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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

OT: dutch elm disease

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Kurt (mi)

08-24-2004 08:21:43




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I have wooded property and many elms that I have are dead. Can these trees be used for firewood? Does burning the wood spread the disease? I think that the disease is a bug that destroys the root system or am I wrong.




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paul

08-25-2004 09:28:43




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
It's pretty good firewood.

Be very careful cutting the trees down, the dead wood is exceptionally brittle. It does not make timber any more due to this. The vibration of a chainsaw can crack a big branch off & kill you. Do _not_ take this lightly. Also cabling them is difficult, as they will break as likely as pull over, and the different pieces can fly in all directions.

The disease is a fungus which is carried by the beetles (Dutch Elm Bark Beetles) from tree to tree, or by roots from touching trees passing the fungus on. There is a very expensive treatment for the fungus which only lasts a few years. there is no good way to control the beetles. The bugs theselves do not harm the trees at all - unless the burrow in an infected tree & carry the fungus to a healthy one.

The fungus fills up the sap runways in the tree & choke the tree to death, like blockages in our blood vessels.

Bare elm wood does not spread the disease. However, dead wood with the bark on it will support beetles as they burrow & live under the bark, which then pass the fungus on to healthy trees. So, you do not want to store the wood with bark on.

I've split a far amount of different wood in my day, and the elm wood we have here in southern Minnesota is by far and away the stringiest wood and most difficult to split. Perhaps your saplings haven't formed the stringy grains yet, or you have a smoother species. Rock elm is the worst of all.....

The imported Chineese Elm can somewhat survive Duch Elm disease, but they may die a slow death one limb at a time, and end up being a carrier for the fungus.

If you have any living elm left, get rid of all dead elm with bark on it. Do not allow a habitat for the beetles on diseased trees. If an elm starts wilting or an entire branch wilts & goes dead, it is infected & that tree is a goner. Cut it & peel the bark.

We had it go through back in the '70-80s here, it sounds like another wave is going around again. Not many elms left here to infect any more.

--->Paul

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Fred OH

08-25-2004 07:15:49




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
May I mention that the tree people have come up with a new strain of elm that is resistant to the disease called American elm. There is another one too, but I forget it"s name. These seedlings were available from certain tree nurseries and I think there was one in Indiana, Pennsylvania. The info was from an older(?) issue of Mother Earth News. Stopped at a park recently called Logan Elms and they"re truly a magnificent tree...big as some of the giant oaks you see. Fred OH

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buickanddeere

08-24-2004 16:18:22




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
The limbs could have died years before the rest of the tree. Elms are noted as being widow makers arond here.



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300 Randy

08-24-2004 14:21:52




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
I would leave the dead trees up for a couple of years as you will get a good crop of morrel mushrooms under them for a few years. Once the morrels stop I'll cut mine down for firewood.



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Mike(Wi)

08-24-2004 11:56:34




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
Well, elm is my favorite firewood. I like to cut up standing trees that have been dead for a few years and have lost all their bark.

Now maybe I am doing something wrong, but they have never been a problem for me. I like the fact that there is no bark--make for a much cleaner situation when stacking and hauling.

To me they don't split any harder than the oaks and other stuff I get. I just cut a little groove in the end with a chain saw about 1/2 the width of the bar. Then I put a wedge in the groove and hammer away with the sledge. Normally break apart pretty cleanly. Average splitting size for me is about 16 inches or so in diameter.

If you don't cut the groove it is hard to get it started. The wedge tends to bounce off when struck with the sledge.

Hope this helps.

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TheRealRon

08-24-2004 08:59:39




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
Elm is decent firewood and is safe to use for personal use as such; you cannot spread the disease. However, it is somewhere between difficult and impossible to split... the grain is very twisted. Either use a decent hydraulic log splitter or let them dry really well and burn them whole.



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Kurt (mi)

08-24-2004 09:14:48




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to TheRealRon, 08-24-2004 08:59:39  
It is not hard to split, I have about a full face cord plus standing dead trees to drop and cut up, mostly smaller trees with trunks in the 3-7" diameter range.



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TheRealRon

08-24-2004 09:38:58




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 09:14:48  
Try splitting some 2 footers and then get back to me!



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Kurt (mi)

08-24-2004 10:13:01




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to TheRealRon, 08-24-2004 09:38:58  
The biggest I have is 12' diam. I split these with no problem, with an axe too.



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TheRealRon

08-24-2004 10:20:29




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 10:13:01  
Everyone who has ever tried to split elm agrees it's the most difficult wood to split. By the way, 3" to 7" diameter wood is kindling, not firewood.

You're making up your story as you go. Why you want to argue about something so silly is beyond me. There are folks here who need information and I'll help them and just ignore you from now on.



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KURT (mi)

08-25-2004 02:41:57




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to TheRealRon, 08-24-2004 10:20:29  
For 5 years now I have split logs, many different types. 3" is cut to size and stacked, I dont waste much firewood. Many factors exist for splitting logs, 1. sharpness of the axe to penetrate the log. 2. the durablilty of the stump or concrete under the log you are splitting. 3. the technique used in splitting. 4. I use a fiberglass handle with a 6lb splitting wedge on the end of it. I am not here to argue with you on whats tough or not tough. I come on this site daily to get helped and help others if I can. The reason I asked about the elm disease is because I have lost over 20 trees with more to cut down because of this disease and i dont like to have drop trees on my property due to a disease. I cleared my land for the house, garage and septic and a small yard in the back. In my opinion I am finished clearing my forest. I would like to have the forest remain for decades to come and not have to worry about Dutch elm disease or the Emerald ash borer bug destroying my ash trees. Have a nice day.

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Missouri Boy

08-24-2004 16:50:59




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to TheRealRon, 08-24-2004 10:20:29  
Ron there are several varieties of Elm. Some can be split and some cannot. We both responded to a post in the Tractor Talk. My dad always used a bouble bit axe to split any wood. i use a splitting maul. When uising a wedge place the wedge centered between the bark and the heart . Never drive a wedge in the heart. That is the stringiest wood. When in the Army at Fort Eustis< Virginia we were on a detail to cut firewood for the officer's club. I was the only one who could split yellow pine with a wedge because the others would try to drive the wedge through the heart.

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jakej

08-24-2004 08:50:02




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
Its OK for fire wood. The damage is caused by the newly hatched which feed under the bark cutting the nutrients that keep the tree alive. The adults find a live tree to lay eggs. MI tried to prevent movement of ash wood from the southern part of the state without sucess.



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TimFL

08-24-2004 08:26:52




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to Kurt (mi), 08-24-2004 08:21:43  
There are may web sites with good information.



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TimFL

08-24-2004 08:28:05




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to TimFL, 08-24-2004 08:26:52  
Here is one.
http://www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo/pubs/howtos/ht_ded/ht_ded.htm



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ray in ct

08-24-2004 08:39:04




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 Re: OT: dutch elm disease in reply to TimFL, 08-24-2004 08:28:05  
My understanding is not to transport it in areas that are quarrantined.
http://www.forestyforum.com has a ask the forester section that may have handled the question before. If not ask it there as well.



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