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OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste

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doug in illinoi

02-13-2008 20:51:15




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I look for our roadsides to start becoming dumping grounds for the stuff our overpriced waste haulers won't take. They will no longer take florescent light tubes from where I work,they leave a note to the effect they are hazardous waste. Not my problem, except even USPS, my employer, is going to have to eventually figure out a way to get rid of waste garbage haulers won't take. I am afraid too many people will see fit to just throw it in our ditches, and why not get rid of the rest of the "too heavy for the trash" waste at the same time. Could keep going on this post for way too long, as I burn most of my trash, or should say used to. Once burnt, it is heavy even in small amounts, they won't take it. They have even left notices alluding to hazardous waste suspected, too heavy. Guess I just have to bury everything. DOUG

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WantACaseLASomeday

02-16-2008 09:04:03




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to hay, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
We transplant wildflowers from the roadsides all the time - the area between the road edge and adjoining property line belongs to the country or township or whatever and no one would/could/should care about transplanting some flowers. If the county told the other poster their crew would clean the trash it must be a public pond.



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bill mart

02-16-2008 18:57:01




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to WantACaseLASomeday, 02-16-2008 09:04:03  
Some towns actually plant wildflowers along side the roads and I think they might have an issue with people helping themselfs to them. bill m.



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redtom

02-15-2008 17:43:35




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
First it was tires, then fridges, and now light bulbs. The harder it is to get rid of, the more dumping there will be. The sad part is, if they made it easier to dispose of in the first place it would be cheaper than going around cleaning up afterward. Now in my city they "need" to stop theft from slum rental houses so they are going to require photo ID AND a demo/building permit or builder/electrician/etc license to sell scrap metel from buildings. So, a very effective cottage industry that has sprung up and cleaned our local countryside of scrap appliances and cars will be mostly shut down. And on the topic of trash, here in Michigan, 450 truckloads or more of Canadian garbage a DAY flow in to Mich landfills. So many that they have their own lane at the Blue water bridge. Thats pretty bright for a state surrounded by water! The state can't stop it because its an international issue controlled at the national level. Not to slight our friends to the North, but if you look at a map I think they have enough land for their own garbage.

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rockyhawaii

02-15-2008 17:06:17




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
Being on an island, we have a huge waste-disposal problem. After the city got tired of paying crews to pick up batteries and tires from the roadside, they eventually put up centers where we can drop them off for "free." What ticks me off is that a lot of local people still dump trash on the roadside just because they're too lazy or cheap to drive to the dump-bins. They'll drive for miles to buy beer but not a mile to the dump.

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JML755

02-15-2008 06:32:04




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
I work at a small automated machinery supplier to the auto industry. We are ISO 14001 registered. For those who don't know what this is:

To be ISO 14001 registered, you have to identify all of the aspects of your business that can affect the environment (water, air, etc.) and draw up a plan to manage them. I.e. paint must be disposed of properly, recycling of bulbs, batteries, containment of PCB's, etc. We have a compnay that comes once a month to collect all of our "hazardous waste". Costs us between $500-$100 per month. We are audited once a year to maintain our ISO certification. (cost is a minimum $2000 for the audit). We are required to be certified by one of our Big 3 automotive customers. Don't have certification, can't do business with them. BUT... it is also comforting knowing that we are responsible citizens in protecting the enviornment. Right next door is a small collision shop. They are not ISO certified and I am sure their methods of paint disposal, etc. are less than beneficial to the environment. Their operation is the rule, whereas our operation is the exception. My point is, you CAN be environemntally responsible, but it is not FREE or CHEAP. We could employ 1 or 2 people for what we spend on trying to be responsible corporate citizens. And most of the costs are related to paperwork and government regulations.
At the other extreme, there are the "tree huggers" who want NO development and ZERO harm to the environment. We wouldn't need to worry about how efficient our light bulbs were if these tree huggers would allow clean nuclear power plants to be built. Are there risks with nuclear power? Sure, but they are minimal, with all the safeguards today. France gets most of its power from nuclear reactors. Our navy is nuclear powered.
Wind generated power is getting a lot of attention today. Good, no problem with that. But now the tree huggers are complaining about birds flying into the blades. The bottom line is that the enviro-extremists are negative, do-nothings who need to rant and complain about SOMETHING. If they are so concerned about the environment, they should climb out of their trees (that THEY do not own) and get a degree in engineering or botany and do something POSITIVE with their lives, like invent a plant that could be grown quickly and turned into fuel or develop a hydrogen fuel cell, etc.

