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Diesel Engines

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Raleigh

02-15-2007 18:31:39




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Worked on a few gas engines but this is my first with a diesel. Why is it bad for a diesel to idle for extended periods of time and this not be a problem for a gasser? A gas engine build up carbon too? But Idleing does not hurt it??




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Allan In NE

02-16-2007 18:05:31




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 Re: TA in reply to PJBROWN, 02-16-2007 17:53:13  
Naw, don't you believe it. Green is the only way to go.

I've been watchin' the market and it seems the fun has kind of gone out of the old John Deere party as of late. We just gotta get those greenies back up there to that 300 percent over-inflated price.

I mean, it's a prestige thing, ya know. :>)

Allan



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jdemaris

02-16-2007 05:37:25




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Raleigh, 02-15-2007 18:31:39  
Seems it must vary with the make and type of diesel engine. I know that in the far north - during the winter when temps. rarely get above minus-30 - they leave the diesels running all winter, night and day. How it effects the lives of the engines - I don't know - but I assume shutting them down and trying to restart at fifty below is worse. The EPA is trying to make it illegal for large diesel trucks to idle in many locations - that because those diesels run inefficiently at idle and put out extra emmissions. I have several Detroit Diesels - that once hot - will barely have any oil pressure at hot idle - maybe 2 or 3 PSI. They run fine otherwise - but I assume long idling for them is not a great idea. One side-note - that doesn't prove anything - but still kind of funny. A friend of mine who was trucking goats with an 87 Chevy diesel Suburban - got down to market in New Jersey and it would not shut off. Someone tried to help by pulling the wire off the injection pump - but it kept on running. He said the heck with it, and left if running for four days - mostly idling. When he got back home - I bought it from him. I fixed it and drove it to 520,000 miles on - when the crankshaft finally broke into three pieces. When I stripped the engine for any parts I might save - all looked fine inside (other than a broken crank and cracked block). Combustion chambers were amazingly clean for a 6.2 diesel with over 500K on it. And one more side-note. I bought a 86 Chevy diesel Blazer from the local water-department. It was used for driving around town at 10-20 MPH it's entire life - to check water-meters and such. Most of the time- it sat with the engine idling - they rarely shut it off. I bought it with 70K on the odometer and who nows how many idling-engine-hours. I was worried it would blow-up as soon as I started using it hard. It's now got 320,000 miles on it and runs great.

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Hugh MacKay

02-16-2007 03:39:14




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Raleigh, 02-15-2007 18:31:39  
Raleigh: From my point of view, depends what you call idling. If it's down around 500-600, shut it off. 700-900 I'll go along with, keeps them warmed up a bit, and if they have more than a few hours on them, they will lubricate better.

Another factor is idling after doing "WHAT". If your warming it up in cold weather, to go to work, I'd far sooner start the whole tractor or truck operating at 1000-1200. Diesels just never warm up if left idling at low idle.

If your idling down after some real work, by all means it should cool down a bit at 800. There is however no point in doing that for more than 2-3 min. After than shut it down, your just burning fuel, plus that diesel will hold it's heat 2-3 hours anyhow. Why in the summer months, those 400+ cubic inch engines will hold their heat overnight. Many times I've gone to my 1066 in the morning and could still feel a bit of heat in block.

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Allan In NE

02-16-2007 01:43:50




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Raleigh, 02-15-2007 18:31:39  
The biggest thing, Raleigh, is don't get into the habit of startin' it up cold and using it for short little jobs. That's what wears the goofy things out.

Always plug that heater in for an hour or two in cool weather. Better yet, if it's gonna be a chore tractor, just leave 'er plugged in when not in use.

Idle it all ya want. You're not going to hurt that old bear. The John Deeres aren't nearly as bad about the slobberin' exhaust as the IHs are and that's about the only thing you'll notice.

Allan

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DonLC

02-16-2007 14:04:32




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Allan In NE, 02-16-2007 01:43:50  
...I have a Dodge Sprinter van, built in Germany by Mercedes.....it has a 158HP diesel engine with turbo ....2500 3/4 ton,it out performs the other vans made today, I love it....question it takes it to long to get warm,normal is 180 f.....but in cold or even cool weather it takes 7 miles for it to get to 180.....should I cover part of the radiator?



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Steven@AZ

02-15-2007 19:33:33




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Raleigh, 02-15-2007 18:31:39  
If it's going to idle for more than 5 minutes or so, kick the throttle up to around 1200 to 1300 RPM.

Especially in cold weather, the wax in diesel fuel will accumulate in the cylinders at a slow idle. Many older diesels will also slobber unburned fuel out the exhaust in colder weather at idle.

Dodge mechanic had this to say about my bro's 06 Cummins, "If it's going to idle for more than 2 minutes, shut it off. Not designed to idle."

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IaGary

02-15-2007 18:52:34




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Raleigh, 02-15-2007 18:31:39  
High idleing they can run all year.

The high idleing is to keep them a little warmer.

I would rather idle a diesel longer than a gasser.

Raleigh if you don't quit worrying so much your gonna have a heart attack over your tractor.

I don't know what you are using your tractor for but I bet it ain't going to hurt it one bit to idle it for 2 hours every time you start it.



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higgins

02-16-2007 13:26:20




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to IaGary, 02-15-2007 18:52:34  
He 'bout gave me a stroke over the smoking when he got it home.....



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Gene Davis (GA)

02-15-2007 18:35:37




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Raleigh, 02-15-2007 18:31:39  
The biggest problem with idling diesel engines for a long time is that they tend to run too cool and as a result you have incomplete combustion and fuel dilution in crankcase oil, and slobbering out the exhaust. you need to work a diesel hard and long to keep it running the best.



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Gus

02-16-2007 03:36:53




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Gene Davis (GA), 02-15-2007 18:35:37  
Is that why my powerstroke starts to scream in cold weather if I let it idle? Sounds like a 747 taking off. Had it for 7 years and never knew the real reason. Probably says in the manual somewhere.



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Bob M

02-16-2007 05:27:36




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Gus, 02-16-2007 03:36:53  
Yes!

The Powerstroke under cold conditions (oil and coolant below certain temperatures, has been idling >2 minutes, transmission is in Park, etc) causes the engine computer to put it into "cold idle" mode. This increases the idle speed to 1,100 RPM and closes a back pressure valve in the exhaust outlet. These combine to make the engine to warm quickly and stay warm.

The restriction of backpressure valve is what gives the exhaust that 747-like roar you hear. Unfortunately also it causes the engine to burn more fuel at idle. But it DOES warm the engine up quickly!

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PatMz

02-16-2007 09:19:54




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 Thanks Bob and Allan in reply to Bob M, 02-16-2007 05:27:36  
My '04 SuperDuty is so blankin' loud when it's below about 10 degrees I can't hear Rush on the radio! So, it ain't all bad.



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Bob M

02-16-2007 12:13:35




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 Re: Thanks Bob and Allan in reply to PatMz, 02-16-2007 09:19:54  
Indeed! And when it's really cold and there's no wind, it sends an impressive plume of white exhaust condensation a good 30 feet sideways from the right rear of the truck...



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Animal

02-16-2007 05:19:22




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 Re: Diesel Engines in reply to Gus, 02-16-2007 03:36:53  
Hey Gus, what you are hearing is the turbo dumping when it is cold.



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