anyone point me in the right direction?i think i tried everything

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jdemaris

04-08-2007 07:00:28

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to francis pawelek, 04-07-2007 20:19:26

Somebody that knows what they are doing can fix the pump (on the bench) in an hour and often $50 - $100 in parts. If you don't know anybody, guess you'll need to send out. That pump is kind of an odd-ball. I used to work in a pump-shop at at Deere dealership - but most Roosamaster/Standadyne pumps Deere used were C/CB/CDC or D/DB series. You've got a JDC - not used on many machines. The part that has failed in your pump has a much more durable update available - for the D/DB/DB2 pumps. But, your's is kind of odd because it has splines. If you send out - ask if an updated EID kit is available for it.

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francis pawelek

04-08-2007 07:08:17

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris, 04-08-2007 07:00:28

but you think its out right?i found this kit to fix them last nite on ebay,its only 29.00,think i need that too,i believe its got the orings only,and all new washers,
is that symptoms of a pump gone bad sir?ever seen my tractor on this site,its a mint condition jd 7020 with triples on it,check it out someday,thanks

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jdemaris

04-08-2007 07:29:06

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to francis pawelek, 04-08-2007 07:08:17

Those Ebay kits are no "great deal." Very little on Ebay is. Regular everyday price on those kits is around $12. Comes with all the seals and the new pellathane ring that is broken in your pump. I can almost guarantee you - that you will . . . at least need a new "pilot tube" which is the bronze bushing in the front of the pump where the two umbrella shaft-seals ride. You can buy a new bushing for around $5. I bought a few new Stanadyne kits a few weeks ago using Spaco aftermarket brand. I've used Spaco for years - every bit a good as OEM Stanadyne.

Prices are: JDB seal kit - Stanadyne # 24371 - Spaco U24371 $12.10 JDB pilot tube - Stanadyne # 16320 - Spaco U16320 $4.83

Service tools that Deere used to sell (no longer) include:

Wrench for taking out head-screw #15499 Adapter for test-port on DB2 pumps - for transferpump - 21900
Delivery valve retractor - 13383
DB timing window - 13366
DB umbrella seal compressor - 13371

I have many sources to buy them dirt cheap. The only tool you may need to get your pump apart is the "Bristol" wrench - Deere and/or Roosamster part # #15499. You can probably buy it for around $10. If you can't buy one, or borrow one - I can lend you one.

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francis pawelek

04-08-2007 19:11:49

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris, 04-08-2007 07:29:06

hey jdemaris,i was messing with my tractor about an hour ago,it seems when i crack open that 1/2 inch nut on the side of the injector pump,it seems to rev up pretty good i went ahead and let it run and did that a few times,anyway,the last time i did it under higher rpms,it ran for about 15 minutes straight without having to crack open that bolt,a buddy of mine at edgars farm shop here told me my injector pump has to be good if it runs the tractor,the rest is aqn air problem,i keep seeing bubbles around where the injectors mount in the head,,i myself think thats where the trouble is at,do you know what size of a 12 point wrench is needed to be made to get to it and tighten them tighter?i'm thinking theres a bad o ring in both now,or just loose,what do you think sir?

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jdemaris

04-08-2007 20:11:28

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to francis pawelek, 04-08-2007 19:11:49

Your friend's comment "injector pump has to be good if it runs the tractor" is, more-or-less, nonsense. With the Stanadyne/Roosmaster pump it is common, when the pump first starts to fail, to run for awhile, quit, and then run again. No offense intended - to you or him, but it's nonsense just the same. That being said - and injection pump can not operate correct if it's getting air on the suction side - i.e. between the injection pump and fuel tank. But a leak on the high-pressure side - like at your injector lines or injectors will having nothing to do with your problem. In regard to injectors leaking where they go into the heads - that's pretty common. some injectors seal with teflon sealing rings, some with copper washers. If the leak got real bad, you'd get a small compression leak and it would start hissing as the engine was running - but would hardly effect the way it runs.

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francis pawelek

04-09-2007 07:02:58

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris, 04-08-2007 20:11:28

would you like to redo it for me?what would it take?

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jdemaris@usadatanet.net

04-09-2007 07:50:56

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to francis pawelek, 04-09-2007 07:02:58

No thanks. First of all, I can't even get close to caught up fixing my own equipment - too many projects - too little time. I've got a one of my dozers and backhoes apart in my shop. Also a diesel pickup - and I don't work every night 'till midnight like I used to. And if spring ever gets here - I've got some plowing, disking, and planting to do (it's snowing right now,though).