From my own personal experience, I found a spot in the woods on some property I bought that had asphalt shingles and broken bottle laying around. (previous owners personal dump site). I dug down over 6 feet to get all the junk that was buried there (polluting the ground water) and refilled it with dirt. Wife wanted to just cover it up, but I didn't feel right about that. Now, I've got to haul it off to a landfill. It's going to end up in the earth again, but at least it will be an area that is clay lined and designed for the least impact to the environment.
Recycling is great, but we need to make it EASY for people to do it. People wouldn't dump an old washer over a cliff into the Mississippi if there was a quick convenient spot to drop it off for free, or if it was picked up at the curb. This requires a consistent government policy at all levels. Our township (like many other communities) gives us recycling bins, will pick up old water heaters and washers.

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T_Bone

02-15-2008 00:31:02




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
Hi Doug,

It's already that way here. At night people drive around dumping off items that the recycle center won't take, tires, battery's, oil, chemicals, oil filters, etc:

Our County twice a year has a free dump day. Most of the time they will take all non-household garbage with hazzard waste. Other times then just tires and battery's, no appliances.

The County will however pick-up all trash if a neighborhood will pick-up and pile "ALL" trash along side of the road. We just have to call them after were done. Weird!!!

The County found if they don't offer the free dump days then people will find a place in the desert to do there dumping.

T_Bone

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Mark - IN.

02-14-2008 20:15:19




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
I just mentioned that on tractor talk the other day. Was in a power plant the other day and a sparkie was replacing all of the florescents from sea to shining sea...in the plant. The bulbs he was putting into the same fixtures were about 1/2 the diameter. I asked what was up because was replacing good bulbs too. He pointed to the green ends and said had to pull the existing and put in "green bulbs". No joke, green ends, smaller diameter..."green bulbs". The new "green bulbs" still have mercury in them, but in theory a small enough amount that are supposed to be able to be tossed in the garbage. I asked the cost, he shrugged and said "Are green" the rubbed his thumb and index finger "Probably lots of $green". I'll say this for them, they were bright...flickered a lot and was like being in the strobe lights of a discoteque, but were blindingly bright in between flickers.

As far as getting rid of my old non-green florescent tubes...I wait until about 2AM and rocket them about 1/4 mile over into the side of my neighbor Dan's barn with a huge slingshot between two of my trees I made out of an old tractor tire innertube. His dogs go nuts and bark, his lights come on, then go back off. Next day he tells me a tall tail about how he chased a bear, badger, or something off, and I tell him "Huh, I must've slept through it all".

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greygoat

02-14-2008 07:30:39




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
Garbage won't take "recycleable" fluresent tubes.
County recycling center won't take em cracked or
broke, says to put em in the garbage.
Have to put em in a plastic bag,smash em up and
hide it in an old Coke carton in the bottom of
the garbage bag!



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NE IA

02-14-2008 07:05:04




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
I live near the big Mississippi and if you slow down and look it is pretty neat. But if you go for a short drive, less than a half mile from the waters edge not so much. Steep bluffs with tire, appliances etc. It would be cheaper to have the county take this stuff for nothing because getting it back up the steep bluffs is very costley, and afull time job for a large crew of men and equipment.

I probably can't blame a person making min. wage to not consider it as a option. The river used to get lots and lots of big cables from barges, but I think high scrap prices are helping that.

I'm not a tree hugger, but getting that way more every year as I see what is happening to my grandchildrens land. I'm very guilty of burning some questionable things in my wood furnace, but still wonder if it is not better than in a landfill.

Go to south of the border and see what our big business companies do with their waste. Seems funny they have property in Mexico that has no buildings, just a small stream.

Recycling just makes good sence, but it should be at the curbside to be effective. Our landfill is a half hr drive, so fuel that also messes up our air is taking it's toll as well.

Indians were here first, and I wonder how they would just cry at what we have done. I never throw anything from a car window, and certianly hope that my granchildren can get a clean drink of water.

All our big corperate farms may polute more than we like, but the older farms use water shed for removing manure, has always been that way. I recall as a child cleaning the hog floor off just prior to a rain so the manure would head for the stream.

I do construction work and kind of wonder how a shingle (that is very bad) can become OK if I give them lots of money. It is mixed in the same pile as the household trash. I'm very thankfull the landfill is not in my back yard however.

