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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Microsoft Vista vs. Apple

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S. Crum

11-23-2007 05:12:58




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I need to get another computer for in the house for my daughter to use for her online chat and other stuff. Seems like everytime I go to use my computer it's full of virus's and spyware and runs slower than s**t. Everywhere I've checked the new computers are supplied only with Windows Vista. Everyone I've talked too says don't do Vista. That's coming from college nerds right down to bums like me. Even Dell with their "we build it your way" BS won't supply anything but Vista. I'm told that to go to Vista, I would basically need to learn the computer all over again and have to change over all 4 computers I have to Vista for them to remain networked. In essence what the computer suppliers are saying is "too bad if you want a blue truck, we sell only red trucks, take it or leave it'.I guess if I must learn a new operating system, maybe I should look at Apple? I'm told these are highly stable and worlds better than Microsoft in speed, ability and security.
What do you guys like?

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tractorhank

11-24-2007 19:41:06




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
I have 3 Apple machines that are about 2 1/2 years old and have had virtually no problems with them. Don't even use anti-virus program. I also have 2 newer PC's and hate them - have had nothing but trouble and they take forever to start up. In 20 years of running computers I have only had 1 virus on my Apple and 1 hard drive failure on a 5 yr old machine. Definitely go with one of the new Apple/PC machines. They are more expensive to start with, but much cheaper in the long haul without the frustration and lost productivity.

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Randy S.E. MN.`

11-24-2007 13:57:30




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Mister...you are WRONG about ordering what you want from Dell. I ordered TWO brand new Dells last month for my automotive shop...I requested XP pro only...NO vista...and they said no problem at all, and XP pro is exactly what I got. Randy



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S. Crum

11-24-2007 15:25:51




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to Randy S.E. MN.`, 11-24-2007 13:57:30  
No..I'm not wrong! I called Dell and explained what I wanted in a system and she set me right up and said NO PROBLEM...UNTIL I said I wanted XP pro instead of Vista, PROBLEM!!!! we won't supply XP with that system only Vista. Why not? We don't, BUT we have other systems available with XP. "how much we talking now?" A system configured like you want will be $200 more with XP. Ma'am you have a nice Thanksgiving. I bought an E-Machines with XP last night at Walmart 298 bucks. No muss, no fuss
Thanks everyone for your help!

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T_Bone

11-24-2007 13:34:49




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Hi Steve,

See my Vista comments under my new thread topic
"OT: Vista XP Must Read!!!"

T_Bone



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steve from mo - dangit!

11-24-2007 05:58:56




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 Networking considerations. in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Are you sure you want to have the daughter"s Internet, IM, and email computer hooked into your network?

I think you could avoid a lot of problems with the other boxes if you put hers outside your network, or at least limit her access to a printer and disallow any file or program access to the other computers. Easiest way I can think of would be to give each user a separate logon and password, and limit sharing on your hard drives to your password.

Someone like Augie could probably think of a dozen other and maybe better ways.

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buickanddeere

11-24-2007 07:17:44




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 Re: Networking considerations. in reply to steve from mo - dangit!, 11-24-2007 05:58:56  
I agree. Put the daughter on with limited access instead of full access. How old is the daughter and what is she into? She will be more careful if she works & purchases her own computer. Vista operating system is where you pay MicroSoft to own your computer and block out non Microsoft software. If staying with MicroCrap purchase your new XP Pro now. Myself we are going Apple/Mac on the next purchase.

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onefarmer

11-24-2007 05:29:44




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Another thing you can do is buy whatever new computer you want, remove vista, and install xp. Just go thru the devise manager first and write down what the modem, sound card, network, and video are and download xp drivers for them.



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Coloken

11-24-2007 06:56:32




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to onefarmer, 11-24-2007 05:29:44  
Kind of late to answer this but any way... This is one of the problems T-bone got into. New computer has drivers for vista-but no drivers available for XP Old computer-has drivers for XP, no drivers for Vista. Newer Sound and video boards no XP drivers. Lots of fun!



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steve from mo - dangit!

11-24-2007 19:56:24




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to Coloken, 11-24-2007 06:56:32  
Nearly all of the hardware manufacturers will provide drivers for any OS on their website. You do an inventory of devices using the device manager, go get the proper downloads, and burn them onto a CD. Load your new OS, and IF it doesn't find a driver for the device, you have it on disk.



