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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR

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lenray

08-01-2003 19:40:45




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I have often thought about putting a V-8 engine in an older tractor maybe an oliver 77 or 88 or maybe a farmal M.
Not to use as a puller but just to put an engine in a tractor that needed an engine./
Anyone do this or can you put me on to info. concerning that.
thanks len




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greg s

06-16-2004 10:02:57




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
my dad just blew the motor in his 5020 JD. ruined the crank and block. we were stunned and amaized at the price of replacement parts, even used ones. (yes, green paint is more expensive!) so, the discussion turned to the feasability of using a cummins motor in it, like an older 290 or 350. heck, a 250 would make more power than what originally came in it, and parts are cheap for a cummins. would like to know if anybody else has done or considered this. i have heard of Detroits swapped into tractors, but never cummins, which are better (IMO) and cheaper to work on. will let you know how or if it goes.

greg s in tx

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jal-SD

08-04-2003 06:25:25




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
BIL put a 6 cyl Chrysler industrial into an F-12 back in the late '60's. It was a moving machine-I think its still in this part of the world, gotta check w/last known owner some day. In the '70's, our local JC chapter used to sponser thractor pulls & there were some guys that came up from Neb w/hot rods. MH 44 w/327 Chev, 70 Ollie w/390 Ford & F-30 W/Chrysler 440 - talk about power & dirt flying! Also know where there is an M Farmall w/327 Chev, its used as a loader tractor daily & have seen an SM W/345 IHC V-8. (My $0.02 worth. jal-SD)

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Bob Clark

08-03-2003 16:06:35




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
All the exotic conversions that were mentioned reminded me of the engine swap that Pickering seed and purbred Hamps had done to their 78 Chevy 3/4 (or maybe 1) ton 4x4 pickup. The used it to pull a trailer and delivery boars. The local garage wizard installed a Duetz 5 cylinder. Also a local contracter stuffed a 4 cylinder Perkins into a 74 Ford 4X4. The Perkins was a little short on power but both were super effecient. This was a long time before Dodge did the Cummins trick.

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Mguy

08-02-2003 23:01:49




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
Few years back I put Kohler Command 18 horse V twin into my 718 Allis garden tractor where there had been a one lunger Kohler 18. Man, night and day difference. When I was a kid , just out of high school, I put a chevy 235 into an Allis RC(yeh , I know), M was down , JD G was down , had to do the spring field work with that and a MH 20. Sure was happy to get back to conventional machinery when we got 'em together.Mguy.

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Carl

08-02-2003 21:10:53




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
I have a Massey-Harris 81 (Ford "N" size) with a 307 Chevy V-8 and transmission mounted ahead of the orginial transmission. Works and runs mower fine never short of power. but don't want to break anything too hard to find. have fun



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Rick

08-14-2003 12:00:36




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 Re: Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to Carl, 08-02-2003 21:10:53  
Carl,
I have a 307 with (I believe) a 3 speed tranny. Came out of a '67 Camaro when I was young and foolish. Now that I'm just foolish, I need to make some room. Let me know if you are interested.

Rick



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ChadS

08-02-2003 17:55:47




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
I have seen 350 chevys in some strange places! In Olivers, Farmalls, Aliis Chalmers. Cockshutt. ETC. The M farmall is the best tractor for a v8 conversion. If you use the bellhousing plate, and drill the chevy trans bolt pattern in the plate. Or use a 4 speed bellhousing and bolt it to the bellhousing plate and build a clutch input shaft to adapt to the chevy clutch spline. Hope this helps. ChadS

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RayP(MI)

08-02-2003 16:13:47




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
Well, not in that league, but I put a 18hp Briggs Vangard V-twin in place of a 14hp single cylinder Kohler in a Deere 140 garden tractor! Years ago I was reading a hot rod magazine, and some guy wrote in asking if a Cadillac engine could be put in a Nash Rambler. Editor wisely replied "you can put anything in anything if you use a big enough hammer!" Never forgot that.



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markct

08-02-2003 10:13:06




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
i put a ford 300 straight six into a 1930s caterpilar road grader last year, the original motor had frozen and cracked, so i made up adapters and a framework to go around the engine and then i had to extend the hood about 6 inches, but overall it worked pretty good, i could have just as easily put in a v-8 but a inline six was what i had around so thats what i used



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Dale in IN

08-02-2003 06:12:58




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
Put a 235 6 cyl chev engine in a Ferguson TO 20 back in the 60s. It would run about 40 mile an hour on the raod. No govenor, just controlled the engine rpm with the throttle. Could realy throw the dirt when plowing. Had to lengthen all the steering mechanisim and built a new gas tank on top of the hood. kind of crude but it worked.



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Paul

08-02-2003 05:45:04




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
Years ago my neighbors (car repair folk) put a chevy V8 with auto tranny into an F-20. They had to add some rail to the side, make the tractor a bit longer. Is one heck of a bale rack mover, with the auto in addition to standard tranny. As far as I know, still blading snow & such for them.

