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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Bob's question

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KEH

02-05-2007 18:54:41




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Bob.

Your question about why is there a fascination with Sears tools sorta got lost in the shuffle in the discussion about union labor and teachers' salaries, but it deserves an answer and since I started the thread I will take a stab at it.

Sears hand tools: I am not a professional mechanic and I don't swear by or swear at Sears tools, so this is just my opinion based on observation. Sears is a successful mass marketeerin many areas. One of the things they sell in quanity is tools, so many people have experience with them and an opinion about them. The most successful marketing technique IMO for hand tools has been the lifetime guarantee. The first time I heard about this was about 1963 when I asked a professional mechanic which was the best tools to buy and he said Snap-on because if you broke one it could be replaced. Now I don't know when Snap-on started that, maybe someone on here knows. Anyway, in a few years Sears started guranteeing their tools and their sales increased. By this time Sears had stores in all large cities and as one mechanic I knew said, you didn't have to wait for the tool truck to come around to replace your broken Sears tools. Other U.S. tool makers followed in guranteeing their tools. Sears has kept their prices in line for a long time. The general rule is in Sears tools that if you buy a 75 piece set of tools, the price is about $1.00 per piece. This has been the rule for st least 10 years. A measure of Sear's success is that if you find used tools at a flea market or pawn shop, the majority of the quality U.S. made tools will be Sears. I have known professional mechanics who used them, and I have known professional mechanics who wouldn"t touch them.

Much the same thing is true of Sears electric tools. IMO the biggest thing holding back the acceptance of Sears electric tools is Sears' repair policy. They charge a huge price for repairs and in one case I took a router to be repaired, their minimum price was $50, and the price of a new one was $59. I put a new switch on it and it works fine, price less than $10. Looks like their system there could use some tweaking, but I'm not a professional manager either.

KEH

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350 HU Don

02-06-2007 17:40:23




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 Re: Bob's question in reply to KEH, 02-05-2007 18:54:41  
I wish I had the same good luck some of you guys have had with Sears tools. In my experience the hand tools (wrenches, screw drivers, etc)are ok but nothing more than that. they don't compete with quality tools, at least not for me. Their wood working tools are not at all satisfactory. I've had a circular saw, 3 different radial arm saws, a bench grinder, scroll saw, and several other electric wood working tools. None of them were up to the level of other brand tools I have replaced them with. Here's a couple of examples why I feel this way: One of the radial arm saws had a motor failure. I took it to an electric motor repair place and they told me they couldn't repair it because it had a glued case and if desassembled, couldn't be reassembled. Then to Sears for a new replacement motor but they told me they don't make a replacement for that saw and they were unable to get one for me. So the saw became unusable and had to be replaced. That's where a second Craftsman saw came into the picture. I found one for sale for a reasonable price so I bought it and put the two saws together. A second example: The scroll saw worked but it was crude, adjustments weren't precise and it didn't have much power. I replaced it with a Porter Cable and the difference is like night and day. I could go on but I think this makes my point. I steer clear of anything Sears sells although I understand others must have had better luck than I have.
Have a great day guys.

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NTP

02-05-2007 21:45:39




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 Re: Bob's question in reply to KEH, 02-05-2007 18:54:41  
I have been buying Sears tools for 50 years and probably have one of the most well stocked workshops you will find. (I havent seen one better equiped) There is not much I am unable to do whether it be in wood or metal. I can count on one hand the number of tools I have had to return to Sears for replacement over the years. I must have a hundred of their screwdrivers, and a few have buggered up ends, but they did not get that way from turning screws, their intended use, so I don't expect Sears to replace them. I also have a fairly complete set of Snap-Ons, but I generally reach for the Sears tools first. I guess I got used to using Sears tools when I was younger and took a liking to the feel of their tools. The one thing I will grab before a Sears is a ratchet of another make. I must have 40 or so ratchets from 1/4 up to 3/4 inch, but the Sears seem to "skip" when pressure is applied.

