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Two cycle gasoline engines

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clyde in oregon

02-21-2006 19:17:05

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I was just wondering if any tractor manufactures or engine builders ever expieremented with the two stroke gasoline engines. Did any tractors have such a setup?

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BLW

02-22-2006 07:33:24

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

we had 6 of the DKW's very efficent and powerful- they made mototcycles first- but they did exp. with other applications- I'm not sure if they did tractors but I think they tried- get in touch w/ the DKW club in calif. also about valves - there was at least one chain saw ( my grandfather had one we used in the woods logging) I can't remember the name right off the bat, but it had a rotary valve instead of the ports-- it was heavy and had about a 36" bar at least-- I think it might have been a MALL BLW

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jdemaris

02-22-2006 12:34:00

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to BLW, 02-22-2006 07:33:24

There used to be quite a few two-stroke cycle engines with the roto-port design. It usually used a crankshaft weight to seal against a hole in the crankcase. They tended to have sealing problems though, and once the surface of the port got scored, they became hard starting.

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jdemaris

02-22-2006 06:34:11

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

I've owned several cars that had two-stroke cycle engines. As the other guy mentioned, Saab was one of them. I also had a 1962 DKW with an oil tank in the glove compartment. Also a Subaru 360.

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Saab

02-22-2006 05:22:02

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

had a three cylinder import back in the 60's. Funny looking thing that you had to put a qt. of 30wND oil in the gas tank every time you filled it up. If I remember correctly it had a 4 speed transmission with the shifter on the column.

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Dan in Ore

02-22-2006 04:33:11

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

Clyde,

I know I saw a two-cycle (one-lunger) gas engine several years ago. Not sure of the brand, but it was a pretty big engine. Also the Wade and Vaughan drag saws were two-cycle.
BTW, where are you in Oregon?

Dan

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J. Schwiebert

02-22-2006 03:59:18

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

There is a full ported 2 cylce gas engine not far from here that runs a natural gas compressor. It is a V-16 and is eleven thousand horsepower, so yes engine builders did build them.

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J. Schwiebert

02-22-2006 04:01:11

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to J. Schwiebert, 02-22-2006 03:59:18

I forgot one line, it is natural gas not gasoline, after all the natural gas company owns the engine.

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big jt

02-21-2006 22:53:47

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

Hart Parr Little Devil

The concept was good. No Diferential, No gears to grind (one speed forward one reverse).

Tractor was reversed by changing the direction of the engine. Thus the Two Cycle. Only problem was when trying to move slowly like backing up to a implement the engine had a tendancy to reverse on it's own. They were supposed to be all recalled but some slipped through the cracks. That's how one ended up in the museum in Charles City.

After this failed attempt they came out with the New Hart Parr which is what most of us think of when the name is mentioned without Oliver.

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mlm

02-21-2006 21:15:23

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

Some Russian cars had two cycle gasoline engines. Don't know if they put them in tractors.

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mlm

02-21-2006 21:14:34

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

Some Russian cars had two cycle engines. Don't know if they put them in tractors.

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Jerry/MT

02-21-2006 20:36:23

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

I don't know if they experimented with them but for the technology available in the 40's and early 50's they were just not efficient. You loose some fuel/air mix on the compression until you pass the exhaust port. The two stroke diesels avoided that problem by only loosing air in the scavenge part of the cycle since they were fuel injected. The air lost in the scavenge cycle was lost HP but it was a small number and there was no fuel loss. Evinrude (sp?) claims that their two stroke marine gas engines don't have that scavenge loss and are cleaner then equivalent four strokes, that so maybe the have technology available today to get better efficiency especially the fuel injection systems. The diesel cycle with high compression ratios and attendent higher temperature give better thermal efficency which means better fuel economy. I doubt that a gasoline engine will beat that in a tractor application. Hope this answered your question.

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B-maniac

02-21-2006 20:01:10

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

You're right ,Mike,I must have had a brain fart when I said "intake" valves, but have we really answered Clydes original question?

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B-maniac

02-21-2006 19:38:28

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to clyde in oregon, 02-21-2006 19:17:05

I don't know of any "gas" 2 cycles but there were a few that came with 2 cycle diesels ( GM or Detroit Diesel 3-53 and 4-53). They weren't what you think of when you think of a 2 cycle engine though. They do have intake and exhaust valves and use a blower to move the air in and the exhaust out and fuel is injected.If you mean 2 cycle as in chain saws,motorcycles,snowmobiles etc with transfer ports instead of valves,I have never heard of any used in tractors.

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Jerry/MT

02-21-2006 20:17:54

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to B-maniac, 02-21-2006 19:38:28

The JD 435D (1959-1960)had a GM 2-53 diesel two stroke. in it. I believe that it was the only vehicle use for that engine. It was used mainly for pumps and generators I believe. Mine did not have intake valves. It had exhaust valves and a Roots blower that blew the air charge through some slots in the sleeve near the bottom. It was a good engine, stingy with fuel, but hard to start below 40F.

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MikeinKy

02-21-2006 19:44:41

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to B-maniac, 02-21-2006 19:38:28

I have worked on a few Detroit Diesels, I have yet to see a 2 stroke with intake valves. They have 4 exhaust valves per cylinder. They use a blower through ports in the cylinder wall for the intake.

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02-22-2006 14:10:36

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Re: Two cycle gasoline engines in reply to MikeinKy, 02-21-2006 19:44:41

2 strokes with intake valves? Search for 'Clark' cyle design. Tillers and lawntractors with 2stroke gas loopscavenged or Zollers noted in some references. Rotax and JLO engines noted for some utility and Ag use prior to tight pollution laws. As noted for big tractors you can find Detroit Diesel 2strokes. RN

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