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tree farm ??

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Rick Kr

02-21-2005 07:11:07




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Just read the post by DUG about his fruit trees. I have 30+ acres and want to do more than leasing it to the local farmer. I can't commit time to livestock due to my job. I am thinking of landscape trees (maples, spruce, cherry, etc). This would be a little easier to manage (I think) from a time standpoint.
I use my neighbor as the example. He takes a day or two off to cut hay, gets rained on etc. It is a week before he gets it under control, and now has lost a week of his reg. job (vacation time). I have done web searches, and all I find are Christmas tree farms.
Any ideas? Am I nuts for thinking I can do this? I know need some equip equipment. But I look at what people pay for trees at these nurseries and just shake my head.

Rick

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Hal/WA

02-22-2005 17:09:37




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
A neighbor has about10 acres in small trees in rows. They are various kinds of evergreens and he plans to sell them when they are a bit bigger. I see him working out there quite often, spreading mulch around the trees and between the rows. To my knowledge, he is not watering the trees beyond what nature provides, and I can see that some trees have not made it. With our current drought, next summer could be very hard on his investment. I think I would be removing about 2/3 of the small trees to conserve moisture, if I were doing it.

My neighbor has a lot of hours invested in this project and I doubt he has gotten any return at all so far. He also probably has some money invested in the trees themselves, though I have no idea how much. The land was very productive wheatland previously, with deep soil and no rocks. I would guess that it would be excellent ground to harvest trees from, and if they survive, the trees could be considered very hardy for our local climate. He subdivided the property and had a 10 acre plot that didn't sell, so he decided to try tree farming. The other 10 acre plots all have houses on them now, all built in the last 10 years.

Our area also has a lot of deer, but they don't seem to be very interested in evergreens. On the other hand, another neighbor tried U-pick strawberries and raspberries and had a nightmare trying to deal with deer damage, all year. After 3 or 4 years, he plowed his berry area all up and put it back in grain. I talked to him and he never made a profit on the berries and it was a lot of work. His berry patches were right by his house and looked to be 4 or 5 acres.

I used to have a large garden every year, but the last number of years, I haven't even bothered, since the last gardens I had were completely taken by the deer during August, when my area is very dry. The only way a garden can be protected from the deer, is with a 10'+ fence. With the area becoming suburbia, having a loose dog is no longer an option--they get shot or the dog catcher gets them (and it costs about $150 to get them back from the pound!). As near as I can see, there is no good, acceptable and legal solution to the deer problem around here. I bet there are 10 times as many deer around here as when I was a kid 50 years ago.....

If you decide to try tree farming, I would suggest starting a small area for a few years to see how well it goes. Doing it that way might save you a lot of hard work and disappointment. Good luck.

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diggerdave

02-22-2005 09:05:34




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
Another thing to think about is every time you dig a tree you will have to replace the soil taken by the tree spade. (hand digging B&B takes less soil in my opinion) Chances are on a smaller plantation you will not harvest entire rows at once either so this can make filling holes tricky. (I have a bobcat 450 skid loader, machine is only 35 inches wide that does the trick reall well.) Another option to think about is planting xmas trees if your area can support selling them yourself. I got 2000 more balsam firs coming thisd spring I gotta gear up planting!!

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Rick Kr

02-22-2005 05:35:34




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
I like the way you guys tell it like it is. I know nothing in life is easy, and it is good to hear all the touble with my idea too.

I don't have to use all 30 acres to get started, especially reading your posts about how many people are required. Deer are a problem in my area, water is not.

So I guess I will start this slow and expand little by little. I now have to decide what type of trees. The local AG/soil conv. have a huge list different trees.

Thanks for the replys.
Rick

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Dug

02-21-2005 21:00:59




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
Hey Rick,

You may want to consider nut trees, depending on where you live. Less trouble than fruit trees and you may be able to go through your state ag dept and buy seedlings very cheap. In Kansas I can buy 50 pecan or black walnut trees for $30. Thirty acres of mature Pecan trees is georgous to look at!

Just beware of the deer! Those rotten varmits will destroy a small tree planted by the human hand, but leave a volunteer elm untouched.

Dug

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Mark - IN.

02-22-2005 17:33:11




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Dug, 02-21-2005 21:00:59  
Hey Dug, I know of an elderly couple that planted and spaced a hundred acres of black walnut years before I was born, with retirement in mind. First for the nuts, but are now cutting down trees periodically as high $$$ lumber. Not a bad idea if are young enough to plan for retirement. Only thing is if plant now, by the time mature, will be illegal to do anything but hug, kiss, and talk to them.

Mark

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Butcher

02-21-2005 16:48:53




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
I hate to rain on your parade but. I am getting geared up to start sping planting and digging right now. The family nursery has been in bussiness for 80 years.
Equipment will kill you $$ wise. esspesially if you are planting shade/ornimental trees. Keep in mind that you cant just go dig a tree out of your feild anytime your customer wants one. You have to dig when the tree (depending on speices)will survive the shock.
That means digging,mulching, and 100's of gals. of water.
The industry standered here in Iowa is full replacement if the tree/shrub dies in the first growing season-half price the second. That is weather the costomer planted it wrong, did not water properly or whatever.
And then there is your dept. of ag. to come and inspect your fields if you are selling comercally.
Sorry for the long rant. I just got home from work and it aint easy man. Im tired.

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Joel Harman

02-21-2005 11:04:37




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
The tax advantages for xmas tree farms went south yrs ago.

Figure on about 20 employees if you want to do 30 ac of ornamental, shade trees & shrubs right.

If you want to plant it & not put alot of time in it then plant softwoods for timber or poplar for pulp. Downside to this is rotations in the 15+yr range for poplar & 50+ for sawlogs.



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dizzzy

02-21-2005 10:17:49




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
I get confused when reading some of the posts.
Its like you know, but then I think that if it isnt then it has to be that way, but if you know what I mean then I think it should be the other way. Now I know that if you dont no than what if it is, ok.But and I think that is the wiegh than donu't you think. Ok I'wll just knot get wear you going. I think, ok i whoaht.



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supergrumpy

02-21-2005 09:24:32




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
sure sounds like easy money until you start learning about tree diseases and stinking hungry whitetail deer

thinning and keeping the grass trimmed without grinding up your crop is an art

nothing wrong with planting couple thousand trees by hand every spring, dibble and strong back, lots of fresh air

go for it!!!



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Midwest redneck

02-21-2005 08:53:13




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
I would think that its possible. I have an aunt and uncle who own 40 acres in northern Mich. They received 10,000 red pine trees as saplings 20 years ago (for free) and those trees are now 7-8feet tall, takes years to harvest it out.



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williamf

02-21-2005 08:49:18




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
If you want a low time input tree farm consider timber. Depending on where you are there are often tax advantages over other ag. pursuits. With what in timber growing is considered "intensive cultivation" pines or sycamores will give the first harvest of pulpwood in as little as ten years.
Wm



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Red Dave

02-21-2005 08:23:28




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 Re: tree farm ?? in reply to Rick Kr, 02-21-2005 07:11:07  
You maybe oughta think again if you expect 30 acres of landscaping trees to be a part-time job.

Neighbor has about 40-50 acres of tree nursery for landscaping trees. Keeps him and 3 full-time employees busy year-round. And he has every piece of power equipment you can think of to help out.
Before he had all the power equipment, he had about a dozen more part-timers to help out during the busy times.

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