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bentonite vs plastic sheet

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Eeleater

07-26-2004 05:41:25




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I am trying to improve some drainage near the house and put in a gravel "rock garden" area. The area is heavy clay base soil which does not drain well. I have put in a drain in the center of a low point, with the intention of putting several layers of 6 mil plastic sheeting leading to it,a layer of landscape fabric and then the gravel on top. I have put down some plastic, but have found in walking over it the clay soil is soft undefoot. I am afraid the higher foot trafic areas will sink in and puncture the plastic. I am now considering putting down and rolling in some driveway gravel to firm up the base, then sprnkling on a layer of bentonite from the feed store, then the fabric, then the rock garden gravel. My understanding is tht the bentonite will form a relativly waterproof layer. Is the second plan workable- and using the feed store bentonite?

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Nolan

07-27-2004 03:31:46




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 Re: bentonite vs plastic sheet in reply to Eeleater, 07-26-2004 05:41:25  
Bentonite clay is good stuff, but it has limitations. It doesn't work well when "sprinkled". You need several inches of it to form a barrier. It is a mechanical barrier, and subject to mechanical damage. If the substrate is weak, and feet walking over it punch through, it will leak.

Plastic film is inherently weak and easily punctured. Multiple layers do not address the weakness. You will still get punctures. Only now it will allow water and material between the layers where it will decompose. This will create a stench and slipperyness between the layers of plastic.

There are thinner membranes, such as those sold by Home Depot for ponds, as well as the thin roof membranes. These do work, and stand up to mild foot traffic better.

In your application, you would do well to establish the foot paths and support them under the membrane. Pressure treated 2x4's will hold up for years and distribute the load. To a somewhat lesser degree so will pressure treated plywood.

You can keep foot traffic off the ground with raised paths as well. This would allow you to use the cheaper plastic under a protective cover. This may be a viable alternative for a single path in a restricted area, as you seem to describe it being.

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Ron

07-26-2004 06:01:50




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 Re: bentonite vs plastic sheet in reply to Eeleater, 07-26-2004 05:41:25  
Bentonite will work but not applied as you suggest. You can check with a supplier for application methods.

I'm not sure what problem you are trying to solve. You cannot posssibly have foot traffic on gravel over plastic. It won't last. They sell a rubber "pond liner" made for that purpose that will seal the drainage area to your drain very nicely. It ain't cheap but it does work. If you want a foot path through the rock garden, I'd just lay a good crushed rock base, build it up and put stepping stones on it. If the path is in the middle of the rock garden then you would have two areas requiring drainage, each with a drain and pond liner.

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Eeleater

07-26-2004 13:44:08




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 Re: Re: bentonite vs plastic sheet in reply to Ron, 07-26-2004 06:01:50  
Let me clarify a bit. What I have is an inside corner where the garage joins the house. the door into the Garage and thus the kitchen is in this corner. The kitchen windows look out over the area. It has never drained well in the area. It has had stepping stones. Last year we put in a Koi pond that sits slightly outside this area, and put in more stepping stones. This did not make a differnce with the drainage- but did increase the foot traffic.

What I have done is add some fill to improve drainage from the foundation, and added a drain in the area, as well as burying the gutter drains to a frech drain well away from the house. I want to cover the area between the structure and the pond with a gravel of a dark hue, which will set off the stepping stones we will put back in. The gravel will allow rain to flow to the drain- and I would prefer not to have plants and weeds growing up. The plastic was for weeds as well as well as drainage. I do not want to put in concrete. Due to shading the area does not grow grass well up next to the house- but weeds seems to do fine.

I am well aware of the pond liner options- having used it for the pond- but it is expensive and probably overkill.

I am not sure if the feedstore will know about use of the bentonite for this purpose.

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VaTom

07-29-2004 05:01:53




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 Re: Re: Re: bentonite vs plastic sheet in reply to Eeleater, 07-26-2004 13:44:08  
I've used a lot of bentonite, both sheets and granular. It needs pressure to be water-proofing. I don't see your application succeeding, not enough pressure.

As a builder of underground houses, I use 6 mil sheet plastic for the primary water shield, sometimes it's the only thing used. Works great. Our application includes rigid insulation between layers of 6 mil. We've never had any problems with foot or vehicle traffic with our 12" dirt overlay.

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VaTom

07-29-2004 05:12:11




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: bentonite vs plastic sheet in reply to VaTom, 07-29-2004 05:01:53  
Forgot to mention that used billboard vinyl is incredibly tough and usually free if you have any sign companies in your area. Should be large enough for your application.



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