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Question on oxy-acet welding

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dave

02-21-1999 12:18:00




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I have a oxy-acet torch set..I mainly use it for cutting but Im trying to learn how to weld with it..I bought the rods and Im practicing on pieces of steel...I grinded the surface of each piece of steel to the bare metal but when I try to weld it ..the weld wont stick..it just slides off, am I doing something wrong here?




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Jim Dolmanet

02-27-1999 17:03:46




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 Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to dave, 02-21-1999 12:18:00  
I would like to know if you all sale welding kits? I've been pricing them all over and sticker shock hits me. Thank you for your time.



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MikeH(Tx)

02-23-1999 12:10:35




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 Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to dave, 02-21-1999 12:18:00  
I too am a beginning welder and will share one thing I learned from experience. I had a tendency to use too much oxygen and ended up will molten slag rather than molten metal. Turned down the oxygen a little and the metal would pool up without burning away. Much better.

By the way, regarding the comment below about baling wire for rods: I went to the local welding supply store and said I felt like a hacker because I was using coat hangers for rods. The guy just laughed and said the pros use baling wire instead! Turns out it has low carbon and is cheap. Not much else to worry about. Coat hangers work, but have a higher carbon content which can make your weld more brittle. They actually sell rod for oxy-acetylene, but the guy said he doesn't sell much since wire works so well.

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Chet

02-21-1999 14:43:40




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 Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to dave, 02-21-1999 12:18:00  
You are not getting your base metals hot enough. They need to be cherry red, with a hint of yellowing.



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chet

02-21-1999 14:37:31




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 Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to dave, 02-21-1999 12:18:00  
You are not getting your base metals hot enough. They should be bright cherry red.



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Melvin

02-21-1999 16:42:12




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 Re: Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to chet, 02-21-1999 14:37:31  
For welding you need to start with a puddle of molten metal and dip your filler rod into it. Practice without filler rod. Make your puddle and try to weld the two pieces together. After mastering this try using a rod. Practice practice and practice. Baling wire makes an excellent rod for oxy acet welding.



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dave

02-21-1999 18:20:09




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 Re: Re: Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to Melvin, 02-21-1999 16:42:12  
Im going to be welding the sheetmetal on my tractor..if I make a puddle of the the existing metal I might be left with a hole..is oxy--acet welding not good for this type of work due to the high temperatures needed?.

Dave



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rossow (MN)

02-23-1999 12:10:31




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to dave, 02-21-1999 18:20:09  
Before cheap MIG welders became available, I did a lot of auto body work by oxy-acetylene welding or brazing. I was not (nor am I today) by any stretch of the imagination a pro, so despite my intense practice and experimentation, I could not keep the heat from distorting the larger body panels. By the time the base metal got hot enough to weld or even braze, warpage would set in. I had some limited success by creating spot welds or brazes, cooling the surrounding area with wet rags, then welding some more, etc., until the weld was completed at the rate of an inch or so at a time. But it was never as good as a MIG. You'll find that on smaller jobs in heavier metal, such as an edge crack on a Ford N clamshell fender, gas welding will work OK. But it takes practice. Too low a flame will spread out the heat and distort the surrounding metal before the target area becomes hot enough to weld; too hot will burn through.

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Len

02-21-1999 21:31:55




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to dave, 02-21-1999 18:20:09  

A Mig would be better, it will not distort the tin as much. It can be gas welded if you are not as fussy about how it looks



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Jim WI

02-22-1999 11:04:50




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to Len, 02-21-1999 21:31:55  
A MIG would be ideal for welding the body sheet metal.

If you want to go a little cheaper than the MIG with the shielding gas tank, the welders that feed wire with internal shielding substances work OK too. They don't leave quite as nice of a weld but it is good enough.

Another alternative is brazing -- I've not done this on sheet metal myself but I've seen it done with reasonably good results on smaller pieces. I'm sure someone here can provide the pros and cons.

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Jay

03-18-1999 21:05:14




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: question on oxy-acet welding in reply to Jim WI, 02-22-1999 11:04:50  
I am a pro and I will try to describe the different ways to oxy acetylene weld. On cast iron, you can get too hot too soon by spending
too much time getting the metal "cherry red."
Use either a flux coated brass rod, or preheat the bare rod and get as much flux as poss stuck
on to avoid stopping to re-dip as much. start
applying the rod as the metal begins to glow, but
manage the heat to avoid heating beyond the range
of the flux to avoid oxidizing. the brass will
"flow" onto the joint and "bond" with the base
metal rather than bead up. The same goes for steel, but steel will tolerate more heat before
oxidation keeps the brass from flowing. As far as
"puddling" steel goes with baling wire, this works better when joining edges, there is no fool-
proof method of welding in the middle of a section of sheet without major distorsion. A pro
body man would use a special lead solder to fill
holes in sheet using as low a heat as poss. this
is done every day on the assembly line at any of
the auto plants, on the joint between the roof
and the pillars, so it can be bought with some
calling around. mig guns can be used on sheet, but after much fiddling with heat, feed, and wire
diameters on scrap pieces. tig machines are the best thing to use on sheet metal, but they are
expensive. there are "exciter" boxes that can be
added to arc welders to get around much of the
expense that converts them to tig. tig is better
on thin material because it is somewhat like
puddling with a torch, but you don't have the distorsion of a torch because you are basically
substituting the flame for an arc, which is shielded by the argon gas, and the heat is contained in a smaller area. A good tig man can
take two metals that normally are not candidates
for welding, and join them simply by puddling
with the tig arc, such as brass, bronze, and pot metal. even if a filler rod is not available.
Good Luck

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