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O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward!

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Sean Feeney 2

12-30-2007 05:40:09




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Watching T.V. last night, they were jacking up a 1970's- 1980's car (first cars I ever jacked up} Bumper jack little slot in bumper lifts the whole car right off the ground, nice and strong. Last week on the T.V. there complaining about Thousands of dollars in damage to new cars at 5mph crash. go figure? My son tells me the T.V. set I watch will be no good in a year. its not HD? I have 4-5 sets that work just fine for me, but somebody has decided that the need to be in a landfill with another 20 million sets. Music went from records to 8 track to cassette to cd now mp3, I think its just a plain waste, I still use a 68 year old tractor.

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JML755

01-04-2008 08:20:59




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
BLT,

2 years ago, I bought a used '01 Silverado, V6, 5 spd manual trans, rubber floor mats, work truck to replace a '94 Ranger p/u with a stick. Main reason for manual trans has been to have my daughters learn how to drive a stick at 16. You're right. I had a heck of a time finding one. I found 2 within a hundred mile. All 3 daughters have cried as their first driving experiences were jerking, stalling parades around the local school parking lot. BUT... they learned and today they are proud and appreciative of the experience. I also like the idea of them driving around in something with some mass. On a rainy day, my middle daughter wiped out a highway guardrail headon, shearing off 4 - 6x8 posts at ground level and leaving the guadrail a twisted mess. NO damage to the chromed steel bumper of the truck.

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BLT

12-31-2007 14:48:09




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
I hear you. I wish I could buy a new 1957 GMC pickup or a brand new 620 John Deere, and a lot of other things that come to mind. There is so much ridiclious nonsense on and about new pickups its pathetic. I would think that a manufacturer could make a profit by creating a truck that was useable for a workman or a farmer. Now even the plainest plain jane truck has too much accessories on it. The GM dealer told me it would be very difficult to find a truck with a standard tran. and a rubber floormat. And how about a family car, it would sure be nice of someone would come out with one with headroom as an option. Man will never be content with zero progress, but why is it when a good useable product comes on the market it is discontinued in favor of a piece of junk. Now if you buy a simple hairbrush you would probably get 12 pages of instructions in 12 different languages and another 12 pages of warnings and disclaimers.

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NE IA

12-31-2007 08:14:10




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
Did any of you guys take the family out to a resterant for home cooking?

I tell my friends who make crap of my old tractors that they realy screwed up putting electric starters an rubber tires on tractors.

I was helping a auctioneer a few years ago, and got stuck for starting a big consel color tv for a dollar. I brought it home and my youngest son wanted to know where the remote was, and how do you change channels without a remote. My coment was simply just ask your older sister? She spent many hrs trying to convince mom and dad that the show that was on was her favorite rather than her having to get up and change it.

One night after a EMS meeting I stayed around to clean up a bit with my seven year old son. It was a real cold night,and the wind was wild. The pagers went off and as I left with the rig I told my son that to watch TV, and if it took me along time to call his uncle to take him home. When I got back to the station a couple hrs later I noticed a tear in the sons eye. I asked why he did not call his uncle? As another tear formed in his eye he said how--with that?. A old rotary phone.

I have to say that those were the good ol days when you used that type of phone. You could talk to a human being, and they spoke english, and seldom played phone tag after a machine answers, and of course they will call you back sometime. Yet as I think back to when there were no phones / TV / electricity---well we all pretty much think alike.

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Dick2

12-31-2007 07:27:26




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
There will be vouchers available from the governmint, as mentioned by oldfarmtractor below. The window of opportunity will open Feb. 1, 2008, and will close March 31, 2008, to apply for two vouchers/coupons that will get you $40 off each black box from a retailer (for $50 - $75). The black box is to put on top of your old TV to convert the digital signal back to analog so you can see it on your old TV.

The info that I read said that those vouchers/coupons, will only be good for 90 days, so you have to call or send for them on time and use them on time or it will cost you more money.

We're going to get two for our TV sets, even though we might end up getting one new TV as ours is getting old.

