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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

OT-What would ya'll do in this situation?

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Wayne

05-08-2004 22:22:08




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Hey guys, I've got a situation here and although I've made my decision and don't plan to change it, I'd still like to hear some other opinions as to wether I'm doing the right thing. I've got a guy that asked me to build a trailer for him. One of his first comments to me was to build one like I know how to build one so it would last. His old one was a double axel, 16', two runner type car trailer, that had been floored and had 32" sides. It recently laid down on him 300 miles from home when it broke both a hub shaft and both springs on the rear axel. I looked at it the other day and it was stress cracked all over, and just generally beat all to he--...he's only been using it for about 4 years. For a new one he was gonna supply all the materials and pay me $1000 to build it. A he- of a cheap price to pay for building something this size but I was doing it as a side/evening project with no extreme rush. He said he wanted a 20 footer capable of handling 15,000lbs. He already had already gotten a major good deal on two Dexter 7500lb axels with brakes, and had a new 2-5/16 ball type reciever to go on it. Now the problem, he only wanted to build it out of 2x3x1/4 rectangular tube and some 2x2x1/4 angle iron. I could not convince the guy that this material was not gonna be heavy enough to build the trailer he wanted....BECAUSE... He knows trailers since "His family is in the surplus/scrap business just like he is and they all have trailers build out of light material like this. It doesn't need to be all that heavy because they don't routinely haul but maybe 5,000lbs, but they have hauled 17,000lbs for over 400 miles on them before"....Because he has gotten lucky and not killed anybody before I could not make him see that what they did was VERY UNSAFE. You just can't take a 5000lb trailer and expect to safely haul 15,000+ on it. I also told him that the ball hitch he had wasn't rated for that kind of load, that he really needed a pintle hitch but again, 'they had done it before.....'. I know this guy goes out of state quite often, doesn't have any kind of tag on his current trailer, and I figure wasn't planning to register and tag the one he wanted me to build either. Thing is he says he has never gotten caught for anything, be it no tag or more importantly for being grossly over loaded and unsafe. I ran a little longer there than I planned but I wanted ya'll to have a good idea of what I was faced with. So, even longer story shortened some, I told him that I hated to turn down his money but I could not, in good consience, build a light weight trailer that I knew was gonna be used in an unsafe manner. That if he wanted me to build him a heavier trailer that wouild safely handle the loads he hauled then I would be happy to. That's been a few days ago and I haven't heard back from him. I need the money as bad as the next guy, but I just - couldn't - do - it.... I'm not so much worried about the liable issues as much as the simple fact that even if I was building to his specs I would still be the builder. I don't ever intend to knowingly build something that is gonna be inherently unsafe in use. I just couldn't do it and still have a clear conscience no matter how much the money called my name.... How do you guys feel about this situation? Would ya'll have made the same decision I did or what would ya'll have built the man's trailer however he wanted it and took the money and ran??? Thanks for the time guys..... I just needed to vent a little over this idiot and I'm also just a little curious for other opinions....

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Frank M.

05-10-2004 08:37:28




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
I agree. If no one else will build one to his specs, maybe he'll wise up and get the right one built. Good going!



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J.C. IN AZ.

05-09-2004 19:12:25




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
MY FRIEND YOU CAN TAKE THE MONEY, BUILD IT FOR HIM, AND RUN RIGHT DOWN TO THE BEST LAWYER YOU CAN FIND AS YOU ARE GOING TO NEED ONE FOR BEING A PARTY TO AN ACCIDENT WAITING TO HAPPEN.YOU DO NOT NEED THE LIABILITIE ISSUE WHICH WILL ARISE BY BUILDING THIS TRAILER NO MATTER HOW IT IS BUILT.



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dhermesc

05-10-2004 05:51:43




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 Re: Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to J.C. IN AZ., 05-09-2004 19:12:25  
You can't buy enough insurance for the liability that guy is going to create.



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Stumpy

05-09-2004 15:36:15




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
I applaude you. I agree with all the posts and will put my spin on it. I have a 2 1/2 year old little girl, if she was to get hurt by a faulty built/ stupidly used trailer blowing apart on the highway I would have no problem being locked up for murder! No lawyers needed, no lawsuits. Follow that feeling in the bottom of your stomach, it is your best weather vane! Again thank you for keeping my little girl safe. And let's hope this jerk takes himself out when his next wrong decision occurs.