I have also purchased a large number of HF specialty tools, hand brakes, hand shears, hand punches, parts washers, spot welders, sandblasters, plumber snakes, and a whole lot more and have been satisfied with them, as I own apartments and they do not see daily use, so for my purposes, they are just fine. I must add that I take good cae of my tools and do not abuse them. The tools I bought 50 years ago when I was a high school kid are still in daily use, and still in shiney condition. I have about 40 roller tool boxes, so everything has its place for storage. (I have a most understanding wife who never questions me when I buy more tools)

I must have a good selection of tools, as my youngest son said I am going to miss one hell of a rummage sale when I depart this earth. I have so may speciality tools that he has no idea of their use and has asked me to start sticking tags on them so he has some idea of what to ask for them. I sure hope he is kidding, as I am only 65 and in good health and hope to be around for quite some time yet.

I see peole on this board from time to time talk down Sears tools, but as a fellow who has used them for 50 years, I have to assume they are speaking from their youth and lack of worldly experience.

Before retirement, I was a general foreman in a manufacturing plant where the Snap-on truck would stop by every week or two. He would give me a hard time on replacing some broken Snap-on tools until one day I told him he no longer would need to stop by, as I passed a large Sears store on my way home from work, and I would start buying there, as I could get broken tools relaced without the hassle. Because we bought a fairly large amount of tools he changed his tune and all of a sudden he could replace the tools.

I suggest you buy what you can afford and eventually you will find out on your own what you feel most comfortable using. As far as I know, both a Craftsman and a Snap-on wrench eventually do the same thing, that is to loosen or tighten a bolt or nut.

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Rockyhawaii

02-05-2007 20:30:56




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 Re: Bob's question in reply to KEH, 02-05-2007 18:54:41  
Sears makes sense to me. Their tools work, what more could one ask for? They are readily available, usually have a good assortment in stock, and I'd have to guard Snap-ons that I waited two weeks to buy. Sears keeps detailed computer records of equipment that I've bought, so parts are easy to come by, and they have always treated me well no matter where I lived.



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Bob

02-05-2007 19:13:19




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 Re: Bob's question in reply to KEH, 02-05-2007 18:54:41  
I shouldn't even have posted the comment.

HOWEVER, I've gotten to the point I avoid Sears and their high-pressure floor help just like I avoid WaldoWorld, if at ALL possible.

The other thorn in my side is folks who ABUSE the Sears or Snap-On warrantys by demanding the exchange of old tools they've bought at rummage sales or pawn shops, or DEMANDING the replacement of tools they have simply DESTROYED with abuse. To me, the warranty should be to the original owner. You KNOW we all pay for their "FREE" tools each time we buy new tools.

If a tool is defective "out of the box", or fails with little use, YES, I expect waranty, however, if I break something with a big "cheater pipe", or other abuse, I take the loss, and don't demand replacement, or (like some folks), b**ch on here 'cause I didn't get something for nothing.

Sorry!

(End of RANT.)

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Davis In SC

02-05-2007 20:46:06




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 Re: Bob's question in reply to Bob, 02-05-2007 19:13:19  
I agree with Bob.. big difference in normal use and abuse.. Anything that can be made, can also be broken.



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135 Fan

02-06-2007 15:59:51




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 Re: Bob's question in reply to Davis In SC, 02-05-2007 20:46:06  
I know a few guys with Snap-on tools that the rep will take their old slightly worn tools and just replace them. They're still very good steel and probably just get melted down and made into new tools. They aren't junk and Snap-on gets their money back out of them cheaper than using all new raw ingredients to make the steel for new tools. I don't see what the big deal is with replacing lifetime warrantee tools. That's what you pay the extra money for. Professionals use good tools because when they have a really stubborn bolt or something they don't want their tools to break. They have peace of mind knowing that if they do break, they will be replaced. Dave

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Stumpalump

02-06-2007 07:19:31




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 Re: Bob's question in reply to Davis In SC, 02-05-2007 20:46:06  
I could care less about a liftime warrenty. A good tool will last about that long any way. I would skip a great warrenty for a better product any day. If I go a cheap and it breaks so what. If I want it to last then I buy quality and don't abuse it. You should have seen the flex I was getting out of a craftsman 1/2" breaker bar with a 5'pipe on it. I could have broke it but I backed off to save the tool.

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