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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Welding question

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chvet73

10-10-2004 17:50:11

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I am in the process of adding teeth to an extra bucket I have for my Bobcat. I started out using my Hobart 175 mig. The bucket is 3/8" thick. The mig was not getting the penetration on the bucket, had no problem with the teeth. I guess that's why they say it's capacity is 1/4". I switched over to my trusty Lincoln Buzz Box. I was using 3/16" 6011 rod. I tried 135 and 150 amps. No trouble getting penetration. But here is my problem the teeth are melting to fast causing the weld to undercut on the teeth side.
So what do I need to do? Different rod, different amperage or just learn to be a better welder?

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[email protected]

10-12-2004 13:18:58

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Re: Welding question in reply to chvet73, 10-10-2004 17:50:11

Thanks for the advice guys. I'm going to get some 7018 rod and try it this weekend.

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old

10-10-2004 21:03:43

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Re: Welding question in reply to chvet73, 10-10-2004 17:50:11

Well if it was me and useing the welder you are I'd use 7014 easyer to weld with and its as strong as the 7018. The 7014 just makes it easyer to get a good weld. I use the 7018 on my DC portable machine but not with my AC buzz box. I was also a welder but retired now. But I still burn up a lot of rods.

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markct

10-13-2004 05:45:20

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Re: Welding question in reply to old, 10-10-2004 21:03:43

7014 is just as strong in some applications, but usualy the reason to use 7018 is in high alloy steels, it is a low hydrogen rod that helps to prevent hydrogen imbrittlement in the weld which can cause it to crack

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old

10-13-2004 22:04:07

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Re: Welding question in reply to markct, 10-13-2004 05:45:20

But you have to remember the average joe only welds once in a while and uses an AC buzz box and 7018 is made for a DC machine and yes they have a 7018 for and AC machine but it only does a good job if you know how to weld. I use both types of rod but if I use my AC buzz box I use the 7014 but if I want a good strong weld I'll fire up my DC machine and use the 7018. In most places the 7014 works great and like I said if the person isn't a weld by trade hes better off with the 7014... And this isn't just my idea this comes from a man that welded longer then you probably have walked, This man taught welder for the pipe lines in the oil field and up till a few years ago he could weld circles around just about any body.

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Pile Buck

10-14-2004 06:57:32

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Re: Welding question in reply to old, 10-13-2004 22:04:07

Hey Old, you know your right, when you weld for a living it is easy to forget not everybody knows what you are talking about! That�s why I love T_Bone�s replies he seems to talk / write at everybody�s level. The guy is just great, but he does have a tendency to bring me back down to earth every once in awhile. I don�t think I have ever used 7014, will have to get some and try it. 99.5% of my career has been on diesel driven machines, so DC is always there!

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old

10-14-2004 08:30:13

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Re: Welding question in reply to Pile Buck, 10-14-2004 06:57:32

You should try to weld with 7018 on an AC machine it can be fun and not in a good way. Its hard to keep an arc going. But with 7014 a child can keep it going, thats why I tell people with the good old buzz boxes to use the 7014, most of them only weld because they need to fix something not because they really want to have to do it as I did years ago for a liveing. And yes I've done it all mig,tig,and arc. I'd love to own a machine to do mig and tig but most of the time I weld stuff that mig or tig would not work well.

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Pile Buck

10-14-2004 08:50:31

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Re: Welding question in reply to old, 10-14-2004 08:30:13

Hi old. You know I have used 7018 on an AC machine before, but it was about a hundred years ago. If memory serves it was not fun, seems like I had better luck to run it real hot, but was a very long time ago. Only time I run AC is for Tig welding, other wise not sure the machine will even switch over to it. LOL. I did a job about 30-years ago where we were required to run 7016 for some reason (engineers), there again on diesel powered machines. Seemed like it was real shinny, almost like chrome, or stainless looking, have not run 7016 since then.

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old

10-14-2004 08:57:38

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Re: Welding question in reply to Pile Buck, 10-14-2004 08:50:31

Sounds like that 7016 was a nickel rod, I use NI-rod for cast iron and some places that I need a very strong weld like on 3 point arms. Only problem wirh NI-rod is it cost about $20 a lbs

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Pile Buck

10-10-2004 19:47:58

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Re: Welding question in reply to chvet73, 10-10-2004 17:50:11

Hi chvet73. If it were me, I would not use the 6011, or 6013. I would only use 7018. 1/8� or 5/32� does not make any difference, what ever your machine can handle. I never tell someone what amperage to run, because every machine is different. Sounds like your biggest problem is the wrong angle of your welding rod. Or you are way to hot. What are the dimensions of the teeth? In my opinion 6013 is for sheet metal, 6011 is for tacking, 6010 is for root passes on pipe.

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RusselAZ

10-10-2004 19:20:25

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Re: Welding question in reply to chvet73, 10-10-2004 17:50:11

Throw any 3/16th rods away. Preheat the bucket. Then use a single first pass around the tooth with 1/8th 6011. Then make two passes around the tooth with 5/32 6013 at about 170-180 amps or you can even use 6013 at about 150 amps.

The first pass aroud the tooth with the small rod will attach the tooth to the bucket so it will have a good heat sink and gas seal which will help a lot in keeping the tooth from melting and blowing away.

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lucas boy

10-10-2004 18:49:06

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Re: Welding question in reply to chvet73, 10-10-2004 17:50:11

not what you would call a real welder,but tough steel is usaully high carbon so i would try a 7018 rod or equivilent. maybe try dropping your amperage and or playing the rod more to the thicker part ..lucas

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JohnnyJ

10-10-2004 20:14:55

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Re: Welding question in reply to lucas boy, 10-10-2004 18:49:06

Take it from a professional welder, the guys who said use 7018 are right. 6011 and 6013 will wind up breaking off. The mig will work as well, just bevel the parts first, leave a gap, and weld HOT. Most folks run mig way too cold. And no matter what process you use, when welding 2 different thicknesses, apply the majority of the heat to the thicker part.

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10-18-2004 17:15:49

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Re: Welding question in reply to JohnnyJ, 10-10-2004 20:14:55

You hit the undercutting problem nail right on the head with your last sentence. As for AC vs. DC; ever since I sold my Pipeliner I've been using a high frequency box on AC for the jobs I previously did with DC....400mHz is real close to DC and runs lo-hi like a champ.

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