I burn wood as I stated before, and I just can't get over how much heat I can get from my household waste. Junk mail, boxes etc. Our fire department burns the brush pile for the town from time to time and I can't help but wonder how many houses that would have heated. I'm sure that someone has studied how much usable energy we waste with household trash, and bet we would be surprised.

My thoughts go to this town of 700 building a very large building with volenteer help. Placing a big wood furnace and heating the fire department and city hall etc. with clean burnable household waste. Comunity service is big in our justice system, and the imates enjoy doing something besides sitting in a cell. Many towns pick up the prisioners and use the free help, many are great workers, that found the wrong trail in life.

A large factory that makes plastic parts have many chillers that could heat lots of houses, tax breaks may help.

Another thing that I feel amusing is our county recieves $113,976,581 in corn payments in the last ten years. I can not think of any farmer getting these payments that burns corn for heat in their houses or hog buildings. We have many many acres in the set aside program that if turned into corn or soybean crops would probably give us enough fuel to make it free to our military and state owned vehickles. That is just a guess, but certianly seems like a step in good common sence. Again I best go take my blood pressure pills and get something done around here. Thanks for the therapy.

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RickL

02-14-2008 05:07:48




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
must be territory thing,my dumpster just had 5 8ft tubes in it they never said anything. Anyone need card board I really hate pitching so much uin dumpster but it fills the shop up to quick storing it. I take loads to the recycle when go that way but still just alot of it. get thirty one boxes of every item to assemble kinze planters about every other day . Wooden crates also if anyone wants some or pallets

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02-14-2008 05:17:55




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to RickL, 02-14-2008 05:07:48  
Check with your local Wal-Mart on the cardboard. They bale cardboard in their back rooms and would probably be happy to get it. They get cash for each bale. At the same time recycling it.



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Nolan (foxtrapper)

02-14-2008 03:35:20




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
Thank god for strong black plastic bags. They solve many a disposal problem.

It gets downright funny here at my local landfill. Now granted most of it is because of the witch-in-the-window who refuses to let homeowners bring in even old shoes or such.

Anyhow, they've got a long driveway that goes between two high berms. It's remarkable the number of vehicles that she turns away that come out of the driveway empty. My goodness way tires and such sprout in the walls of those berms!

BTW, let me know if you ever find someone that actually takes brake fluid. Absolutely no one ever seems to know what to do with the stuff.

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Hobo,NC

02-14-2008 16:08:52




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Nolan (foxtrapper), 02-14-2008 03:35:20  
brake fluid,,, burns rite good,,, I pour it in my wast oil no problem,,, if I can i save it,,, it makes a good parts cleaner to soak small parts in if you have the time,,, rinse the parts off with water.



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36 coupe

02-15-2008 02:31:24




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Hobo,NC, 02-14-2008 16:08:52  
Brake fluid is a good penetrating oil, better than some of the stuff you buy.



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IH2444

02-13-2008 23:05:10




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
Just break em up and put em in a box.



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Bob Huntress

02-13-2008 21:00:22




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to doug in illinois, 02-13-2008 20:51:15  
Doug, welcome to a world of envoirnmental activism for hire. In the name of making the world safe for tree hugging, and bunny kissing, enviornmentalist have compelled our government to outlaw standard light bulbs, infavor of Mercury filled lights. I am not sure exactlly who concluded that we have to much pollution to not demand that all light bulbs be mercury filled, or more importantly, who payed him to promote the idea, but clearly we are allowing "Green" to replace intelligence and sound judgement.

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36 coupe

02-15-2008 03:27:30




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Bob Huntress, 02-13-2008 21:00:22  
A woman dropped one of these new fluorecent bulbs on her rug,it broke. An enviro outfit told her it would cost 2 grand to clean up.Ive tried the new screw base lamps,they are crap and you cant get rid of them.Failure rate is high and they have 22 plus small parts that can burn.I had one get dim, go out and begin to stink and smoke.This was back in 83.I opened up 2 that had failed and found 4 resistor burnt to a crisp.The bare feed wires were blue from overheating.These were us made,UL and CSA Approved.It would have made sense to put a 1 amp pigtail fuse in the input but the mfg wouldnt spend 25 cents more.I have 6 duds that never lasted 7 years.I do have some 40 year old tubes made by the Duro Co in my shop that are 40 years old.The new 40s dont seem to last, the skinny ones are junk.I cant use the new lites outdoors,in my barn or wood shed.Ive stocked up on 130 volt incandescents.I have 3 fluorescent in my kitchen fan light.3 of them have developed a bad time lag so I keep a 25 cent 60 watt bulb in the fixture so I can see to put wood in the cook stove at 4 am.I have 3 kerosene lamps and 3 lanterns ready to use when the power quits.Powers off in many areas here. Tv is telling where shelters are open for people with out power.I have unloaded cordwood and hunted cows that didnt come up to the barn with a lantern.Flashlites always seem to go out when needed .Nicad batteries are the worst kind they start out fine and go out.

