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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

SkidSteer Or Hydro ???

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T_Bone

12-25-2006 20:02:39




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Merry Christmas All

I'm getting ready to handle a million pounds of clay, ie; I'm building a new shop and house out of concrete blocks and need a loader/forklift to accomplish the task.

I've been looking at skidsteers and have several questions. I'm thinking I want to stay with popular brand and that seams to be Bobcat. I will probably resell the unit when done then again maybe not. I want a minimum of 1500# lift and more like 2000# so a 9k plus machine.

I'm also thinking of staying with the older mechanical/hydraulic machines as dirt and electronics can't be good. Comments?

I see alot of 900hr to 1400hr machines for sale. Is there a problem with these machines achiving higher hours like in the 5000hr class without extreme maintance costs?

Is there a high dollar maintance item I'm failing to see or consider? I'm comfortable with the common ware items.

In general, are these machines more likely to break down when comparred to a hydro-tractor loader?

There seams to be a glut of mini-tracks available right now, mostly larger machines, 86hp or so and in the 2001 or newer class. Is there a problem with the tracks VS the wheel loaders. Tracks would appear to be ruff riding?

I can always look for a hydro tractor with a loader but I'm thinking a skidsteer would be of more use for what I need?

T_Bone

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oleblu

12-26-2006 15:58:32




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
I sure won"t debate the virtues of any skidsteer with anyone, but the ones with the pedals on the floor are not easy to use. I stand over 6"6" and with my long legs it"s almost impossable to work the pedals. The style (like Case uses) with ALL the controls on the hand levers is the only way I can go. Even when buckeled in I want to brace my feet against the floor when she starts "bucking" and don"t want to dump my load because the pedals are on the floor.

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RodInNS

12-26-2006 15:13:20




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
T_Bone,

No doubt there are many opinions on skid steers. I've got a NewHolland LS170 which I'm generally happy with. It's got over 2500 hours on it now, and hasn't been overly well maintained. I've done most of the wheel bearings (3 I think), and the splines on the reduction gears and motor drive shaft stripped out a couple years ago, so I got to change all that stuff out, along with the chains on that side. One problem I've found with that machine was that the final drives are not well protected to abraision from the ground, so if it's dragging around in the mud (which I do a lot of), it wears the bottom of the final drive, right through, and loses it's oil. That's the source of a lot of the problems I've had. One of these days I will get around to reinforcing the patches... That problem could be true of a lot of machines though....
Beyond that, I love the lift ability, stability, rear visibility, and the general handeling characteristics of the machine. It's very versatile. I've also run older Thomas machines, and there was no comparison to the NH. Also beware of Thomas, because they will be cheap, and probably not supported anymore, as the company ceased manufacturing several months ago.
Beyond that, try out several machines. See which ones you like, and which controls you like or can live with. Personally I prefer the foot controls that I have. They take some getting used to, but I'd rather them to hand controls. Only thing I find with foot controls is that it can be a lot on your lower legs if you spend the whole day in the machine.
Also, I think tracks would simplify the machine, and make it more stable. I wouldn't hesitate to at least try one. Good luck.

Rod

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Larry NE IL

12-26-2006 10:47:14




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
T-Bone, don't shy from the electronics, theyre great and last. Beware of used machines. In the3 excavating business, cutting grade was our business and all machines were greased every time they are used. In the concrete, or underground side, most of the machines never are greased or maintained very well. 1500 hours is a LOT of hours for a skid steer. Although tougher built these days, the older models just didn't stand up to everyday heavy use on a regular basis. We always traded around 1500 hours.
Tracked machines are great, tracks usually run about 1200 to 1500 hours.

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P Backus

12-26-2006 06:39:52




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
Skids are funny. Everyone has their favorite, and will fiercely defend it. I"m a Case guy-I can control it like another hand. I have run several other brands enough hours to know and to me there"s no comparison. Others will disagree. They haven"t standardized the control systems for skids, so you have to go with what"s the easiest for you- hand controls, foot controls, Gehl style controls, etc.
Skids tend to be higher maintainance machines, and a bit more difficult to access the maintainance items. When they get higher hours, you can have shaft splines wearing out, and wheel bearings going out and housings worn where the bearing race goes as well as hydro pumps and motors, etc.
As far as electronic on equipment- I felt the same way you did- electronics and farm/construction equipment are a bad mix. However, the machinery that I"ve run with electric controls has impressed me, even after higher hours. Very reliable, with a few exceptions- AGCO equipment being one of them- but that"s just my experience.
Paul

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krazy-ken

12-26-2006 06:07:59




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
Sold a tractor with loader and got a Gehl 5635.I will never be without a skid steer. KEN



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jhill52

12-26-2006 05:53:16




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
T_Bone,
FOr once we get to help you. Usually it is the other way around. Used skid steers are like everything else, you get what you pay for. If you can find a well maintained machine it will give you good service. I currently have a 5575 Deere I use in my excavating business. It is a mechanical machine. I bought it with 1500 hrs and so far after 200 hrs it has given me good service. It is the vertical lift and I like that. Also like the New Holland it has a longer wheelbase which makes them more stable. They do however scuff up the dirt more. A skid steer is much handier than either a Hydro - tractor or a telelift as you can turn on a dime and you can get an attachment to do anything. Rent attachments you only need a couple times. I have a set of forks and don't know how I lived without them.

