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Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbangs

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Butch(OH)

12-09-2005 20:11:57




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I need to build a cone shape from sheetmetal for a project I am working on. Done wasted too much metal trying to figure out how to lay the dang thing out right. Height of the cone is 12". Diameter of the big end is 10" Diameter of the small end is 4". Could somebody in laymen"s terms tell me how to calculate such and lay it out on a sheet so when I roll it up it is shaped right?




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bil b va

12-10-2005 16:24:18




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  

butch..unless you are building a spaceship just use what "i'll tel you how " said . i was once trained in aircraft sheet metal and had all of the layout work . i have did what he said for not critical work and it works fine . lot faster also .... for fun try a off set square pipe to a round pipe transition . all laid out flat to be formed .



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T_Bone

12-10-2005 13:56:15




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  
third party image

Hi Butch,

Cone LayOut By T_Bone

This is a 1/4 patteren layout of any cone size.

The true length of the cone is determined by line EB

Apex E is determined by the angle line of AB

Arc AC and BD is made from the Apex point E

S.O. AC is pi x small cone diameter starting a point A locating point C

S.O. BD is pi x large cone diameter starting at point B loacting point D

S.O. = stretch out or line length

Draw a line from CD as this is the pattern cut line.

Line AB is the second pattern cut line.

The Pattern is from AB to CD.

Work up the cone using a round anvil by hand or using slip rolls.

To use a round anvil for cone work up, choose a anvil 1/3 smaller diameter than the small end diameter of the cone. While holding the small cone diameter, gently form the larger cone diameter around the anvil being careful not to make a crease in the metal by trying to work too much metal too fast. You will need to go over the patteren several times before you get a perfect cone shape.

Once the cone is ruff shaped then you will to fasten the seam. You do however want to work the cone until it looks very smooth before joining the seam.

After the cone seamed is joined, use a wooded mallet while holding the cone tight to the round anvil to tweak the final shape of the cone round.

To use slip rolls to form the cone, first make a cone jig for the top roll. This cone jig is nothing more than a piece of pipe larger than the roll diameter with a pin that can roll 90� the the larger diameter.

To use the roll cone jig, slip the jig over the top roll and close the rolls. Adjust the rolls so they taper about the same angle as the cone taper. Hold the small end of the cone against the jig roll pin then begin to roll. The small cone end will pivot around the rolls. You will need to roll the patteren several times to get a smooth formed cone.

Remove the cone from the rolls a hand tweak the cone until it looks well formed, then join the cone seam, then hand work the cone on the round anvil to finish.

T_Bone

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T_Bone

12-11-2005 12:01:30




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 Re: One More Time! in reply to T_Bone, 12-10-2005 13:56:15  
third party image

Sorry I had to upload the picture to this server. If you want a larger picture, click on the link.

Cone LayOut By T_Bone

This is a 1/4 patteren layout of any cone size.

The true length of the cone is determined by line EB

Apex E is determined by the angle line of AB

Arc AC and BD is made from the Apex point E

S.O. AC is pi x small cone diameter starting a point A locating point C

S.O. BD is pi x large cone diameter starting at point B locating point D

S.O. = stretch out or line length

Draw a line from CD as this is the pattern cut line.

Line AB is the second pattern cut line.

The Pattern is from AB to CD.

Work up the cone using a round anvil by hand or using slip rolls.

To use a round anvil for cone work up, choose a anvil 1/3 smaller diameter than the small end diameter of the cone. While holding the small cone diameter, gently form the larger cone diameter around the anvil being careful not to make a crease in the metal by trying to work too much metal too fast. You will need to go over the patteren several times before you get a perfect cone shape.

Once the cone is ruff shaped then you will to fasten the seam. You do however want to work the cone until it looks very smooth before joining the seam.

After the cone seamed is joined, use a wooded mallet while holding the cone tight to the round anvil to tweak the final shape of the cone round.

To use slip rolls to form the cone, first make a cone jig for the top roll. This cone jig is nothing more than a piece of pipe larger than the slip roll diameter with a pin that can roll 90� the the larger diameter.

To use the roll cone jig, slip the jig over the top roll and close the rolls. Adjust the rolls so they taper about the same angle as the cone taper. Hold the small end of the cone against the jig roll pin then begin to roll. The small cone end will pivot around the roll jig. You will need to roll the patteren several times to get a smooth formed cone.

Remove the cone from the rolls and hand tweak the cone until it looks well formed, then join the cone seam, then hand work the cone on the round anvil to finish.

Cone layout as shown above will give you a perfect flat top and bottom diameter without triming.

T_Bone

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Butch(OH)

12-10-2005 12:07:53




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  
Thanks men, Ill get the camera over to the shop and get you a picture of what you helped me build.



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Jet9N

12-10-2005 09:32:14




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  
This is not all that difficult. Draw a side profile of the cone. 10" wide base, 4" wide top X 12" high. (To play with this on a smaller scale and get an idea of what you are doing find a ruler with metric scale on it so you can do it on a smaller piece of paper). Extend the lines on the side of the cone to the apex. (To the point where they cross). From this point draw an arc from both the corner of the base and the top. This is the shape you need to cut to form the cone. Measure around the outside of the arc to a length of 31.14". (10 X pi). From both ends of this segment draw a line to the center of the arc. This is the arc segment that will give you the cone you want.

HTH

Jet

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mechman

12-10-2005 07:52:45




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  
hey rod can you tell me how to put in a link like that. yours makes it alot easier to get to. thanks!!



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PGN

12-10-2005 04:29:31




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  
Butch, I like to use a piece of cardboard or construction paper to make a template. Then just lay it out on your metal and trace the outline. Hope this helps.



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I'll tell you how to get

12-10-2005 03:22:18




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  
take a piece of 24" x 24" siding aluminum , or anything of the like for a pattern. You can use the actuall sheetmetal if thin enough. Cut the biggest circle you can from the pattern material. Now cut the circle half way through(radius). Now keep overlapping the two cut edges of radius till you get the cone shape you want. You will have to cut the 4 inch hole in the top..... ..... . You'll get the idea when the round piece of aluminum starts to take the cone shape. When finished , use as pattern for actual project.

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mechman

12-09-2005 20:37:32




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Butch(OH), 12-09-2005 20:11:57  
hey butch, copy and paste this link in your browser and it will tell you the calculations for creating a cone. good luck.
http://jwilson.coe.uga.edu/emt725/CarlCone/Solution.html



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Steve Crum

12-10-2005 04:40:33




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to mechman, 12-09-2005 20:37:32  
Mechman,
I couldn't get this link to work, do you have a different variation? I'm also interested.



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Rod (NH)

12-10-2005 05:26:41




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Steve Crum, 12-10-2005 04:40:33  
Hi Steve,

It's an interesting link, however it was not immediately obvious (at least to me) where in heck he comes up with the 8pi and 24pi dimensions. Or how he arrives at the 240 deg (typo?). It is much clearer if you go to a preceeding link here. Perhaps this link will work better for you. There is also a cool link to an excel spreadsheet where you can input your own variables and the calculations are done for you - that is if you have excel on your computer.

third party image Rod

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Steve Crum

12-10-2005 08:49:14




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 Re: Chance to show your smarts sheetmetal whizbang in reply to Rod (NH), 12-10-2005 05:26:41  
Thanks, I'll turn this over to my Geek son!



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