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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Gas Drill

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Bshugarts

09-10-2007 17:44:24




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Thinking about getting a gas powered drill for sap harvesting any recomendations




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Bshugarts

09-11-2007 17:43:11




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
Guys I have been using a 14.4 dewalt cordless drill for 4 years now and in the cold temperatures even with 3 xrp batteries can tap no more than 150 holes. then must head back to the shop to recharge. was a real drag last year with all the snow in western ny making all those trips back to get fresh batteries .seems like a gas tapper would be much more productive. O yea I lost count at about 2600 taps last year.

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jdemaris

09-12-2007 06:14:37




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-11-2007 17:43:11  
Yeah, that's been my experience. But, I still use 7/16" taps. Some guys are using smaller ones now - which I assume drill easier. I work alone now that my kids are all grown and gone (except for a new 4 year old). It takes me at least two weeks - in good weather - to get all my trees drilled and tapped. And, some years I've had to drill them twice. I've had zero problems with the gas tappers - and poor performance from 18 volt drills (I've got Ryobi,Makita,and Dewalt). Also, the gas jobs drill a lot faster than any battery-drill I've used. And, the old adapted chain-saw units drill faster yet. My neighbor bought a old crappy Homelite EZ years ago for $25 and stuck a drill-adapter on it with a left-hand 7/16" bit. I figured it wouldn't last one season, but he's on his 10th year with it now. But, as I posted previously, I did come across a guy that was using a battery-backpack of some sort - hooked to an electric drill. Hey, maybe it works well for him. Looked heavy and clumsy to me. For me? I'm in central New York, and the past couple of springs have had a lot of snow cover. Climbing steep hills in 2-3 feet of snow - I like to stay as light as possible. I find a gas drill a lot more convenient to carry - than a cordless along with a couple of batteries. And - no screwing around tring to recharge batteries out in the woods. One note about old gas drills. I just came across an old backpack gas drill. Has a two-stroke-cycle gas engine you wear on your back - hooked to a flexible cable that powers a hand-held drill-holder. It's laying in a guy's barn - and I offered him $50 - but he won't sell it. I don't want to use it, but it'd be neat to restore and screw around with.

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Bshugarts

09-12-2007 16:02:40




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to jdemaris, 09-12-2007 06:14:37  
My feelings exactly especially the part about my children being gone. my son wont take leave unless the leaves are on the trees. but i guess thats life. hard to get young help that wants to work out in the cold and rain in two feet of snow. Anyways where can you get one of those adapters for a chainsaw. might want to try that as i have a couple old saws that i dont yse to cut wood with any more. (no chain brake) Tanks bruce

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TimV

09-11-2007 08:25:46




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
Here in NY's maple country, most people have gone to cordless drills. With the advent of 18-36 volt cordless drills, you can usually keep drilling all day long provided you've got two batteries and place to charge them. Seeing how most big maple producers tend to be farmers, carpenters, loggers, or some combination of these jobs, most already have the drills on hand from their "day jobs". Sure beats the old days of hand augers and bre ast drills, or fighting with the old chainsaw-based cobble-jobs, which never seemed to run when you wanted them to.

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jdemaris

09-11-2007 10:59:31




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to TimV, 09-11-2007 08:25:46  
Not that I've seen in my area of New York - Otsego County e.g. Buck Maple Products, Brodie Maple, Loft Maple, etc. We've only got a few big producers left in my area - but - they buy much of their raw sap from anyone that will bring it. So, there are many small-scale tappers just selling sap priced by sugar content. I can't comment on how many the small guys are doing it - but the two big maple producers near me are still using gas drills for the most part. I did see one guy with some sort of battery-backpack that he really likes - but I didn't ask about the details.

I've got three separate sugar woods - 12 acres for one, and each other is 30 acres. All very steep and poor access when snow is on the ground - except by foot - maybe. (thank heavens for pipelines).
I've tried battery drills for myself - 18 volt - and don't find them as handy as gas. They drill slower - and - I have no good way of recharging in the woods and keeping up. I run an 18 volt battery down in less then half an hour - and it takes an hour to recharge it via my 12V charger hooked to an aux. large battery in my truck. If I spend a full day in the woods tapping, I need a least four batteries with me, depending on how fast I tap. Maybe a higher-voltage,higher priced cordless might do the trick - but I like my gas tappers just fine.

