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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail

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z145fergie

07-21-2005 13:10:24




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For general 2X construction framing, what's the comparative assembly/joining properties, shear & tension, of a deck screw vs equivalent size nail? Under what circumstances would you choose nails over screws, & vise versa? I'm thinking screws have advantage in tensil loading, nails in shear loads....your opinions? Thanks.




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CRUSADER

07-24-2005 06:32:54




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to z145fergie, 07-21-2005 13:10:24  
Good question with a lot of good advice, comments, and points to ponder. I am not a carpenter, but having lived on the farm, worked and done several handy man, construction and odd jobs; I also have nailed a few boards together. Thanks to technology, and the cordless drill/driver I am ever so thankful for because using it is so much more convienent and a lot less painfull. About five years ago (probably longer than that, but that's when I finally went to see a doctor that sent me to a orthopedic surgeon) was told that I have a tumor in my left hand. He gave me the option of leaving it alone or having it surgically removed due to the fact that it wasn't cancerous. Well when he told me that they "may cut a few tendons that could be sewn back together and that there wouldn't be any change in things as far as use, pain, etc. I decided to live with it. Being left handed, this has limited me at times for what I am able to do. I have a Sear's Craftsman cordless drill that I bought from the BX and wonder how I ever managed to get by without it before. I still swing a hammer, but them drill drivers and screws sure make life a lot nicer and the jobs a lot easier.

Jim

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MAC,IL

07-22-2005 12:06:07




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to z145fergie, 07-21-2005 13:10:24  
Never gave that much thought, but I like to use the screw, where if I have to remove or replace something, it sure is a lot easier than pulling nails.



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BobR

07-21-2005 18:38:11




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to z145fergie, 07-21-2005 13:10:24  
For sheer holding power, screws are the way to go.I use them in all my outdoor projects. Also, they won't loosen and back out over time, like a nail will. just my .02, Bob



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youngster

07-21-2005 18:24:17




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to z145fergie, 07-21-2005 13:10:24  
All i want to know is what happened to the old days??? old times didnt have screws they used nails for it all and there stuff is better than what you make today with high quality screws and the best construction adhesive money can buy so whats the deal?? are we just in capable of using nails like the old timers??



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Mattlt

07-22-2005 05:45:11




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to youngster, 07-21-2005 18:24:17  
I know one thing: The old timers sure used enough nails when they built something. Everytime I have to work on some of these old things, it seems there are about 2 or 3 times more nails than there needs to be. Of course, the building is still standing, so it must have worked.

Nails must have been cheap back then.



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Galen

07-21-2005 18:40:31




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to youngster, 07-21-2005 18:24:17  
Not necessarily - Alot of the construction TECHNIQUES have improved, but the carpenters haven't. It's "throw 'em up, move on to the next one" mentality now. Sure, the old houses are still here, but look deeper and you will find a LOT of things that could have been done better. Windows, doors, floors, roofing, foundation, headers, etc - lots of items that could have improved. Some of the new technology has vastly improved, but it is up to the carpenter to use it. I'd use a combination of BOTH screws and nails - depends on the application. For rough framing a screw will hold better now, but later a nail would be prefered due to the nails' ability to "bend" while a screw will most likely break under shifting loads.

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dhermesc

07-22-2005 09:21:04




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to Galen, 07-21-2005 18:40:31  
I agree, old timers got away with some pretty sloppy work because they used superior material. I owned a huge old house built in 1916, I don't think the guys that built it owned a square or a level. No cripplers or headers on any door or window. But they did use dimensional old growth yellow pine. Same construction using today's white pine would blow down with the first wind.

USE SCREWS when in doubt.

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txgrn

07-21-2005 17:41:28




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to z145fergie, 07-21-2005 13:10:24  
Screw hands down. Screw is made of high tensile steel; nail cold rolled unless it is a concrete nail.....and a screw will beat a nail in shear hands down also cause a nail will bend and the screw won't; it'll break first and that will take more doing than a pine board can do.

Mark



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Ramrod

07-21-2005 13:33:13




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to z145fergie, 07-21-2005 13:10:24  
Nails are tougher than screws, which are harder and brittle. In a deck, screws will hold better through the years, if they don't break off. If you're using a nail gun and ring nails, the nails will hold pretty well, but after 8 years, my deck needs a little attention to tap a few nails back in when they pop up a bit. My neighbor used screws, they're holding well, but it took him much longer, and they do break off. My choice is a nail gun for deck construction, and a hammer once a decade for maintenance.

Ramrod

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mike brown

07-21-2005 13:44:38




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to Ramrod, 07-21-2005 13:33:13  
Nails are probably tougher in shear and tensil for a given diameter. If you're thinking holding power in wood, screws win hands down. When I was investigating metal roofing a couple years ago I read that roofing screws hold six times better than nails.



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Bret4207

07-23-2005 04:34:47




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 Re: Shear/Tensil Strength: Deck Screw vs Nail in reply to mike brown, 07-21-2005 13:44:38  
Oh yeah, definatly screws on metal roofing. The wind will vibrate the nails loose for sure. I prefer to spend a bit extra and get screws that penetrate through the sheeting.



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