Nobody can tell me, but I think we'll be able to still use our big antenna along with the converter box. The HD/digital antennas in the store look exactly like the one we have.

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circus

12-31-2007 16:07:07




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 present antenna will be fine in reply to Dick2, 12-31-2007 07:27:26  
my 25 year old antenna works good with the digital TV



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circus

12-30-2007 22:13:30




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 More like tweaking that change in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
More like tweaking that change. At least about the TV change over. Crappie old sets will look great, get more free channels and, with a DVR, skips commercials. The digital tuners are due any time now. Gossip is $60. When did the lowest mpg become the measure of manhood? Everyone knows it's the size of your tractor! Did you ever listen to a tape recording? Good riddance. No big changes have happened for 100 years. Electricity, radio, telephone, vehicles, planes, plumbing, vaccination.

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Tradititonal Farmer

12-30-2007 19:01:43




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
Real progress will be made when we are smart enough to go back in time to when were not wasting time looking at TV



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Oldmax

12-30-2007 16:32:33




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
gtalI still have my Land line and DON'T have a Cell phone and will neaver have one . Had to carry one for years on job . At the age parents are giving their kids cell phones . Most of them will have their brains cooked by the time they are 40 cell phones are the same wave length as microwave ovens , less power but given enough time will do same job when held to ear long enough.
The main reason for changing to digtal is you can get 500 TV stations in the same bandwith as one analog one that free up a lot of freq for the Feds to sell rights to . It all comes down to MONEY .

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oldfarmtractor

12-30-2007 11:35:20




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
I have no problem with progress. Newer cars use less fuel and thus we send less money to the Oil Rick countries.

DTV will free up frequencies that should have been moved years ago. With the coming of Cell Phones and the WiMax for the computer, we need the bandwidth. I wonder how many people are still using wires for their phones.

You will be able to get two vouchers, each for $40.00 to help offset the cost of the DTV conversion.

Remember when they began to send color TV signals over the air? And they were forced to continue to broadcast the Black and White?

Do you remember when all TV's were forced to included UHF besides the typical VHF?

Do you remember when they mandated defrosters in ALL cars?

Boy is change difficult but I sure wouldn't enjoy life as much if it didn't occur.

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Daniel Bear Kelley

12-30-2007 11:23:16




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
My wife was rear-ended once in our Olds Delta 88. Literally no damage to our car. The bumper was pushed in on its shock mounts. Two taps with a rubber mallet on the back of the bumper, and it popped back into place. The other car was totalled. All the crush zones crushed. The hood crumpled. The air bags deployed. Popped radiator. Steam everywhere. It was beautiful.
.
When we moved from Dallas to Colorado Springs, two guys were helping my wife load a truck. One of them said to the other, "Why don't you grab that bumper over in the corner, and put it on the truck?" The other wrapped his arms around it and heaved. The bumper didn't move. The other guy called him a "Wuss" and other names, and then tried to move the bumper himself. No go. It was a heavy two-man lift. Such is the steel in my Chrysler New Yorker. :-)
.
The old stomp switch (high beams) on the floor of my truck costs $5 and takes 5 minutes to replace--not that I have ever had to replace it. The new cars have all these stalk mounted controls. A replacement dimmer switch costs $100 or more, takes three hours or more to install, and lasts about 50,000 miles.
.
I bought my 3/4 ton, extended cab pickup for $2500 in 1990 (17 years ago). I put in one replacement engine (440cid) for about $5000, a couple years back. (Good engine!) I put in a replacement transmission a few years back. License plates cost $200 for 5 years. No pollution inspection required. Insurance is $40 a month. Why should I spend $30,000 for a new truck, plus financing, plus several hundred a year for plates, plus several hundred a month for insurance?
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Real engines are measured in Cubic Inches!
.
To answer the question: We are going backwards, but only the ignorant think it is going forwards.

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MarkB_MI

12-30-2007 09:46:06




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
The way progress works is that you have to give something up in order to get something else. Considering that the current analog NTSC standard is over sixty years old, I think the change to high definition TV is well overdue.

