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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels

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Glenn F.

07-03-2006 21:41:09




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What is the difference between a 3/4 ton with 6 bolt hubs and one with 8? Obviously the 6 bolt is lighter. Why do the two exist? How can they both be considered 3/4 ton? I was looking at one with 6 today.

Thanks, Glenn F.




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Robert in W. Mi.

07-05-2006 17:02:02




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Glenn F., 07-03-2006 21:41:09  
Quote: (The 8 bolt has what is known as full
floating. On the 8 bolt, you can pull the axle
out with out taking the wheel off. The bearings
are on a hollow axle and there is an innner and outer.)

The above statement is NOT entirely true. Later model pu's can and do come with a "semi floating" 8 bolt wheels. It's considered a "light duty" 14 bolt rear end and it looks like a scaled up 12 bolt. I've seen quite a few of them with pinion teeth missing if used for heavy pulling.

The "full floating" rear end mentioned in the above quote, is the "heavy duty" 14 bolt rear end that is very strong and holds up quite well.

Robert

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rick in sc

07-04-2006 09:41:20




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Glenn F., 07-03-2006 21:41:09  
6 lug 7200# GVW. 8 lug 8600# GVW



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Dave Sherburne NY

07-04-2006 07:28:16




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Glenn F., 07-03-2006 21:41:09  
The six bolthubs use same type of axle as a half ton truck The 8 bolt has what is known as full
floating. On the 8 bolt, you can pull the axle
out with out taking the wheel off. The bearings
are on a hollow axle and there is an innner and outer. On the six bolt, the axle goes thru one bearing fastened to the end of the axle. The 8
bolt is deffinitely the heavy duty.



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Coloken

07-04-2006 06:19:30




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Glenn F., 07-03-2006 21:41:09  
Don't know a thing about it, but wouldn't the 8 bolt be a diferent rear end and a whole lot heavyer duty?



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Bob

07-03-2006 21:46:06




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Glenn F., 07-03-2006 21:41:09  
"1/2 ton" or "2/4 ton" are pretty arbritary terms!

Light duty 3/4 ton Chevy wheels will interchange with the 1/2 ton, I believe over 8600 lbs. GVW they went to the HD 3/4 ton 8-bolt wheels.



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buickanddeere

07-04-2006 12:51:15




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Bob, 07-03-2006 21:46:06  
My heavy 1/2 uses 8 bolt wheels.



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Bob

07-04-2006 14:18:30




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to buickanddeere, 07-04-2006 12:51:15  
I'm curious... what is the GVW?



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Jerry (KS)

07-04-2006 18:56:58




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Bob, 07-04-2006 14:18:30  
Gross Vehicle Weight



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buickanddeere

07-04-2006 15:35:31




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to Bob, 07-04-2006 14:18:30  
I would have to look in the book but it's a GMC 4x4, crew cab, 364 cu inch/300HP with the 6-1/2 ft box. Supposed to be able to trailer 9000lbs or 9500lbs with the 3.73 axles and more with 4.11's.



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morningwood

07-05-2006 07:56:28




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to buickanddeere, 07-04-2006 15:35:31  
Is it a gas or diesel ???

The newer duramax diesel only comes with 3.73 rear end. I am not sure about the 6 lug rims but I know my 8 lug rims, the axle goes through the middle of the rim on the back and up front it goes in about quarter inch maybe into the rim.

Thanks,

Scott



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morningwood

07-05-2006 07:58:12




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 Re: Chevy 2500 6 vs 8 Lug Wheels in reply to morningwood, 07-05-2006 07:56:28  
Nevermind, you says its 364 cubic inches. The diesel is a 6.6L which makes it 402ish. If you go to GMC / Chevy's web site they will give the GVWR with different axle ratios.