Also - with injection pumps - when I do fix them for other people, I only do it when the entire machine is local - so if there are more problems and/or complaints - I can hear it run. Lots of problems are often blamed on injection pumps when they are NOT the problem, and many things are blamed on other things when the pump IS the problem.

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francis pawelek

04-09-2007 19:22:28

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris@usadatanet.net, 04-09-2007 07:50:56

REMEMBER THE TINY VALVE WITH A BALL IN IT????
ok i was told by a mechanic to remove in,and run it with out it but using a screwed in fitting with the return line hooked on it,there fore bypassing the little 1 inch valve with the 1/8 inch ends,,,i pulled it off and tractor gained all its power back,its called wear in the governor inside the pump,i was charged 22.00 but it was ok i would have given 100.00 if i'd been chargewd that,its worth it,runs awesome again.,remember that forever

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jdemaris

04-09-2007 21:05:09

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to francis pawelek, 04-09-2007 19:22:28

Yeah - the recommendation to do that has been explained here many times. If you run the pump too long like that, it will self-destruct beyond repair. May take a few weeks, or maybe a few months. It's up to you if it's worth ruining a pump over. Now that the plastic is broken inside the pump, and you've cleared the return flow so it will run again - you've got two metal parts inside the pump slamming together. Eventually, the metal will come loose, run through the pump, and ruin the head & rotor assembly.

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francis pawelek

04-10-2007 09:38:55

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris, 04-09-2007 21:05:09

i'm looking into another pump already,,with the throttle linkag shaft on the opposite side of mine can it be switched to the other side with no trouble you think?

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jdemaris

04-10-2007 11:19:20

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to francis pawelek, 04-10-2007 09:38:55

Yes, the shaft pieces are just held in by a little push-on clip. You have to pull the top-cover off to get to the clip.

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Bob

04-10-2007 11:24:38

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris, 04-10-2007 11:19:20

Just be SURE of what pump you are getting... rotation, fuel rate, and governed speed for starters.

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francis pawelek

04-10-2007 13:52:14

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to Bob, 04-10-2007 11:24:38

it came off a combine from jd,i know already that injector would work on a 4020,4320,and 4620,and other 404 engines,think it would make a lot of difference guys?
better yet who would you guys recommend to send mine to?

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francis pawelek

04-09-2007 10:49:54

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris@usadatanet.net, 04-09-2007 07:50:56

well i really appreciate the time you took discussing this problem,i see where you are coming from too,it is better to have it up there and i cant blame you either,little by little i'm like you,,blaming the inj pump when it might be an air bubble trapped too,i'll keep playing with it but will get it tested too i'm sure,talk at you soon i hope,francis

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francis pawelek

04-08-2007 13:09:20

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to jdemaris, 04-08-2007 07:29:06

hey would you redo my pump if i paid you for time and parts too?what would you charge me around total?i could send it tomorrow maybe,and money in the box and shipping back in box too,or call in a while,i'm doing nothing today but watching my 7020 look at me,,boy i'd rather be driving it around,i got the pump out already
heres my #361-562-1720,francis

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Bob

04-07-2007 21:56:33

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to francis pawelek, 04-07-2007 20:19:26

You have an early 7020 with a Roosa-Master pump; right?

Besides a the possibility of a restriction or air leak on the supply side of the injection pump; there is another possibility.

The fuel return fitting/housing pressure regulator valve in the pump's top cover may be clogged by chunks of broken up dark plastic from the governor damper ring deep inside the injection pump.

The valve/fitting is key #13 in the diagram.

Disconnect the return line, remove the complete fitting/valve, and check for the chunks of crud. If present, you've found the problem.

There is a spring-loaded glass ball in there, and, being carefull not to break it, you can dig out the crud, and blow the remainder out with compressed air.

The tractor should start and run, but you will need to find the time and money to get the IP OH'ed, as once enough of the plastic ring breaks up, there is no longer and cushion between 2 metal parts in the governor, and they begin to vibrate together and wear sloughing off metal filings into the pump.

Another guy with a similar problem...

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francis pawelek

04-08-2007 07:17:46

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Re: 7020 john deere rossi master fuel pump in reply to Bob, 04-07-2007 21:56:33

well bob,before it gets bad from cleanbing it out i think i'll just pull it off and send it in to get rebuilt,want me to send it to you?thanks sir

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