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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Power generator working off PTO

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Mike Larson

01-09-2005 04:31:11




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Does anyone have some ideas or pictures on how to hook-up a small 8,000-13,000 watt generator to my 540 pto? I would like something simple but functional. Just to run some basics when the power to our house goes out. I have a 29HP New Holland. I finially gave up the 2N after 23 years of loyal service. Your help and ides are very much appreciated. Pictures and suppliers would be great. Thanks.

Mike L. Ohio

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David in MD

01-10-2005 05:12:15




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to Mike Larson, 01-09-2005 04:31:11  
I've got a similar hook up where I back feed through a welder plug and 50 amp breaker in my main box. Square D makes a generator interlock device for their QO and Homeline boxes which requires that the main breaker must be off before you can turn the back fed breaker on. According my electrician and the electrical inspector this installation meets code.



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buickanddeere

01-10-2005 08:17:25




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to David in MD, 01-10-2005 05:12:15  
Where do you live? How are they switching the neutral? If the inspector caught anyone doing that trick here. The service connections could be cut and charges laid. You can't be running neutral current through that ground wire.



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Mike Larson

01-09-2005 08:20:03




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to Mike Larson, 01-09-2005 04:31:11  
Thanks all for your thoughts. I think I get the in/outs of the hook-up. I was wondering if you have it mounted on a small trailer or a 3 pt. platform. If so, can you send me a picture of your set up. Is there a brand that you have had better luck with and/or a supplier? I just want something for emergencies to run essential circuits in my house using my 29 HP New Holland. Thanks again..... .and play nice!!!!!

Mike L. Ohio

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jdemaris

01-09-2005 06:53:13




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to Mike Larson, 01-09-2005 04:31:11  
Your tractor could probably run a 14K PTO generator at full load. I live in a farming area and at least here, smaller PTO generators go fairly cheap at auctions - "smaller" meaning not big enough to keep a dairy farm going in a power outage. i.e. smaller than 25-30K. I've got a 17K unit I bought for $800. I've run it many times on some of my smaller tractors, e.g. my Case VAC or Cletrac HG - both in the 16-17 horsepower range. They do fine as long as I'm only using the essentials in the house and barn. In the dead of winter, I usually keep it hooked to one of my smaller tractors because they have gas engines and will start during an emergency. If power is out for a long time, I switch over to a diesel (once the block heater has been plugged in for awhile). I made a 50 amp extension cord with male plugs on both ends. When power is out, I back feed the generator into a 50 amp welding outlet after first making sure I've got the main breaker off in the house. Works nicely, but of course, limits the use to 50 amps. I've found this to be fine for running the deep well water pump, electric hot water heater, and a few small items. One other thing I found to be helpful. I have no neighbors, so it's hard to tell when power comes back on - unless it's nighttime and I can see lights across the valley. So I wired an outlet off my main breaker panel that is not controlled by the main breaker. I keep a radio plugged into that outlet. This way, when the power comes back on, the radio blasts and I hear it.

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john in la

01-09-2005 12:38:59




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to jdemaris, 01-09-2005 06:53:13  
While it may not be code I have seen a lot of set ups like yours on dairy farms. It is NOT for every one but it can be done with out risking life.
Back the tractor up to the generator and hook up the PTO. Flip two switches (one to cut the connection to the power grid and one to connect the generator to the barn) start the tractor and you are off to the races.
You can tell when the elect comes on because the house is on a separate system.
But on the other hand that is the bad thing about talking elec. on the internet. To easy for some one to follow what you are saying and miss that one important piece of info.

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I would get this connecti

01-09-2005 07:21:33




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to jdemaris, 01-09-2005 06:53:13  
You would not like being responsible for injuring someone/killing someone.



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jdemaris

01-09-2005 07:40:54




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to I would get this connecti, 01-09-2005 07:21:33  
Gee wiz, guess I should of kept my mouth shut. First of all, I HAVE a transfer switch that I use if the power is going to be off for a long time. It is also the only means I have of using the full output of my PTO generator. But, that being said I also have the capability to backfeed into any one of the four 50 amp welding outlets I have. To do this takes a degree of knowledge and common sense but IS subject TO human error. National and local code - for electrical work and general construction, in part, is there to protect the general public both from themselves and the errors of others that we might get exposed to. I understand that. As far as the power company goes, I used to be a lineman for Public Service Electric and Gas. We were taught, right from the beginning, to treat ANY line as if it is hot, no matter what. I don't believe that has changed. As far as what I do here, I AM NOT recommending it to ANYBODY. But, for my own use - yes to a degree I still trust myself and don't need some government agency micromangaging everything I do. I have dual power shutoffS - one at the main breaker and one at the pole. What I do is safe unless I lose my mind and do something stupid. If I DO lose my mind, I guess there are lots of other things I can do that are more dangerous than my "dealdy" two-ended plug. Again, I am not RECOMMENDING that anyone do as I have done - but come on guys, lighten up!

