Message for DNWELDMAN

I noticed your response to a statement of mine in an old topic yesterday in which you said that only the last number on a stick electrode is used to indicate the composition of the flux covering. You might have 20+ years of experience as a welder, and Dave (135Fan) has that many too, but you're still both wrong. Lincoln Electric has more experience than your combined total, their textbooks say the last two numbers are used to indicate flux composition and preferred current, AND they make the electrodes.

Anyway, it just makes sense if you think about it. 7014 and 7024 are essentially the same electrode except that the flux of 7014 contains 30% iron powder while 7024 contains 50% (which is what prevents it from being an all-position electrode.) So which does the 4 indicate? Without the previous number you wouldn't be able to tell.

All the best,Stan

"Lincoln has more experience than both of you... Their textbooks say..". Do their textbooks tell you how to weld 7024 uphill, NO. Do their textbooks tell you how to run a downhill 7018 stringer on frame steel for a root, NO. Do their textbooks tell you how to run a DC- TIG on aluminum (which should be AC if you don't know), NO they don't. All of these, (and other endless ways to weld), are fully possible.(and prooved by "D1.1 certification", by others I know and by myself.) And none of these are acheived by what is in textbooks. They are acheived by trial and error, the rules being bent, pure experience, and what you have to work with when the going gets tough.

That's what we should be sharing in these forums,How to get unusual jobs done, and sharing oddball methods, not getting bent out of shape about what someone wrote that doesn't match what is in textbooks. Because let's face it, numbers, letters, and technical terms won't make you any better of a welder. Good old fashioned hands-on trial and error along with EXPERIENCE will make you a better welder than anyone else, NOT arguing over a textbook.

You can ask any professional welder what they think about textbooks, I guarentee that most will tell you where to put that textbook. Textbooks only tell you so much. The rest is up to you.

Many of you might not agree with what I've said, and have different opinions, but the plain fact of the matter is welding, welding, welding and more welding will make you a good welder. You can burry your nose in textbooks for years, but it will not teach you the sounds, the smells, the feel of the rod burning down, and other countless things that books can't teach. Any good welder will also tell you that even after 20+ years of welding that you still are learning something new occasionally.

This is not to stir anything up, my intentions are simple: you guys gotta quit arguing about little things. You can tell people till you're blue in the face about what rod to use, but guess what?????, EVERYBODY is different and prefers a certain rod. That doesn't make them wrong, it makes them comfortable in what they are doing. Nobody is wrong for using a 8018 over a 7024 on certain things, it's what they are comfortable with at that time, if it breaks, it breaks, that's how people learn what rod is better for this or that.

These people ask for input on these forums, that's fine, give it to them, but usually it ends up in some kind of heated debate over a topic that WASN'T even asked by the original person. Like I said everyone is different about how they weld, that's part of the learning.

All right, you win. If you're willing to post more than 500 words to tell me that real men never use the word textbook, and that I'm the one sweating the small stuff, I've got nothing else. I'm not upset, though. It really isn't that big a deal.

What say we shake hands, so to speak, and let it go?

All the best, Stan

Stan

P.S. Isn't using the response to a suggestion to bury the hatchet ("shake hands" is what I said) to get in one more criticism while saying you agree, sort of like getting in one more punch after the bell rings?

If welding was rocket science, one would be required to have a degree to do it.

As for the knowlege or skill issue, I still say if I can do it, anyone who really wants to can. To this point, most tests I have taken are the 2" and 6" sched. 80 (or heavier, whatever they give me), 6G. 5P root, 7018 out. Have one tig cert for stainless 2"(don't remember the wall thickness), and a 2" dissimilar test, both 6G. I prefer stick. Doing some 1 1/2" plate tests (stick, tig, and mig) that I believe are for the U-stamp. My cert's don't mean much to me because when you go to the next job, you have to re-test anyway. But I do enjoy what I do, even if it is a science. Enjoy reading your posts, would have to agree that you're qualified.