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rockyhawaii

11-23-2007 21:29:59




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
I must be the only guy that has no problems with VISTA. I've been running it about a year now, hooked on the same line with an old XP and have had no problems whatsoever. The one difference I see is that the VISTA machine is a lot faster.



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WantACaseLASomeday

11-23-2007 18:50:01




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to 135 Fan, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
The organization I work for has over 16,000 computers on the network. Govt school system with 48,000 students and 8,000 employees. We do not allow Apple, period. We allow Windoze, Sun Solaris (servers), Red Hat Linux but not Apple. Way too much stuff that just won't work with the Mac operating system.
You can order a new Dell with Ubuntu on it - it's a nice flavor of Linux. There are some very good open source applications for it that work seamlessly with Windoze files.

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Garu from Muleshoe

11-23-2007 15:05:40




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
We bought a PC at work with Vista on it, had to take it in and have XP put on it so it would run our programs. The guy that did the work for us said Vista is Junk, don't buy it. I with Coloken buy a used one with XP. As far as your viruses and spyware problems you need to see if your IP has a program they can run for that helps to block a bunch of that stuff. Our IP has it for about $10.00 extra a month it is well worth the money. I have not had a virus or any problems in two years since using the program.

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Gary from Muleshoe

11-23-2007 15:07:24




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to Garu from Muleshoe, 11-23-2007 15:05:40  
You know it"s been a long day when you can"t spell you name right. LOL



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TractormanNC

11-23-2007 12:58:05




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  

I hate Apple. I hate Microsoft. I hate Windows. Six months ago I was running windows xp and sometimes having to reboot 4 maybe 5-6 times a day. It would lock up and respond to nothing except the power switch!!!! I am now a happy Linux user. it is not perfect but it is a d**n sight better than windows. Tried Ubuntu, didn't work too well. now using Fedora Core 7 (I think) later versions are out.

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john908

11-23-2007 10:22:44




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
I use Linux and love it.Your daughter will hate it.She would like a Mac and you would have less problems,otherwise find a XP machine and you will be forever dealing with it.



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dlplost

11-23-2007 10:17:31




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Follow the link to for the VISTA story. Many GVT agencys have switched to using LINUX and APPLE, LINUX still not as user friendly as it should be but it's getting better.
AS a confirmed APPLE hatter, even I would switch to APPLE before I used VISTA.



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Bob - MI

11-23-2007 09:55:55




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
You can get computers with XP on them at New Egg and from Gateway. Gateway has them on their business site. New Egg search under "business machines" will also get you some good choices. I'm sure that Dell does the same thing but I am not Dell fan. I learned to speak english with a middle-eastern accent after a serious crash issue with my daughter's Dell 8400. Next day service took 2 weeks to resolve the problem and 1 day after the warranty expired they forced me to buy the $250.00 extended warranty for 3 more years.

Lots of folks complaining about Vista but I've never used it. I have all the machines at work and the ones at home running XP Pro. I am thinking about getting my daughter a laptop for her college graduation present and I don't know which OS to go with. One thing I do know is that people who use Mac love them and they hate PC's. There has to be something there that the rest of us are missing out on. I bet too many of us remember Beta and VHS wars.

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RustyFarmall

11-23-2007 09:22:13




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
I just recently acquired a brand new toshiba laptop with Vista installed. The vista really is not a problem, it is layed out a bit different, but if you have mastered windows XP, the vista will not be a problem. If I can make it work, anyone can do it.

Also, download and install the AVG free anti-virus protection. It is totally free, and is one of the best virus protection soft ware programs there is.

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Coloken

11-23-2007 08:34:23




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Buy a used computer with XP on it. I have made and run several Vista computers and am giving up on them, they require special drivers and have too much unwanted junk. Like trying to update themselves once or twice a week. Used computers are very cheap..try craigslist or local paper. If you want to try Linux just get a used computer and a CD with ubuntu. Its the easest version I know of to install and will take care of web, mail and office programs. You do know that all linux programs are free--you pay for rhe CD tho. Apples are great if you are a rich person.

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Bill-KCKs

11-23-2007 07:43:21




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Take a look at the off-lease business-class machines at Dell Finance. Most come with XP.

I really wish Linux would give Windows a run for its money. Ubuntu is starting to "get there."