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Bendee

02-15-2008 04:15:42




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to 36 coupe, 02-15-2008 03:27:30  
"TV is telling where shelters are open for people without power." Without an alternate power source the ones without power would be hardpressed to see it on TV> I hear the new enviromental globes are worse than the ones being replaced,hear they have mercury inside.



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36 coupe

02-15-2008 04:57:59




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Bendee, 02-15-2008 04:15:42  
All fluorescent lamps have some mercury inside to make the gas conductive,they wont light with out the mercury.Maine has banned mercury thermometers and thermostats yet they are pushing fluorescent lamps.My own experience with these cfl replacements is not good.They have a high failure rate.I have opened a couple that look like they could be a fire hazard.I have had one go dim then out and begin to stink and smoke.The tv bits on shelters is strange.I dont leave my home when the power goes out.I have 2 wood stoves, kerosene lanterns and lamps and 3 or more gallons of kerosene.In the warmer months I have a hand pump on my well.I have a small generator that will keep the freezer and refrigerator cold.Extra food is kept on hand,during the 98 ice storm there were people out of food in 3 days.Many had no candles or lamps.Most food stores cant function with out electric power.Price scanners wont work,items are not marked with prices now.People with electric can openers cant open a tin of beans when the power goes out.

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Stan in Oly, WA

02-14-2008 07:00:21




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Bob Huntress, 02-13-2008 21:00:22  
Hi Bob,

What intelligence? What sound judgement? Are we living on the same planet? I just finished reading a book about a young woman who sailed around the world alone twenty years ago. She described being in the Mediterranean at that time as never being out of sight of floating garbage. I read online recently that there is an area the size of Texas in the Pacific north of the Hawaiian Islands where ocean currents create sort of an eddy and it is almost totally covered with floating plastic garbage. Several years ago National Geographic magazine featured pictures of Eastern European industrial areas---absolutely no environmental protection laws to slow industry down. It looked like hell on a bad day.

Environmental laws are misinterpreted, misused, abused, and often seem quite stupid because all laws are that way. Name one sensible law that most people don't misunderstand, ignore, and complain about, and I'll go sit down and be quiet.

All the best, Stan

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Tim B from MA

02-14-2008 11:05:42




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Stan in Oly, WA, 02-14-2008 07:00:21  
I second that sentiment Stan. My wife and I still own our first house (now a rented to brother-in-law) it is on a pond supplied by a stream that runs through the local, huge metal forge, formerly owned by the Air Force. The 70-sum year old neighbor that lived there all his life tells us about the pond turning green and read and white and having oil slicks pretty regularly. I'm sure it would still be that way if it weren't for environmental laws.

I work as an environmental consultant so I know the laws and regulations can seem, and often are stupid (the way the regulator use them is often the bigger problem) but we'd have an awful ugly world without them.

If people are bothered by them too much, they could always move to China - lots of economic oppurtunity there too - that is until their water runs out LOL.

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36 coupe

02-15-2008 03:58:12




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 11:05:42  
Arent you the same fellow who complained about a mickey mouse fuse in your welder.Recyling may be good but its a fertile ground for a new class of crooks.I see a lot of junk on the roadside here.Mattresses and old sofas seem to be the best items.Friend and went down some discontinued roads looking for flowers he wanted to trans plant.Plenty of old stoves, washers dryers etc dumped along these roads.I was fishing at a small pond last year.Picked up a few beer cans and bottles, tossed them in the back of my pickup.Beautiful little pond,while looking for another place to fish I came across a pickup load of household trash.Some of it in the water.Called the town clerk of that town,she said she would have the town highway crew to clean up.Stopped to fish at a lake on the way home.A fellow was picking bottles and cans out of 2 trash cans there.I gave him what I had.He was a viet nam vet with cancer from agent orange.Our gov gave him about 200.00 a month dis ability.He had to buy most of his meds.Gov care of vets is disgaceful.The vet I talked with looked very sick.My friend has 85% hearing loss from a mortar shell.It took 6 months to get new hearing aids.Im fed up with enviro nuts...

