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Silver soldering copper lines

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Tom

03-22-2001 12:51:40




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I am going to install a central air conditioning condensing unit at my house in the next few weeks. I will need to make an extreme 90 degree turn with the freon lines at one point. I understand that I will need to silver solder a 90 degree fitting into the line in order to avoid kinking it. I have two questions: 1) Is silver soldering done in the same way as sweating copper pipes, or is there some special trick or technique that I should know? 2) Do I use the same type of copper fitting that I would use for plumbing? If not, what should I use?

Thanks for your help, in advance.

Tom

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T_Bone

03-24-2001 16:05:16




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 Re: Silver soldering copper lines in reply to Tom, 03-22-2001 12:51:40  
Hi Tom, You need to use type K copper pipe and fittings. WW Grainger or Johnstone Supply will have them.

Do not solder refer pipe without using a cover gas inside the pipe, of Co2 or Nitrogen. I use nitrogen because it also removes moister as it purges the oxygen. Clean both inside and outside of the fittings and the outside of the pipe. DO Not use flux of any kind!!! Use act/oxy and heat back towards the where the fitting reduces adding 15% silver solder at the pipe/fitting joint letting the solder flow into the joint. Any other method will cause a leak within a short time because of viberation.

You will need to pump the system to 29.950hg THREE times to remove the moister or the moister will combine with the refer oil causing an acid that eats the motor windings, usually within 6mths. For this reason I strongly suggest you pay to have the pipes put in by a professonal. Yep it's $500 now or $1200 later when you replace the compressor!!!

I don't care what hype Harris puts out about the no silver solder filler rod, it sucks. A one pound tube of 15% is $45 and worth every penny.

This is one job that has to be done correct with alot of special equipment and it's pay me now or pay me latter but your gonna pay me!

T_Bone

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Joe (Wa)

03-22-2001 22:01:06




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 Re: Silver soldering copper lines in reply to Tom, 03-22-2001 12:51:40  
Tom, Go to a refrigeration supply place or better yet to an appliance repair shop that does refrigeration repairs. The service person silver solders something every day and may give you a quick demo. Buy a refrigeration grade copper elbow & silver solder. Flat silver solder sticks about 1' long are the easiest for newcomers to use. Clean joints with emery cloth. DO NOT USE FLUX on copper to copper. Silver soldering is exactly the same method as sweating but @ a much higher temperature. An experienced person can do a 1" joint with propane. Inexperienced, use aceytlene for anything over 3/8" or you might end up with poor penetration, weak joint, and a meared mess..... Joe

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Tom R

03-22-2001 16:14:19




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 Re: Silver soldering copper lines in reply to Tom, 03-22-2001 12:51:40  
Tom:

If your local code permits soft solder, Harris makes a staybrite 8 silver bearing solder that works good. Just use their flux and clean the fittings and tubing good and proceed as if you were soldering copper water pipes (can use you propane torch here).

If the code requires brazing you will need to purge the line with nitrogen while you braze.

This is all explained at JW Harris website I will post a link for you. Look at Soldering Alloys, also look at their brazing products.

Tom R

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Tom R

03-22-2001 16:30:42




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 Re: Re: Silver soldering copper lines in reply to Tom R, 03-22-2001 16:14:19  
Tom:

Sorry I forgot to respond to the second question.

Refrigeration tubing is classified by OD. While tubing for water is sold by nominal pipe size (� copper water pipe is actually 5/8" OD). It is best to use Wrot Copper refrigeration fittings for this even if you have a line set that �" or � " water line fittings will fit.
I would recommend you use a long radius 90� if you have the room to do so.

Hope this helps Tom R.

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ltf in nc

03-22-2001 13:17:59




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 Re: Silver soldering copper lines in reply to Tom, 03-22-2001 12:51:40  
Tom, not long ago I had to make a repair to a freon line. I was at the plumbing supply store, not a discount joint, and the owner told me he had a different method which consists of a non fluxed flat shaped brazing rod and the use of acetylene gas only. The flame from the torch cleaned the tubing and the rod brazed the copper line and it looked exactly like the oem joints on the a/c. There is no contaminent to create problems or to clog orifices using this method. I apologize for not knowing the name of the brazing rod but I am certain someone else will. Good luck.

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