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TimV

09-11-2007 12:06:49




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to jdemaris, 09-11-2007 10:59:31  
Jdmaris: I don't mean that there isn't still plenty of gas tappers still in use, but most people here started switching away from gas and to cordless 8-10 years ago when the 14.4 drills were coming out, and the trend has accelerated with the 18-volt and larger drills. Lots easier to carry a couple of spare batteries and charge them at lunch, plus being able to carry the drill on a belt hook or holster versus having to set it down between holes. Having a reverse is also handy, which many gas units lack. Again, there's more than one solution--I'm just going on what I see here in northern NY.

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jdemaris

09-11-2007 06:19:02




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
Well, I'm not going to make any claims about what is the best way to go for anyone else - but - I've been sugaring for over 40 years. Year's back - we used backpack engines that powered a 7/16" bit via a flexible cable - or - we drilled with a hand auger. Then we started buying chainsaw adapters - you just remove the clutch and sprocket and install the adapter and left-hand cut 7/16" bit. They work great - better than modern gas drills since the RPMs are higher - but are hard on chain saw engines if you push too hard due to the sideways thrust on the main bearings and crankcase. But, it requires a special left-hand drill bit that can be pricey. They the wave of self-contained gas-drills came around. Petco, Tanaka, McCulloh, Ryobi, etc. They are still my preference. I've tried battery drills - and I can't stand them. For a small woods, they've fine. But otherwise - you need a awful lot of batteries with you. Try tapping 600 maple trees - some with four taps each - and see how your battery drills do. The two gas drills I have now - one is a Tanaka, and the other is an old Petco that I transplanted a Shihl weedeater FS80 engine onto. With either one, I have none of the problems referred to in other posts. They start first pull, over and over - and if I drop them into the snow - they just sit there and idle. Same can be said for sap pumps. I've got a pile of them - small two-stroke-cycle power, and a few bigger pumps with Briggs & Stratton four-stroke-cycle engines. For a small pump - my little el-cheapo Homelite "Waterbugs" have been great. They always start - cold or hot - and will sit and idle without stalling. Can't say the same for my Tanaka pump. One funny note. Last year a local guy asked permission to tap a bunch of roadside trees down town. First time he's ever tapped. He did it - with a 4020 John Deere tractor - pulling a 20KW PTO generator on a trailer, lots of extension cord - and an electric 1/2 drill. How's that for overkill? I don't think it would work too well up in my woods.

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Harold Hubbard

09-11-2007 04:31:49




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
Think long and hard before you do that. A big cordless drill will tap between fifty and two hundred trees on one battery, depending on brand of drill and hole size. I used a gas drill, chainsaws, and a hand drill for years. Once I got the cordless drill I never looked back. The cordless always starts, and it isn't running when you don't need it. It weighs less, is quiet, doesn't smoke, doesn't drip gas on your pants, won't burn you with the muffler, won't quit if you drop it in the snow, and you will find yourself using it year round. Ask a few contractors what brand they are using, and go with their recommendations. I should think that the cordless will cost less than a gas drill, and there will be about zero maintenance.

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RayP(MI)

09-11-2007 04:02:12




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
Friend of mine used a small chainsaw. Removed blade, clutch cover, and clutch. Attached a left hand twist bit to the motor shaft with a collar with setscrews in it. worked great.



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Eddie in MI

09-10-2007 19:23:38




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
Charles has your answer. The cordless drill idea ain't bad either....



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Vally Farm

09-10-2007 19:08:56




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
Why not go with a cordless? They are a lot less money and you can use them in the house. Lot less to go wrong with too. For the cost of a gas drill you could get a cordless and enough batteries to last a few days without charging. Mikethird party image



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charles(mo)

09-10-2007 18:59:26




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 Re: Gas Drill in reply to Bshugarts, 09-10-2007 17:44:24  
We used to have Tonakas where I work and they held up pretty good. I don't know if they are still available though. A couple of years ago we started using Stihls. They are good too, and the plus side to them is that they are 2 speed plus reverse. The reverse option is real handy. And they are a keyless chuck. We use them every day with a 3/4 bit. We drill holes in electric poles for the framing, and the poles we use are real hard.

These are the only 2 I am familiar with. If I was buying one I would probably get a Stihl. If for no other reason than that my chain saw, leaf blower and weed trimmer are Stihls and we have a great Stihl dealer just down the road.

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