Scott



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buickanddeere

07-06-2006 13:16:57




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 from the book and diesel costs too much Re: Chevy in reply to morningwood, 07-05-2006 07:58:12  
Model K15743. Tires 245/75R 16E. GVWR on door says 8600lbs. GAWR front 4410lbs, GAWR rear 6000lbs. 3.73 ratio 7,900lb trailer and 14,000lb GCWR. 4.11 ratio 9,900lbs and GCWR 16,000lbs. Max trailer tongue weight 1,500lbs and 5th wheel weight 2,500lbs. I sat down and figured the cost of gasoline, diesel, the diesel option, miles driven. expected life of the vehicle and bank interested earned on the price of the diesel option. The diesel option would break even less than a year before scrapping the truck due to old age and miles. 95% of diesels sold are for status rather than economy. Of course using off road fuel on the highway brings the payback into the 4-7 year range, depending.

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morningwood

07-07-2006 10:57:04




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 Re: from the book and diesel costs too much Re: Ch in reply to buickanddeere, 07-06-2006 13:16:57  
Not to start a arguement with you but I have seen / talked to alot of people about the diesel vs gas arguement.

All I can say is that with fuel ( diesel and gas ) being 3$ a gallon who wants to drive a truck that gets 14 miles to the gallon when you can drive a diesel that gets 20ish if you stay out the pedal. Also it is a hell of alot easier to sell a diesel than a gasser because the motors last for sooooo o much longer. The diesel also retains it value alot better if you are going to re-sell and to top it all off nothing beats pulling up next to a guy with a gasser truck and let him listen to the purr of that sweet smellin diesel.

I know a guy with a 05 Chevy 2500 and he told me the dumbest thing he did when he bought his truck as not get the duramax due to the above points. That is why is spent the extra money for it.

Scott

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buickanddeere

07-07-2006 13:37:26




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 Re: from the book and diesel costs too much Re: Ch in reply to morningwood, 07-07-2006 10:57:04  
"nothing beats pulling up next to a guy with a gasser truck and let him listen to the purr of that sweet smellin diesel". That's pride and a desire for status. I can't make the extra $10,000 plus tax for the diesel option save $10,000 in fuel plus interest. Any high miles engine work is cheaper on a gasser than a diesel. It's 2006 not 1985 with carburators v.s diesel.With electronic fuel injection and unleaded fuel the advantages of diesel over gasoline have virtually disapeared. Resale of a 12+ year old truck either gas or diesel differs little. As for mileage your diesel numbers are stretched at 20ish a little, maybe steady state at 55mph. Real world driving for the entire tank of diesel fuel would be mid to high teens. The gasser is low to mid teens. Around here diesel is usually more $$$ than gasoline. Driving 350 miles per week at 14mpg the gasser would burn 1300 gallons a year. The diesel would burn 1011.0 gallons per year. You saving less than $900.00 per year on fuel, unless farm diesel is being burned. Break Even on Payback is 12-13 years considering taxes and interest.Unless you are illegaly burning off road diesel or hauling a trailer 500+ miles per week. A 12-13 year old truck is a liability to get rid of in any area of the country that uses road salt.

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morningwood

07-07-2006 14:26:25




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 Re: from the book and diesel costs too much Re: Ch in reply to buickanddeere, 07-07-2006 13:37:26  
"nothing beats pulling up next to a guy with a gasser truck and let him listen to the purr of that sweet smellin diesel".

I has nothing to do with ego or being a status symbol it is knowing that you were not too cheap and bought the right truck. Do you run Fram filters and Tech 2 motor oil in your car because they are the cheapest and they will get the job done most of the time okay ???

Hate to break this to you but the diesel option is not 10K, I think I paid 6k for the diesel option in my 2006 2500 plus that gets me a better tranny and better warranty.

Again the mileage on the diesel is alot higher than the gasser. Wife and I went to Va. Memorial Day weekend I was getting 23MPG and I was doing between 65 - 70 MPH the whole way. The guy that I know with 6.0 2500 ( 4.10 gears ) says he gets 14MPG on the freeway.

Around here diesel is 5 cents cheaper per gallon.

If gas engines are so great and so durable for doing alot of work why doesn't Kenworth sell a gas motor of there Class A trucks ???

If gas engines are so great how come John Deere or any other company that makes tractors have not put a gas motor in a descent size tractor in 30 years ???

If gas technology has come so far why are car companies ( Audi, Ford, BMW, Mazda )going to direct injection for there new vehicles ala what diesels have been doing for 100 years ???