Cars today are more complex and lighter because they have to meet much more stringent emission and mileage requirements. I don't think anyone wants a car that gets 12 mpg today, and emissions controls have helped improve air quality in the major cities.

Sure, your 68 year old tractor works perfectly good today, but I'll bet it isn't being used the same as it was new. Back when it was new, it might have been the only tractor on a full size family farm. Would somebody today try to make a living farming with just that one tractor? I doubt it.

Much of the planned obsolesence is maddening: computers that you throw away after two or three years is a good example. But don't expect technology to stand still during your lifetime. Even the Amish adopt "new" technology from time to time.

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KEB1

12-30-2007 09:44:07




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
Those bumper jacks are the most dangerous things in the world. They have no trouble picking up the car, but they also have no sidways stability at all. I actaully have a vehicle slip sideways off of one one time. There was so little weight on the opposite side wheel that it couldn't keep from sliding. Luckily I had already put the spare on and was tightening bolts when it happened.

Blame fuel economy for getting rid of the old steel bumpers - lighter cars get better fuel economy, hence the move to lighter bumpers (and everything else).

Broadcast TV is going to a digital format, not high definition (HD). If you watch broadcast TV, all you'll need is an adapter box to convert the digital format to analog. Should be a relatively small expense. Satellite TV (Dish & DirectTV) and most cable systems are already digital, and there will be no changes needed.

Keith

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davpal

12-30-2007 10:20:45




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to KEB1, 12-30-2007 09:44:07  
I think what he was saying is the new bumpers offer no protection to the cosmetic parts. I have a navigator and that front got cracked and it was $500 dollars to replace and repaint. 88 ford truck got backed into hard by cousins wife and it just bounced off that big chrome bumper with the rubber strip in the middle. No repair money. My biggest complaint on technology now is the dashes in new vehicles. Made out of cheap plastic parts and not able to access them. Takes 20 hours of frustrating work to change a heater core. Dashes should be built of components that you can access with a flip down panel. And for what its worth the new vehicles are not lighter than older ones. If anything they are heavier. Just loaded with all kinds of gadgets and stuff. My navigator weighs over 6000 lbs. Old 1979 full sized Bronco probably scaled at less than 5500.

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KEB1

12-30-2007 11:57:14




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to davpal, 12-30-2007 10:20:45  
Car design, like everything else, is driven by what sells. Like I've said before, when easy maintenance becomes a marketing factor, the car manufacturers will start considering that in the design. Until then, manufacturing costs, emissions and fuel economy are king. Simple economics.

Keith



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Stan in Oly, WA

12-30-2007 09:43:38




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
Hi Sean,

If you buy DVD's, start getting ready to store them alongside your 8 track and VHS tapes. Blue Ray is on its way to becoming the new industry standard.

Full-throttle capitalism requires an ever expanding market. The interests of the owners of the means of production are never served by producing goods that last a long time. In the 50's and 60's, if I remember correctly, there was a much greater emphasis on style than there is today. Perfectly good cars were rendered obsolete because they were visibly old style.

Today, technology has largely replaced style as the force creating obsolescence. It's less transparently arbitrary than style; many car buyers could see that higher tail fins, or oval turn signal lights rather than round, conferred no real advantage in what a car was basically for. DVD's, on the other hand, have enormous capabilities over VHS tapes.

The real beauty of technological advance as a force of obsolescence, however, is that it makes obsolescence a matter of function rather than a matter of taste. You used to be able to keep an old car running for decades for far less than the cost of buying a new one, but that's often not even an option with many categories of today's consumer goods. For example, unless your computer can do everything you need within your own four walls, it doesn't matter whether its performance and features are all you need. In a relatively short time it will be essentially unable to connect with the outside world.

