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Battery Additives

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Richard H.

09-05-2005 07:21:20




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Not long ago there was a thread here about extending battery life by using something simple out of the house like vinegar ? We have some golf carts at our campground that could use a little help, to late in the season to be thinking of new batteries. any ideas? thanks Richard




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Dwight - VA

09-06-2005 03:55:05




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Richard H., 09-05-2005 07:21:20  
One thing you might try to extend life is to use a float charger. That's what I use on the deep cycle batteries in my basement. They are always fully charged and the float charger helps keep the sulfation down. I don't know about the snake oil...



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doogdoog

09-06-2005 13:07:09




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Dwight - VA, 09-06-2005 03:55:05  
Aloha, I bought a military generator and it had a dead 24v batt. I tried to charge it but it would only charge to 12v. I read an article somewhere to add an ounce of hydrogen peroxide to each cell so I drained the old acid and replaced it with new acid. I also added an ounce of hydrogen peroxide to each cell and it started to bubble a little and I left it like that overnight. The next day I hooked it up to my 24v charger and charged it for an hour. I measured the voltage and it came up to around 25+ volts because I didn't let it sit for an hour. I put the charger back on and charged it for about another 2 hrs and then took it off. I measured the voltage the next day and it was about 24.5v or so. It worked for me but I also read that it will not work for all dead batteries.

Mahalo,
doogdoog

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buickanddeere

09-06-2005 00:10:08




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Richard H., 09-05-2005 07:21:20  
best not to let the batteries run too low on charge or too low of electrolyte level. And use only demin or distilled water.



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Rlach

09-05-2005 16:43:07




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Richard H., 09-05-2005 07:21:20  
I would not try hydrogen peroxide; no recipes were given... anyway don't use over 3 %; why ? let say hydogen peroxides 30 % and over are very strong oxidizers and dead batteries produce plenty of hydrogen; if hydrogen reacts with the oxidixer it explodes. Beware of hydrogen, oxidizers and sparks.
Years ago they used glycerine in battery manufacturing; one told me that a tea spoon of glycerine per cell could help to reduce battery deterioration but I don't believe it rejuvenates a dead battery.
Rlach

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Chem tech

09-05-2005 18:04:10




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Rlach, 09-05-2005 16:43:07  
If hydrogen reacts with oxygen ,it produces water and water does not explode.



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Rlach

09-06-2005 02:08:07




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Chem tech, 09-05-2005 18:04:10  
YES it does; it is the principle of fuel cell; this is the principle of Space shuttle or Saturn 5 or any rocket using liquid hydrogen; this is also the warning in any motor vehicle book using lead-acid batteries, if one produces a sparks over a charging or discharging batteries, hydrogen could be ignited by oxygen and water is produced and it explodes. This warning is serious.
Rlach



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bubba 2

09-05-2005 18:00:33




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Rlach, 09-05-2005 16:43:07  
So don't try it but don't say it is unsafe or doesn't work without trying it.I have only been doing it for about 20 years. And it is H2 O2 and has one free oxygen molecule.And that is why it will turn your hair white.It oxidizes the color pigmentation.That is why it works.It does bubble a bit when the O2 is added to the battery AND the receipe was given :---1 (one)OUNCE per cell PER year!But even that is not critical.Any free and unmarried oxygen will simply vanish in thin air.

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Rlach

09-06-2005 02:33:54




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to bubba 2, 09-05-2005 18:00:33  
1- What is the principle ? everybody knows that hydrogen peroxide is an oxidizer but my question is how a strong oxidizer can extend the battery life of a lead-acid battery ? 2- Normally a cell is ruined when the material isolating plus and minus plates is deteriorated ; how a strong oxidizer like H2O2 can decrease the rate of isolating material deterioration ? 3- You wrote one once per cell per year but what concentration of H2O2 should be used (3 %, 10 %, 30 %, 60 %) ?
Thanks
Rlach

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havvey

09-05-2005 14:49:43




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Richard H., 09-05-2005 07:21:20  
My opinion is all those potions may work for a short time. A new battery/proper charging system is the correct answer. i get 3-5 years out of mine and charge them month in the off season, yes extream heat and vibration is a problem.