Once all of the 2007 emission stuff is figured out with the new diesels you will start seeing more diesels in the US due to high fuel prices. Honda and Toyota have already announced diesel engines for 2008. If you have ever been to a foreign county you will know that most ( 50+ percent ) vehicles over there are diesels due to the higher mileage and better longevity.

Scott

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buickanddeere

07-07-2006 19:52:25




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 Re: from the book and diesel costs too much Re: Ch in reply to morningwood, 07-07-2006 14:26:25  
"nothing beats pulling up next to a guy with a gasser truck and let him listen to the purr of that sweet smelling diesel". If that isn't ego then what else could it possibly be? BTW if diesel sulfur smells sweet to you, what smells bad in your opinion? In Canada it was $10,000 + taxes in the fall of 2003 to order the Duramax Diesel which comes with the 4L80E v.s the 4L60E. I run Amsoil synthetic and Amsoil filters. A Hastings filter if Amsoil doesn't stock that size. If you are getting that great of mileage (23mpg) you were either drafting behind a semi-truck or someone was dumping a couple of gallons of fuel into your truck without you knowing it. I've heard these mileage stories before. I have taken people up on their claims and proved them false every time. I fill the fuel tank to the brim and then measure the miles and fill to the brim again. None of this estimation reading off the fuel guage or from were the filling station fuel pump kicks off. And certainly none of tis reading the mileage from the dash display while on a flat level road with a tail wind. Around here highway diesel is 2-5 cents per liter more expensive than 87 octane road gasoline. Hauling heavy loads of 80,000lbs plus is all together different than an unloaded pickup that is driven like a car. Same goes for farm tractors running at 75-95% power. A heavy loaded diesel wins vs a heavy loaded gasser on fuel efficiency when supplying the same HP. On light loads such a highway cruising the gasser rates pretty good due to the diesel pumping heated and un-used air up the stack. If the farm tractor cost 25% more to have the diesel option then many farmers would order gasoline and save $10,000 plus on the purchase of a small odds jobs & utility tractor. Small diesel commuter cars are under powered and run at near full power with a low HP diesel where efficiency is highest. Using the same cruising HP from a gasser with 2 or 3 times the available HP will burn more fuel. Diesels are often sold in Europe to use fuel which is taxed less than gasoline. Or to avoid having to comply with gasoline emissions standards. A diesel is easier to slip through the laxer standards. Very few people wear out a diesel or gasoline drive train now. 20+ years ago when gassers used carbs and leaded fuel. A gasser was due for a total rebuild at 100,00 miles. Now gassers are still running strong without excessive oil use or power loss at 250,000+ miles. Using my truck to trailer 3-5 times a year and travel 15,000 miles per doesn't pay to order the $$$ diesel option. A landscaper, live stock broker or small contractor who hauls trailers 300+ miles per week do win the in diesel v.s gasoline. These operators however are a small percentage of the diesel truck owners. The other appeal to contractors and farmers is to slip untaxed off road fuel into the highway diesel's tank. Burning this cheap diesel will make operating costs of a highway fueled gasser look expensive.

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morningwood

07-08-2006 09:29:27




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 Re: from the book and diesel costs too much Re: Ch in reply to buickanddeere, 07-07-2006 19:52:25  
Sorry that the option is 10k in Canada but like I said it only 6k here and after rebates it was 5k.

I did get the 23MPG ( I also have a 6 speed tranny, DOUBLE OVERDRIVE ) going to Virginia. I wish I had a picture of my DIC ( computer calculated not hand calculated )to prove it. The reason you cannot get that kinda of MPG is because in the far far north you mostly burn #1 diesel which is alot thicker and does not have the BTU's as #2 does, plus it is alot warmer down here and diesels get better MPG when it is warmer.

