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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u

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Over my head!

11-05-2005 19:53:01




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Got a 3 phase 10 hp air compressor.Want to use a second 3 phase moter as a phase converter.
Question # 1.How big does the (second)phase converter motor need to be?
Question #2(compund question).Is there a way to rig the coverter so it won't have to be weighted and kick started every time? Capacitors an answer? Belt it to a single phase motor and start that with a magnetic switch fed from the pressure switch?
Question # 3.(simple) Buy a used phase converter? Where? Whoops, that makes this a compound question too.

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Bus Driver

11-08-2005 04:34:18




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 Re: O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u in reply to Over my head! HELP!, 11-05-2005 19:53:01  
If you do decide to try the VFD to power the 10 HP motor, it will require a VFD rated at least 15HP due to the single phase supply. Your single phase service must be at least 100 amp to handle the starting surge. Be warned- VFD's must be programmed for the specific usage. My VFD instruction book is 183 pages. It is not a matter of "plug in and go".



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JL Sargent

11-06-2005 20:22:23




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 Re: O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u in reply to Over my head! HELP!, 11-05-2005 19:53:01  
Nothing cheap about a VFD that will start a 10hp 3phase motor unfortunately. A rotary phase converter can be built that would start it and you can make it capacitor start or pony motor start either way no kicking. Best bet though would be as suggested by Charles and that would be to step down to a 7.5hp single phase motor and reduce pump speed as needed. One note: They do make a 10hp single phase motor. Its expensive to buy and expensive to run. Good luck.

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buickanddeere

11-06-2005 07:07:41




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 Re: O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u in reply to Over my head! HELP!, 11-05-2005 19:53:01  
As previously stated. VFD with three phase output and single phase input are cheap,a rotary converter cannot even compare. 10HP single phase motors are out there and sell cheap. Nobody wants or uses them.



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MarkB_MI

11-06-2005 05:41:48




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 Re: O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u in reply to Over my head! HELP!, 11-05-2005 19:53:01  
I agree with BD and Charles. You'll go nuts trying to get your compressor to start off of a phase convertor.

Also, to get 10 horsepower out of a 240V single phase circuit, you'll need 34 amps. You'll need a dedicated 40 or 50 amp circuit.

Charles has the right idea: Put the biggest single phase, capacitor-start/capacitor-run motor you can find on it, and use different pulleys to derate it.

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Bus Driver

11-06-2005 05:19:23




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 Re: O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u in reply to Over my head! HELP!, 11-05-2005 19:53:01  
Compressors are typically very hard starting loads. Phase convertors do not offer high starting torque. Perhaps a VFD supplying the motor would offer the torque required, but I do not know for sure. Explore that possibility or change the motor to single phase. Search for "farm duty motors" to find that size in single phase.



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Bob

11-06-2005 01:02:34




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 Re: O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u in reply to Over my head! HELP!, 11-05-2005 19:53:01  
Here is a link to a site that has VERY active discussions about phase convertors:



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Charles (in GA)

11-05-2005 20:25:46




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 Re: O.K. electricians a ? ot 2 for u in reply to Over my head! HELP!, 11-05-2005 19:53:01  
Put a single phase motor on it. If they don't make 10 hp single phase, install a 7.5 hp single phase and slow the pump down to about 600-650 rpm and you will have what several of the compressor manufacturers are doing for new units, using a "10hp pump" with a 7.5 hp motor.

Charles



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