If you buy a skid steer you will never sell it.

hope this helps

Jerry

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JCSinGA

12-26-2006 05:30:34




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
A skid steer for the most part is a skid steer may be some that have fancier doodads than others but thats not important. I too cannot stand all the electrics that are on any equipment today, the benefits seem to be short term as alot of money has to be spent to keep them up long term.
I'm partial to a Bobcat but only because I worked for a dealership for a while. Parts and service is great on a B/C, but would assume the same on other major brand names.
When I worked for the dealer fully 90% of late model G series machines that came to the shop were for electrical.
I'd like to have a mid to late 90's 863 C or F series the G series is when they went nuts with computer and electronic controls.
Believe an 863 is rated for 2200# lift but it's not a 9k machine.
Hour numbers are like any other machine it depends on the amount of service and PM done, I've had to pull drive pumps and motors at 1500 hrs. then I've saw them with 3000+ still preforming great. These will be the most expensive items to consider.
Track machines are great but I cant seem to justify the price difference. They do ride rough but they dont buck like a wheeled machine.
Skid steers are as handy as a pocket on a shirt, with all the attachments available they can do about anything.

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2x4

12-26-2006 02:22:14




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
you can't go wrong with a rubber track ASV if you can get one. I have 2810. Rubber tracks give a really smooth ride. With my bad back I know. Only drawback I know; when you put it on a trailer the back glass may blow out especially if front glass is up. Bind the glass on a traler & you cant beat'em.



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davpal

12-25-2006 22:04:57




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
Take a look at the big skytracks they have now. Those are strong enough to pick up pallets of shingles without breathing hard and can set it on a roof. Actually a skytrack could probably set a bobcat up on a roof if you wanted to. They are really amazing.



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old

12-25-2006 20:53:38




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
Most all skid steers have there good points and there bad points. Bobcats are good and so is case and JDs. Now as far as ride, you ever been on a horse that likes to buck?? If so then you know how they can be if you do the right thing at the wrong time or is the the wrong thing at the right time. Skid steers are ruff rideing no matter which you you get. Also if you do get one NEVER take the cage off and run it and ALWAYS wear a seat belt when on it. I found out the hard way and almost ended up out in front of one when it did a noise dive on me and it didn't have a seat belt, it does now.

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Sam from WA

12-25-2006 20:35:09




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
The way i see it, you ought to go with an older hydrostatic skidsteer. theres a lot less to wear out on a hydro skid loader and good luck finding parts for an older mechanical skid loader. we are running a Bobcat 722 hydrostatic that is about 1980's vintage. it is a gas, but it gets the job done. we have use it for feeding cows every morning and scraping every Saturday for the last 20 some years ever since it was new.

I was helping a guy a while ago and we had rented a Bobcat 753. something must have snagged a wire that controlled the brakes because we could activate the machine, but we couldn't go anywhere. we ended up dragging it out of the way with our John Deere 2955 loader tractor. If i were you, i would try to steer clear of a brand new skid steer because of the electronics. our old 722 has never had the drivetrain apart in the 26 years we've owned it. the only thing that doesn't work is the hand brake, but we don't need it. try to get an older skid steer that doesn't have all the electronics. I have run almost every brand of skid loader, and i would recomend something like a Bobcat 743, a Case 1845C, or a John Deere 6675. Happy hunting. Hope i was of help to you.

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Davis In SC

12-25-2006 20:34:29




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to T_Bone, 12-25-2006 20:02:39  
Merry Christmas to you & yours, T_Bone.. I always enjoyed reading your posts...

As far as Skid-Steers go, I think that used Bobcats get way overpriced.. Several years ago, I bought a used Skid-Steer from a friend, it is a ScatTrak ... 1800 lb lift, 86 HP Perkins, real nice machine.. only had 1000 hours, for less than Bobcats that were worn out.. Scat Trak is now owned & supported by Volvo..

I think you can get the best deal by looking for a Scat Trak, Case, or a Gehl.. HTH

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thejdman01

12-26-2006 16:31:54




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to Davis In SC, 12-25-2006 20:34:29  
A shoot boom may be up your alley. They are called telescoping for lifts, or telehandlers. Google them, can put buckets forks etc on them. Never really took off in the farm application but coudl work for you

Only thing a shoot boom really wont do is backhoe (like you can get for a skid steer. ) Maybe try to vind a vintage jd 3, 4 or 510 back hoe those are awsome



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thejdman01

12-26-2006 16:28:47




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 Re: SkidSteer Or Hydro ??? in reply to Davis In SC, 12-25-2006 20:34:29  
Bobcats get the name recognition and usually are overpriced. cases 1845's are decent machines but usually sell for a premium. JOhn deeere would be my vote, good machines usally over looked. A skid steer is just as everything else, like a loader, tractor. Maintenance is everything. Pins on buckets and loader arms. Most motors and hydraulic pumps SHOULD last more then 1500 hours but as weverything else if contaminated oil, no maintenace they break. And as w/tractors they are very expensive. Hydraulic hookups are a love/hate deal for me. Usally the auxillary hookups mean that they are high flow machines ie bigger hydraulic pumps and better/ bigger coolers. The only problem with that is if they have the quick tach on the front that means they were USUALLY on a cold planer or jackhammer. Whatever you do never buy a skid that ran a jackhammer or cold planer or the like because the vibration and the pounding just beat the machines. Terribly that vibration all day long tears them up. Also depending on how far your shed is away form what your doing grading long driveways etc might look for 2 spds (high and low for faster travel), also if doing alot of ground work maybe a float position. Most come w/that now a days but something to look for.

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