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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

variable voltage effect on motors

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Tim B from MA

07-18-2006 11:08:26




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I bought a neat old drill press at a auction a couple weeks ago hoping it was a very slow turner, suitable for large diameter twist drills - it has a large chuck (maybe 3/4-inch) but no such luck.

It is a single speed, gear-driven unit, my calculations (based on motor speed - 1725 rpm - and ratio of teeth on the drive gears - 1:4) is that it turns at about 430 rpm. This is faster than my modern, moderately-priced drill press - which I can get down to about 310 rpm.

Someone suggested varing the voltage to get the speeds I need using something like the item shown in the link below.

My understanding is that varing the voltage to change motor speeds is tough on the motor unless it was made for that application. Is this correct?

Also, I would imagine decreasing the voltage to get a slower speed would also decrease the power (torque) output of the motor. Correct?

Thanks.

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old art

07-21-2006 19:36:18




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tim B from MA, 07-18-2006 11:08:26  
there are outher motors that run slower by winding them diffrent a 3600 rpm motor has 1 pair of poles (N&S ) an 1800 motor has 2 pair of poles a1200 rpm motor has 3 pair of poles a motor shop may be able to help you find one of a slower speed or know how to rewind it for you.



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old art

07-21-2006 19:35:58




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tim B from MA, 07-18-2006 11:08:26  
there are outher motors that run slower by winding them diffrent a 3600 rpm motor has 1 pair of poles (N&S ) an 1800 motor has 2 pair of poles a1200 rpm motor has 3 pair of poles a motor shop may be able to help you find one of a slower speed or know how to rewind it for you.



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KEB

07-19-2006 08:13:51




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tim B from MA, 07-18-2006 11:08:26  
Do NOT use a variac to control the speed of this motor - you'll burn it up. Motors with brushes can be controlled by varying voltage, but not induction or synchronous motors. If you lower the voltage, the motor will try to maintain the same speed and draw additional current, overheating the windings. Think of the lights dimming when the motor starts because its drawing extra current trying to come up to speed.

The rotational speed of an induction motor is determined by the varying magnetic field produced the the AC current input. In theory you could slow it down by changine the frequency of the input power, but that's a lot of trouble & expense.

If it was belt driven, all you'd need is a smaller pulley at the motor. Maybe you can rig some sort of a belt reduction drive ahead of the first gear? Otherwise, you're either stuck with existing speed or will have to change motors to something that can handle variable speeds.

Good luck.

Keith

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MarkB_MI

07-18-2006 20:13:12




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tim B from MA, 07-18-2006 11:08:26  
Understand that there are basically two classes of motors: ac and dc. (Actually there's many variations on ac and dc motors, but never mind for now.) The brush-type motors used on most portable power tools are actually dc motors; their speed is a function of applied voltage and load. Hence you can vary the speed of a brush-type motor by varying the applied voltage. The torque will vary due to decreased current through the motor. Note that a dc motor has maximum torque at zero rpm for any given voltage; as the motor spins it becomes a generator and "back emf" reduces the current through the motor.

The speed of true ac motors is pretty much tied to the frequency of the ac power applied to them. You can tell you have an ac motor because the rated rpm is (approximately) a fraction of 3600 rpm. (60 cycles per second x 60 seconds per minute). Induction motors (the most common type) turn slightly slower under load than their theoretical no-load speed. Synchronous motors (such as clock motors) are locked precisely to the power frequency.

You could slow the drill press down using different pulleys. However, don't forget that the torque will go up and might be enough to break something in the press.

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Tramway Guy

07-18-2006 13:03:43




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tim B from MA, 07-18-2006 11:08:26  
Actually, you can use what is called an 'Inverter', or Variable-Frequency Drive (VFD). They actually can supply power at a different frequency than the normal 60 Hertz, and they work rather well. They work by changing AC into DC and then generating AC again. Most motors can be run at 50% speed to 100% speed without a problem.
BUT THERE IS A DOWNSIDE! Older motors often do not have suitable insulation to handle the very high-frequency carrier frequencies and sharp spikes of the waveform that is generated. So they tend to burn out quickly if there is the slightest leakage in the insulation. But that can be moderated by something called an inductor, which will tend to smooth out the voltage to the motor. It is just a bunch of windings around a metal core, kind of a transformer that doesn't change voltage...
The other neat thing about VFD's is that you can generate three-phase power with only single-phase inputs...
They are really are starting to replace DC drives and motors in a lot of applications now.

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Bus Driver

07-18-2006 14:02:01




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tramway Guy, 07-18-2006 13:03:43  
That motor is really not suitable for powering with variable voltage. The inverters that are available as separate items have output that can be used only by three-phase motors- the instructions say so. Typical single-phase induction motors are not suited at all to variable speed operation. Surplus Center in Linclon Nebraska often has surplus treadmill motors that could be adapted to the drill press. They do offer variable speed. Some specialty single -phase motors do have inverters built in or as part of the control assembly. Inverters are a great way to operate three-pahse motors from a single-phase supply.

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Coloken

07-18-2006 12:39:46




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tim B from MA, 07-18-2006 11:08:26  
Nope. AC motors are made to run at one speed only. Some exceptions like fan motors. You need a DC motor to use a speed control. You can find them on E-bay. About a hundred bucks or so. Maybe from a junked out tread mill?
They do make 110 (117) volt motors of slower speed, like maybe 1150. I once put an extra shaft and pulley drive on mine to slow it down, but it tended to slip the belt at hard pulls.

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RandyBee

07-18-2006 11:50:12




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 Re: variable voltage effect on motors in reply to Tim B from MA, 07-18-2006 11:08:26  
I doubt that your motor is a universal motor that will change speeds with voltage. Even if it is a universal wind, the variac is not what you need but a triac based speed control like drills and small appliances use.



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