Stumpy

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jim

05-09-2004 12:58:34




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
2 schools of thought here.
1.He wanted you to build it the way you know how, if he will not let you build it your way, then he hits the highway.
2. In my shop, people are always asking how much to rebuild an engine. I tell them a price, and get,"Gawd, that is high" I explain to them I only do it one way, my way or I will not do it, because if I do it their way and it breaks down, then they whine it is my fault. So, as in #1 it is my way or the highway. Good, smart move on your part to not do this project.

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Davis In SC

05-09-2004 12:25:03




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
Wayne, I would run as fast as I can !!! It is obvious this guy does not use good judgement in loading & hauling. I bet he would be quick to point the blame to you if an accident happened. At my machine shop, I refuse to make or repair anything structural for a vehicle, knowing I could be responsible if it was involved in an accident. Too many sue-happy people out there now...



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Paul in Mich

05-09-2004 18:39:35




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 Re: Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Davis In SC, 05-09-2004 12:25:03  
Davis, I worked as a machinist for over 30 years, and most of the shops I worked in wouldnt touch automotive because their liability insurance practically trippled. It was far better to make parts for aero-space industry than automotive. The reason is as stated in most of the posts below. Its hard to control what some moron will do as far as overloading or misloading a trailer, or abusing the vehicle, whereas anything that flies has a totally different and much more stringent set of rules to abide by.

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BFO

05-09-2004 07:31:01




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
When it comes to trailers, I do NOT build them with surge brakes, I do not build tandems with brakes on one axle, and I design the frame, there isn't enough money in the world to make me change my mind. You did the only sensible thing



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Paul in Mich

05-09-2004 07:16:48




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
Wayne, I suppose everyone who builds a trailer runs the risk of selling it to someone who will ultimately overload it and either cause structural damage to the trailer itself or create a safety hazard on the highway. Thats why major manufacturers have their trailers certified for weight restrictions. Homemade trailers usually arent certified, and so are often misused. Quite frankly, I wouldnt build a trailer for the person who wants you to, even for $10,000, as you can tell he has no regard for the limitations of a trailer to begin with as he has shown this to be true in past experience. In my opinion, he is relying on your good conscience, since he plans to use none of his own. I'd walk away from this deal in a heartbeat, even though extra income is always nice and hard to turn down, because disaster is always costlier, and this is disaster waiting to happen.

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T_Bone

05-09-2004 06:06:05




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
Hi Wayne,

Let me see if I can read inbetween the lines. He gets someone too build him a light trailer for hauling heavy weight then "when" (not if) it cracks welds and tears out gussets/material from being overloaded he gets a "free" repair cause the guy that made the trailer feels guilty that his work didn't hold up to being overloaded... that is until the maker wises up.

I've always found sold "used" (never new) and "as is" on a bill of sale sure stops any argruements in the future. That way when they come back for a repair from overloading, I charge them for the repair.

Weather the man overloads the trailer or not, is not your problem. Think about that. He could also buy your truck and drive it 100mph which is also not your problem.

Two 7500lb axles does not let one carry 15000lbs. Four 16"LT tires are good for 12,200lbs or there abouts. There are some 14.5" (?) (16.5" ?) "G" rated for 14800lbs but cost about $240 eh, not including wheels.

I do know the trailer would not leave my property without "green cash" in hand.

T_Bone

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KURT (mi)

05-09-2004 03:31:13




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
I would say what you said already, I just cant and couldnt build a trailer knowing that it could break up on the road and maybe kill somebody. There are too many lawyers out there ready to sue the He&& out of you and you dont need that. $1000 is not enough money.



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jfky

05-09-2004 03:11:08




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
just be nice about it and tell him you don't think you have the time now.



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Scotty

05-09-2004 00:28:05




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
Just one thing to remember!

WHOS GONNA BE LIABLE IN THE EVENT OF AN ACCIDENT!!!

You stated that You know it doesnt have heavy enough material in it. That is a good recepie for a Product Liability suit!

I wanted to have tires rotated on a vehicle a year ago. When the dealer saw them they said "We cant rotate them because they are to wore down. We could be sued if You have an accident." Ther was still plenty of tread on those tires by my judgement!

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sibby(Aus)

05-08-2004 22:40:15




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 Re: OT-What would ya'll do in this situation? in reply to Wayne, 05-08-2004 22:22:08  
Wayne, i feel for you cause money is tight everywhere, but listen, what if this idiot overloaded the trailer you built, tow coupling snapped and wiped out a family travelling on the road, kid goin to school on their bike, school bus, you never know, and will never forget if you built it and the know/ all overloaded it. Keep Away from the idiot!!!



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