Last, dump M/S Internet Explorer and use Firefox. Install Spybot S&D, and Adaware. Use a firewall other than the built-in XP firewall. And try AVG anti-virus.

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TomZ

11-23-2007 06:27:18




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
As a computer user since 1984 and a program writer and hacker that doesn�t accept the way companies throw their programs at you. I find a way to modify everything I don�t like. I will say that unless you have some very special program needs that may not be available in a Mac version I would go with an IMac with 20� screen. It will seem huge at first but soon you will wonder how you ever survived without it. I can let anyone use it and don�t worry about them installing downloaded programs and no virus programs are needed. The information you have on networking is not true. I am using an old laptop that I bought with 95 and I added more memory and changed the system to ME and I am networked with Win 2000, XP and Vista along with my IMac. All my computers share the same HP 6310xi plugged into my DSL modem with an Ethernet Cat5 cable. The only problem I have with networking is that I can�t connect the ME computer to the IMac but I can use the Mac to transfer files to the ME computer so it�s not a big deal. All the NTFS systems (2000,NT,XP and Vista) work well together and interface with the Mac flawlessly. MS Office for the Mac has no problems transferring back and forth from any of the versions on the PC. No matter what you decide you can network to your hearts content with all of them. If I were to purchase a PC I would buy it with Vista. Yes it is different but so is the Mac. I have a number of old programs and I have yet to find one that will not run on Vista but I know they are out there. Some old peripherals may not have drivers for Vista but in the same respect some of the old stuff will not have drivers for the Mac, like my 10 year old Olympus digital camera. But I plug the card into my printer and read the picture files to any computer on the network. I will buy a new laptop soon and it will probably be an HP with Vista from Sam�s because I like to stay current with all systems including Linux. From a 70 yr young hacker.
TomZ

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550Doug

11-23-2007 05:51:44




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
Avoid Vista!! I use OLD computers that run on old "relatively stable" Windows OSes like 98SE, 2K or XP. I used to have all sorts of viruses and adware problems until I re-formatted anew and AVOIDED MS IE as the browser. I only use Firefox or Opera as browsers, but my wife still has an e-mail account that she insists on using IE only for that.
I also highly recommend using Apple as it is a very secure OS and for young people's use of iTunes and iPhones, it is a logical choice.
When you go to Vista, you give up control of your own machine and you are still under the same umbrella as IE security problems.
Just my 2.5 cents!!

Good luck

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Ohio88

11-23-2007 05:50:22




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
You do not have to upgrade the other computers if you go to Vista. It is not a complete new learning experience. There are some differences but I have put Vista computers in for 5 people now and given them no new information and they are operating them just fine. The only question is why doesit ask me if it is okay to run a program when I started it. That is part of the new security. There are still a few specialized sofware packages that have not been completely tested on Vista but all of the packages we tried have worked with out issue.
As far as MAC vs PC that is a personal choice. There are benefits and draw backs to both.

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ldj

11-23-2007 05:49:57




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
You have been told wrong. I have a windows 98, a windows xp and a vista and they are networked together. The vista operating is basically the same as the other windows. If you work the others, you can use vista with no trouble. What is bad about vista is some of of you programs won't work. Example, my printer wouldn't work. I contacted the manufacturer and they sent me updated drivers for it and it works good. I have a friend that had Quicken and it wouldn't work with vista and there is no fix for it. He had to buy new quicken.

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Ohio88

11-23-2007 05:53:47




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to ldj, 11-23-2007 05:49:57  
The Quicken depends on which version you had to start with.

All Windows updates may require driver updates for devices but they are readily available on the WEB.



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Will- Tx.-Mn.

11-23-2007 05:47:08




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 Re: Microsoft Vista vs. Apple in reply to S. Crum, 11-23-2007 05:12:58  
I was @ my brother in laws' for the Holiday yesterday, and he's got an Apple,it worked fine
for me,I presently have Windows (the one b 4 Vista) but from what I've heard about Vista > no thanks!

The Apple has always cost more from the start,perhaps Mr. Jobs could of priced it accordingly, with Mr. Gates and taken over the market,but oh well he (Steve Jobs) seems to be
quite well these days with Ipod,Iphone and Apple
computer,and with Apple shares well over $165.00 @ share!

My next puter will be an Apple or Mac if you perfer

~Will

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