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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim?

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Glenn F.

08-18-2006 06:33:48




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I have had very little experience with florescent lights. Do the bulbs get dimmer as they near the end of their life?

Thanks, Glenn F.




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rustyj14

08-21-2006 19:28:11




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
Yes, they do! After they have sucked in as much "dark" as they can, they finally get so dark that they can't see any more, and out they go! Dark suckers have been a godsend for shop owners who need a lot of light. Check the ends of the tubes! If they have been sucking in the dark and have 4 or more inches of dark in them, its time to replace them, even if they do light up!8>)



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Fred Martin

08-20-2006 06:34:24




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
Well, if you want to get out your voltmeter and go to checking the ballast output...be careful cause there are high voltages in there and if you"re using the wrong scale on an analog meter....you get a bent needle. A curious friend of mine found that out at my expense...I think it was around 750 volts. Fred OH



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thejdman01

08-19-2006 07:18:06




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
Yes bulbs do get dimmer, however dirt and old age also play a part for me. I seem to be adding all sorts of lights over benches to see what I am doing anymore.



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vld

08-18-2006 15:21:09




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
to get a bulb that is out just take your hand and run it along the bulb fast and most of the time it will light up



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Rauville

08-18-2006 09:28:43




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
Just a sidenote on Florescent lights:
I recently ran across a string of "Colored Florescent Christmas Tree Lights" from the 1930's in the original box, made by Sylvania. There was a 1933 patent date on the box. I plugged them in, and was surprised that they all lite up, bright as could be. I've never seen anything like them. That almost has to be a record for 70 year old bulbs to still be working.

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david from mo

08-18-2006 19:28:18




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Rauville, 08-18-2006 09:28:43  
google longest burning lamp ,I was amazed



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Gary Schafer

08-18-2006 07:43:07




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
The bigger problem is the ballast going bad. Changing the ballast makes a big difference in light output as they age. I have had some ballast last as little as a year or less. Changing bulbs that are hard to start and seem rather dim seems to help for a short time. Changing the ballast usually lets you use those old bulbs that would not light.

Regards
Gary



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buickanddeere

08-18-2006 07:42:24




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
They are very bright when new then after about two weeks they have settled 20-30% down. They will stay close to that until the end of thier two year service life. Always replace lamps in pairs or add extra money to your ballast replacement budget.



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Steve Crum

08-18-2006 07:07:46




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
You bet they do! I millrighted for a month at the Osram-Sylvania plant near us. This is where their lamp phosphurs division is located. I asked this question of one of the engineers and he stated that one can expect a flouresent lamp to lose up to 50% of it's rated lumins output over this course of it's life span. He suggested to replace the bulbs at 500 to 750 hour intervals to maintain peak efficency.

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Slowpoke

08-20-2006 00:39:31




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Steve Crum, 08-18-2006 07:07:46  
A 30 day month has 720 hours at 24 hour operation/day.



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David - OR

08-18-2006 08:35:31




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Steve Crum, 08-18-2006 07:07:46  
The output of fluorescent tubes is rated at 100 hours of service life. They generally produce 10 percent more light than rated during that initial period, though the manufacturer doesn't measure or guarantee this.

Modern T8 tubes with electronic ballasts are expected to retain 95 percent of the 100 hour lamp output through at least 10000 operating hours. They should not drop below 90 percent during their 20000 hour service life. Most perform better than this.

Lose 50% of its rated output? Replace tubes at 500-750 hours? That's terrible performance. Between the replacement cost and the maintenance cost, supermarkets and office buildings would go broke changing tubes that often. The engineer was either mis-informed or you aren't remembering correctly.

Phillips and Sylvania have websites with info than any of us can read that advertise 95% lumen retention. One example is here:

Link

Lots of short duration cycles will degrade service life, but not by that much. A 20000 hour rated tube (based on 12 hours per start) gives around 15000 hours service life based on 2 hours per start.

Modern electronic ballasts do not care if one tube is bad in a two-tube fixture. The ballasts should last essentially forever even operating into a dead short.

One factor that is well known in the industry is the impact of dirt on lamp performance. Lighting design programs will de-rate tube and fixture aperformance by about 10 percent due to accumulation of dirt. And this assumes a fairly clean environment and a 6 month cleaning cycle. Dirtier environments or longer cleaning cycles are worse.

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Steve Crum

08-20-2006 06:11:32




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to David - OR, 08-18-2006 08:35:31  
I'm not entirely sure if the statements that were made to me concerning this were fully understood by me. (I'm no engineer) a bulb quits working it gets replaced. But thinking about it and the fact that this guy on the few occasions I talked with him seemed to like to talk a few feet above my head, with dozens of percentages, excitation voltages, phosphure lives, duty cycles, yada,yada,yada, I could easily lose track of the initial question. Heck I have wally world specials in my shops that are at least 16 years old and still putting out an acceptable amount of light. I guess there are way to many perceptions of what constitutes 'peak efficency'. After all if an old tractor misfires once every 10 minutes of running conceivably it is not running at 'peak efficency', yes that is measureable, but not worth worrying about. (but there are folks that do).

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John T

08-18-2006 06:39:50




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
Glen, Yes, they tend to become somewhat dimmer and/or also become harder to strike with age in my experience. Ive had older ones appear dull or produce less light and take time to light up but then when I changed out the bulbs it got brighter and they lit up instantly yayyyyy y

John T



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IH2444

08-18-2006 06:39:40




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 Re: DoFlorescent Light Bulbs Get Dim? in reply to Glenn F., 08-18-2006 06:33:48  
Yes a bit dimmer I think, but usually I have found that it is usually dirt on the tube :)



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