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bubba2

09-05-2005 08:55:55




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Richard H., 09-05-2005 07:21:20  
Not snake oil.It works plain and simple.Add an ounce of hydrogen peroxide per cell annually.Hydrogen peroxide is 02 and is very unstable.The free O molecule will marry up with the sulphate and change it back to H2SO4,cleaning the plates in the process.It won't always restore a dead battery,but will work on some.Cost ya less than a buck to find out.



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Rlach

09-06-2005 02:51:58




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to bubba2, 09-05-2005 08:55:55  
PbSO4 + H2O2 does not change to H2SO4; PbSO4 plus a good battery charger will do, changing the sulfate to sulfuric acid and most important, reducing the oxidized lead Pb+2 to Pb(0). IMHO, adding a strong oxidizer to lead[Pb(0) of a charged battery] will oxidize it and slightly discharge or deteriorate the battery.
Moreover, we can't oxidize Pb+2 because it is already oxidized. We have to reduce Pb+2 to Pb(0) to charge a battery, sulfate is not involved in this electrochemical process.
Finally what is the principle of improving battery life by hydrogen peroxide ?
Thanks, Rlach

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Richard H.

09-05-2005 11:32:33




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to bubba2, 09-05-2005 08:55:55  
Thank you Bubba, Most of the snowbirds here at the campground are on a fixed income. If it works it works, if not they can each buy 6 new batteries next year. I knew it was something simple just couldn"t remember. Thanks again, Richard...Retired IBEW



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buickanddeere

09-05-2005 11:09:00




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to bubba2, 09-05-2005 08:55:55  
O3 not O2 for hydrgen peroxide. A sulphated battery might respond. That's all togethe rdifferent from adidng vinegar, baking soda etc.



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Hurst

09-05-2005 12:11:45




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to buickanddeere, 09-05-2005 11:09:00  
Hydrogen perodide is H2O2. Peroxide has a 2- charge even with two O's. each H has a 1+ charge, so the charges balance. Oxygen ion normally does have a 2- charge by itself, but peroxide, due to how it bonds, only has a 2- charge with both Oxygens because the other 2 free electrons are used to make a covalent bond that occurs by instantaneous dipoles (means the atoms become dipole at random times to hold together to eachother. Probably all Greek to most, but just what I have learned from Honors Chem (and being the top first year chem student at Mccallie boarding school :D) and from beginning of AP chemistry. I can answer most of your chemistry questions, so ask them when you need help.

Hurst

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buickanddeere

09-05-2005 17:19:21




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Hurst, 09-05-2005 12:11:45  
You are correct. Somehow I was thinking ozone not peroxide.



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Hurst

09-05-2005 17:27:39




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 definition of Chemistry in reply to buickanddeere, 09-05-2005 17:19:21  
Chemistry=one of mans most confusing subjects :)

Hurst



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dr.sportster

09-05-2005 08:08:30




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Richard H., 09-05-2005 07:21:20  
Many moons ago in auto electric class I was taught the only thing that should go in a battery is electrolyte.I also toured a battery company once for electrical work and was told the same thing.This was a company that made high quality truck batteries,and back up systems.Ive had good service adding only distilled water to batteries.



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buickanddeere

09-05-2005 07:45:13




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 Re: Battery Additives in reply to Richard H., 09-05-2005 07:21:20  
Snake oil.
When the sponge layer has flaked off the charge and discharge rate is slowed.The sponge flakes will eventually pile up and short between a + and - plate thus shorting out that cell. Keep lead acid batteries below 77F. Don't over charge or under charge. Do not let them sit for any length of time at any state of discharge. Add only demin or distilled water. Protect batteries from vibration. Do not deep cycle batteries or let them get run "dead".

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