--->Paul



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Chris Brown

08-01-2003 19:48:11




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 Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to lenray, 08-01-2003 19:40:45  
I had a 230 farmall (newer C) with a 231 olds V6. I didnt do it. It ran and puled ok. They put a pair of frame rails on it to support the front wheels. It broke the pto gears out. I know of a guy who has a 1100 massey with a 478 ci GMC V6 in it ,he had alot of machine work to do. Once apon a time I saw an old D4 cat with a dodge 318,I have no idea how it was hooked up.



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Deas Plant.

08-02-2003 01:07:41




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 Re: Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to Chris Brown, 08-01-2003 19:48:11  
Hi, Lenray. If you are really determined, you can put almost any engine into almost machine or vehicle, assuming availability of funds, facilities, TIME -- AND YOUR OWN -- or some-one else's -- ABILITY.

I personally have put a GM 6V71 into a cab-over International tip-truck (in place of the original 6V53) a Cummins 903 V8 into a Mercedes Benz model 1923 cab-over prime mover (in place of the original straight 6 - a 90 hp, 700 rpm jump), a 1.4 litre, 4 cylinder gas Holden engine into a Suzuki 4 wd (in place of the original 3 cyl., 540 cc, 2 stroke engine - not much bigger than your average sewing machine motor), a 1 litre, 4 cyl., Nissan gas engine into the same model of Suzuki 4 wd, and a 308 cu. in. gas Holden V8 into a 5-ton (British) Bedford 4 wd truck (in place of the original 300 cu. in. straight 6 - around an 90 hp. 1,900 rpm jump)

The second and the last of the above were the most spectacular. The Benz conversion was capable of 100 mph loaded to a gross of 36 tons and did a 1,200 mile round trip in 16 hours instead of the previous 24 hours for $160.00 LESS in fuel.

The Bedford, previously flat out at around 55 mph, would roll out to 80 mph and still winding. I wasn't keen to push it past that 'cos it only had Bandag retreads on the steer. (Not that I have anything against Bandag retreads. It's just that they ARE retreads and as such ARE prone to throwing and blowing.) This Bedford with the V8 in it also pulled a rather heavy mobile home set-up very comfortably with a one-off towing hitch that I built specifically for the purpose -- total weight on the road, 15 tons. (The truck was 5 1/4 tons.)

All of the above were done with minimal machine shop facilities. It is amazing what you can achieve with a 9" angle grinder, so much so that there was only one of the above conversions that needed any outside machine shop work.

The Bedford V8 conversion required a new clutch housing to be built. This meant having front and rear plates for the housing machined flat. The housing was then built up from the front plate out of 1/4" mild steel plate and the back end of the of the body of the housing was again machined so that it was dead true to the front plate. The rear plate was then welded in place.

Accurate alighnment of the rear plate was achieved by standing the engine on its harmonic balancer/front pulley (With the oil pan drained.), bolting the housing in place on the rear of the engine and using a dial guage set on the back of the crankshaft to check alignment while slowly rotating the engine. This method got me to within +/- 7.5 thousandths of an inch after all welding had been done.

The hole for the starter was 'machined' in the front plate very delicately with an oxy/acetylene boring machine and linished with a 1/2-round file. The bolt holes for the starter were located by holding in mesh with the ring gear, scribing throught the holes and center-punching the resultant circles. The finished housing also had a large removeable bottom plate, complete with a drain hole, to allow access to the interior for installation/removal.

The only other machining in ANY of these conversions involved weld-filling the original six bolt holes in the Bedford flywheel and re-drilling for eight bolt holes to match the Holden V8 crankshaft. (There were kits, including clutch housings, available at the time to put these Holden V8's into later model Bedfords using the Holden 10" flywheel but there was never a kit to convert my model of Bedford AND I wanted the 12" flywheel for the extra lugging power.)

I have also seen many other conversions that were 'head-turners' and if you still have any doubts take a look at the Funk V8 conversions for the Ford 2N, 8N and 9N tractors.

What is possible in the way of conversions is largely limited ONLY by your imagination and ingenuity and your will to succeed. Funds and facilities do play a role here too but it is truly amazing what a little ingenuity can get you around.

Hope this helps.

You have a wonderful day. Best wishes. Deas Plant.

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TimV

08-02-2003 06:37:20




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 Re: Re: Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to Deas Plant., 08-02-2003 01:07:41  
Deas--some good reading here--very interesting! I've seen (and helped on) a few strange conversions myself, but mainly small stuff. Usually things like snowmobile engines in ATV frames, V8's in cars meant for 4-bangers, etc. Had a friend with a 454 Chevy engine in his S10 pickup--talk about 10 lbs of shutt in a 5-lb bag! I also LOVED your reference to an "oxy-acetylene boring machine"! I hadn't heard that particular term before, but sure sounds more elegant than "torch"! I'm also surprised no one seems to have mentioned the Funk conversions--a V8 put into a Ford 8N. Not many around, but they're valuable collector's items.

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gene b

08-02-2003 04:04:22




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 Re: Re: Re: V-8 IN AN OLDER TRACTOR in reply to Deas Plant., 08-02-2003 01:07:41  
Very interesting DEAS PLANT you are sure correct when you say anything can be done you have just got to try. Way back in the middle 40's there wae a f-20 with a CHRYSLER 6 in our area was a plowing machine.



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