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Harley

01-09-2005 10:05:10




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to jdemaris, 01-09-2005 07:40:54  
Hey jdemaris!!!! Don't you just love it when somebody comes on and tells you you can't do something when you have been doing it for some time now? Where were they when we needed the help to rig up our project in the first place. Kinda like me running my New Holland big round baler behind a 1940 Farmall M without live pto. Three years now. Last summer had a neighbor walk out in the field where I was baling, look at my outfit, walk around to the back of the tractor, and say just as serious as can be,"You know you can't run that baler with that tractor?" I looked back at the dozen or so bales on the ground and said "You're probably right." It's totally amazing the engineering feats I see from old timers like us that don't have the means or inclination to go to the store and buy what we need, so we go down to the shop and make it. HELLO It's called self-sufficiency. We'd all live in France if we couldn't make do and help ourselves. Just some rantings from some old hillbilly that can't type either. Later, Harley

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mark

01-09-2005 10:01:29




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to jdemaris, 01-09-2005 07:40:54  
jd,
It doesn't matter what board you are posting on, there is always a bunch of self righteous folks ready to point out your foibles and cite the law..which few actually know, and proclaim what an idiot you are. All this is result of the age in which we live, where folks have been taught to believe they are stupid and haven't got enough sense to provide for their own, let alone anybody else's safety.

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wgm

01-09-2005 07:03:52




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to jdemaris, 01-09-2005 06:53:13  
This post has nothing but CODE VIOLATION written all over it!! An extension cord with 2 male ends has to be in the top 2 of code violations. Hopefully no one is stupid enough to follow this advise.



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Gene Davis (Ga.)

01-09-2005 19:11:06




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to wgm, 01-09-2005 07:03:52  
Hey. I've got a cord with two female ends on it my son in law had. Is this a dangerous code violation??



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old

01-09-2005 08:26:38




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to wgm, 01-09-2005 07:03:52  
The double male end coed is bad but and heres the big one. Older camper trailors used them a lotI have one that has that set up, and yes its factory.



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jdemaris

01-09-2005 09:58:29




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to old, 01-09-2005 08:26:38  
I guess along the same line, we used to carry an assortment of them at our volunteer fire department. During major power outages (back in the 70s) we used them, along with pigtails in order to provide short bursts of electricity to homeowners so they could get some water out of their wells and run the heat a bit. I guess now with the extreme legislation of the deployment of "common sense", we were all "stupid" for doing so and should all be sent to the code-enforcement jail.

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jdemaris

01-09-2005 07:21:44




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to wgm, 01-09-2005 07:03:52  
No stupidity involved here (on my end, anyway) and no code violation since it is not a permanent hookup. So, what specific part of National Code - or local (for my area and not your's) are you citing?



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Gerald J.

01-09-2005 07:03:50




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to jdemaris, 01-09-2005 06:53:13  
Your double male cord is deadly.

Unless you put a lock on your main breaker anyone could throw it and energize the power line while a lineman is working on it. 7 KV would kill him working what he thought was off.

The law requires an interlock between such power sources to prevent connecting the generator to the power line.

Gerald J.



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VaTom

01-09-2005 05:45:39




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to Mike Larson, 01-09-2005 04:31:11  
Hi Mike,

I have a similar sized CUT and found a used 25KW pto generator. Works fine. I don"t get 25 KW, but the tractor will spin it to 2/3 capacity without complaining. Use it whenever I need to power a large piece of woodworking equipment that didn"t have enough current in the building to run.



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Mike M

01-09-2005 05:32:42




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 Re: Power generator working off PTO in reply to Mike Larson, 01-09-2005 04:31:11  
When you get a generator buy one for a 540 rpm pto and it will hook right on ? Just buy one that the generator final speed is 1800rpm and not 3600rpm they will run quieter.



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