If you think this situation is going to self-correct any time soon, I'd say don't hold your breath. Multi-national corporations are the true rulers of this country (as they have been in Japan for decades); politicians are quickly becoming paid figureheads whose function is to provide a semblence of legitimacy for laws that benefit corporations rather than citizens. Start watching for new laws that make exposure to advertising mandatory in some circumstances. They will be represented as protecting your freedom of choice under the First Amendment. You might think I'm an alarmist, or even a lunatic. You don't have to accept what I'm saying, though---just keep watching.

Happy New Year, though, Stan

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36 coupe

01-01-2008 04:30:32




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Stan in Oly, WA, 12-30-2007 09:43:38  
Take a look at all the cameras watching you everywhere.Read Orwells book 1984.He was off a few years on the timing.



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rodgernbama

12-30-2007 09:48:09




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Stan in Oly, WA, 12-30-2007 09:43:38  
Well said Stan!



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wyod

12-30-2007 08:30:14




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
According to the info I've heard, your set will continue to work with the addition of an "adaptor box" to receive signals on the new frequencies. Last I knew, gub'ment was debating whether to provide one free box to each household... another brilliant use of OUR hard-earned tax dollars. From what I understand, the gub'ment decided that the frequencies used for decades by television broadcasts were better suited for emergency radio communications (police-fire) so mandated that broadcasting networks abandon their use. D

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Annn

12-30-2007 08:41:14




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to wyod, 12-30-2007 08:30:14  
only some of the frequencies are going to the emergency services uses (police, fire,etc).

The rest are being auctioned off to be used for wireless networking, cell phones, or other such commercial services.



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RustyFarmall

12-30-2007 08:00:16




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
Your T.V. will be just fine, however, a roof top antennae or a set of rabbit ears will no longer work. Cable or satellite will still function.



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Slowpoke

12-31-2007 23:47:52




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to RustyFarmall, 12-30-2007 08:00:16  
According to a consumer reporter on the local TV station the antenna will still work IF you have the converter box.



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paul

12-30-2007 16:14:00




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to RustyFarmall, 12-30-2007 08:00:16  
I think you guys are wrong on the cable. They send out a signal on the regular tuner-box channels. They will go digital as well, and you will need a digital tuner box to recieve cable. New TVs will be digital only, so they have to go with that flow.

Either you will have to pay for tuner boxes on your cable, or the cable co will have to and raise their rates enough to cover the cost - so you will pay either way.

Now, what happens to all our VCRs & DVD recorders? They come with analog tuners. Attaching a digital box is cumbersome at best, setting recordings is difficult.

They have been talking about TVs for a while, that's fine, folks are thinking about it.

But, we will be landfilling 95% of our VCRs and then probably buying a DVD digital recorder. So, we can landfill allt he VHS tapes as well.

What good are one or 2 converter boxes at 1/2 (inflated) price from the govt? We all have 2-3 TVs, 1-2 VCRs in our houses.

Toss it all out, ging to be a big spending spree, won't be able to find a TV or recorder to buy next Nov through April, won't be any sales needed either, pay fullprice.

This is going to hit people a lot harder than they realize.

--->Paul

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Gun guru

12-30-2007 07:14:58




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
It seems that the electronics execs bribed the lawmakers so that everyone will have to go out and buy new TVs. We all get screwed. Makes ya sick.



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tn terry t

12-30-2007 06:16:13




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to Sean Feeney 2, 12-30-2007 05:40:09  
ive been checking on that very subject if your connected to dish network or direct tv your tv will still work! im not sure about cable what ive read only if you get your signal thru broad cast will you be effected there a web site explaining all this stuff if i can find it again i will post the site



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dave guest

12-31-2007 19:03:04




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to tn terry t, 12-30-2007 06:16:13  
Ditto on everything, you guys. High def. TVconsumer reports says cable company will be responsible for making things work. I probably hate change worse than anybody. Use dial phones and would have a party line if wife let me.



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tn terry t

12-30-2007 06:24:10




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 Re: O/T Are we going backwards thinking its foward! in reply to tn terry t, 12-30-2007 06:16:13  
ok i found the site so copy and paste


http://dtvfacts.com/digital-tv-facts-for-satellite-viewers/



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