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bill mart

02-16-2008 07:21:21




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to 36 coupe, 02-15-2008 03:58:12  
Do you think its ethical to travel discontinued roads looking for flowers to transplant? The property they are on still belongs to someone.Wouldnt that be considered stealing? Beautiful little pond, looking to fish. Without permission wouldn't that be considered trespassing?



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36 coupe

02-16-2008 14:30:15




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to bill mart, 02-16-2008 07:21:21  
First off, they are still public roads open to the public.The pond is not posted.My friend dug two Trillium plants that would have gotten a junk refrigerator dumped on them.These old roads have a 66 foot right of way.You assume a lot without knowing the facts.



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bill mart

02-16-2008 18:54:13




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to 36 coupe, 02-16-2008 14:30:15  
You are right, I am making an assumption."public roads open to the public",so does that mean you could cut a pine tree down on public land and use it for your christmas tree?I think there is a difference in public use and the public removing things from public land. Trilliums in NY are endangered and Therefore protected.And just because land isnt posted it doent give you the right to tresspass.



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36 coupe

02-18-2008 13:15:15




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to bill mart, 02-16-2008 18:54:13  
WE dont use pine trees for Christmas trees.Most folks drive into the city with a bow saw and look for a nice Colorado blue spruce on some ones lawn...



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36 coupe

02-17-2008 14:44:21




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to bill mart, 02-16-2008 18:54:13  
You must be a gov.official.This aint NY,people are not up tight here.Around May first people will be out picking fiddle head fern tops here.I have a 5 acre lot thats loaded with them.I pick a bag full and the neighbors are welcome to pick the rest.I have 150 acres of unposted land that neighbors hunt on.I have a wild apple tree on the corner of my garden lot that hang over the fence.A good pie and sauce apple.It was loaded with apples last fall.I invited neighbors to pick what they needed.Not much posted land here,neighbors help each other with chores Trilliums are common here,they have an awful smell.Town wont spend money to prosecute people who pick flowers along public roads.A friend brings me black walnuts that clutter his lawn.Bill.go bother someone else.....

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dieselpaul

02-13-2008 22:08:01




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Bob Huntress, 02-13-2008 21:00:22  

you know; back when i was a kid, we used to find mercury filled gauges in oil patch junk yards--thought it was neat to watch it splatter & gather back up--[remember terminator? also polished coins, rubbing them in our hands--have no idea of effects--our hands were mostly grimed up from oil while we were junkin' so got 2 things to worry about--maybe thats why it took me 2 hrs to write this-----

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dieselpaul

02-13-2008 21:56:09




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to Bob Huntress, 02-13-2008 21:00:22  

you know; back when i was a kid, we used to find mercury filled gauges in oil patch junk yards--thought it was neat to watch it splatter & gather back up--[remember terminator? also polished coins, rubbing them in our hands--could be why it took me 2 hrs to type this--o well----



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JMS/.MN

02-14-2008 16:57:22




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to dieselpaul, 02-13-2008 21:56:09  
Our local school had a mercury spill two years ago- cost about $130,000 to clean up - carpets, air ducts, etc. Way overblown situation. Remember playing with mercury as a kid- had a mercury vacuum gauge on the milker pump "Authorities" say it is not much of a danger to play with it- ie, skin contact- it is the vapors given off that are dangerous. I think it is still overblown, just like the asbestos issue. Lawyers paradise. Mesothelioma, etc., in the VA magazine.

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36 coupe

02-15-2008 04:28:30




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 Re: OT: garbage haulers/ hazardous waste in reply to JMS/.MN, 02-14-2008 16:57:22  
Mercury would have quite a time getting into air ducts unless it was heated.We have a new class of crooks in suits collecting big money for doing nothing.I remember seeing a tv bit where 4 feet of asbestos wrap was removed from a boiler pipe.Fellow doing it had on a 3.00 paper bunny suit and dust mask.A 5.00 plastic tent covered the job.Cost the home owner 800.00.The asbestos insulation could have been give a coat of sodium silicate to seal it.Cost 5.00.Fellow saw asbestos waste bags being ripped open while being bulldozed at a giant landfill here.Waste is being trucked from MA.and buried there,who knows what is in these trucks.They go by here in convoys.Every truck goes back empty because they stink so bad.Each truck uses 100 of diesel fuel to make the trip.100 gal would heat my house for one month.

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