My problem with your side of the debate is that you do not know MY situation. Lets says my wife and I have a 35 foot fifth wheel ( no it is not a ego thing ) camper and we are going to drive from Ohio to Alaska this summer. Too me that 6k additional that I spent for a much safer truck is worth. I know you are going to say that it is the same truck as a gasser but it is not. The diesel has 650ft lbs of torque @ 2k RPMS, the gasser has maybe has 400ft lbs of torque @ 3500 RPMS which means I can keep my truck within optimal torque range alot easer and not have to listen to it shift up and down. I have grade breaking with the Allison Tranny. So that means I will be able to climb the Rockies alot easier and descend the hills alot safer due a far more superior tranny. On top of that I will get 33% better MPG. So you are telling me the 6k that I spent on the diesel is not worth if for the safety of my family. Just think about the above next time you have a trailer and start descending a 7% grade hill with your nice 4 speed automatic with NO GRADE BREAKING and you are relying on your trailer brakes to stop the load of you your family and your truck.

I think you need to go to VM.com, audi.com or mercedes.com and see what kind of power the new diesels are making and what kind of MPG they are getting. These are not the same diesels that GM was building in 1980. I had a 1980 VM rabbit so I know what the old diesels were like.

I can see that you can debate this until the cows comes home. I will stick with my egotistical diesel you stick with your gas and we both will be happy. But I bet within 10 years you will be driving a diesel car, wagon, SUV or truck due to fuel not ever going below 2$ a gallon.

Scott

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buickanddeere

07-09-2006 00:05:23




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 Re: from the book and diesel costs too much Re: Ch in reply to morningwood, 07-08-2006 09:29:27  
Today 87 octane gasoline is $3.60 per gallon and highway diesel $3.78. $2.00 US per US gallon was a decade ago. Filling at the US side before entering Canada is a good idea. Alberta has the best prices of any province. Watch out for customs too. Most are gun hating pricks that will even search though dirty laundry in the hopes of finding something. Don't even attempt to bring one in. Our politicians are as dim witted about firearms as they are about taxes/gov't spending. #1 diesel is thinner not thicker than #2. It's only at the pumps from November to March. 136,000 btu per gallon v.s 138,500 btu. 98.2%, that's less than the mileage loss from under inflated tires. The 4L60E automatic holds back on hills just fine in 2nd gear. Ever been on Hwy #17's hills north of Sue Ste Marie with a trailer that's at the legal limit for no brakes? HP is HP. A 300HP gasser and a 300HP diesel will perform the same amount of work per hour. A gasser sounds like it's working harder as it's power band is much wider. A diesel does "feel" different by it's nature. As for math? Is 100 1.5 times larger than 66.67 or is 66.67 2/3 of 100. The numbers can be shuffled for appearance. If the truck is driven as a car most of the time which almost every pickup is. The gasser wins in the $ per mile around here where diesel costs more than gasoline. On the other hand those people who drive high miles and are using the truck as a truck to haul heavy cargo or trailer loads. Then the diesel does win in the $ per mile. Your trailer hauling to Alaska is minority application and there the diesel does make sense if other hauling is also done. As for Joe Blow in the coffee shop who drives 20 miles each way to work and tells me how much he's saving with diesel fuel?. Joe is more emotional in his choices than a mathematician. North American diesel cars? If the cost of diesel was 2/3 the price of gasoline as it is in Europe. Where gasoline sells for 5-6$ per liter, not gallons. Then of course diesel is the hands down winner. In fact kerosene is about 1/3 the price of gasoline in England. Diesel is 2/3 of gasoline price.Farmers from there are buying up old all-fuel JD's from here and are shipping them home. Manufactures will certainly sell diesel cars here if the customer will pay 3-10 thousand more per vehicle. That's almost all pure extra profit for the manufacture. Currently the main interest in North American diesel cars are those who commute 100+ miles per day for work/business. The parking lot at work must have at least one VW diesel car for every diesel pickup. Around here and for almost every case I've figured the numbers on in the coffee shop at work after somebody brags about their diesel. That diesel option will cost money when driving 300 sometimes even 400 miles per week as a simple unloaded commuter vehicle. Have a look on the highway and count the number of diesel pickups working hauling a load. V.s the number of diesel pickups without scratches in the box as they have only ever hauled groceries and beer. And these trucks have never had a trailer drawbar in the hitch either.

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