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PH welder

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Dave Sherburne,

07-09-2004 06:39:10

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I have a 130 amp P&H welder at least 50 years
old . It worked fine til last week and has served
my purposes well. I don't weld to often and don't
need a new welder. Last week when I turned it on,
it started smoking. I took it apart, and the Capacitor was smoking. I insulated the capacitor
from the frame, and it would work but I need a
new capacitor. The local welding supply can't
help unless they can read the writing on the old rusty capacitor , a 6"x6"x8"tall box.
Not a chance thru the rust. ANY IDEAS

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RJC

07-10-2004 08:46:18

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Re: PH welder in reply to Dave Sherburne, NY, 07-09-2004 06:39:10

Dave, I took my 180amp P&H welder apart and it has two caps in it. One is a 3 section can with all three tied together that is tied from line to line on the transformer side of the switch. It has 3x4.0 mfd 600v on it. The other cap which is more the size you described, goes from one line on the switch and to a wire coming out of the transformer with nothing else hooked to it. That cap has 30uf 485v on it. GE part #45f1172. This welder has been on our farm for as long as I can remember. 50yrs? The only catch is you have to help me put it back together, It will probably have the case off for the next six months, I never finish a project so they say. Let me know if this helps.

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RJC

07-10-2004 05:28:25

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Re: PH welder in reply to Dave Sherburne, NY, 07-09-2004 06:39:10

I have a P&H welder also. Very heavy. Had it apart a few years ago and put a fan in it and I remember seeing the metal can capacitor. I can't remember the value right of hand or if you could even make it out but if you check back here in a few days I'll take the case off and see if I can read it.

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brianh

07-09-2004 17:48:18

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Re: PH welder in reply to Dave Sherburne, NY, 07-09-2004 06:39:10

Get someone with a capacitor analyzer or Z-meter (impedance meter) to measure it for you. Or send it to me and I'll measure it for you. E-mail me if you need more help.

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MarkB

07-09-2004 19:30:32

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Re: Re: PH welder in reply to brianh, 07-09-2004 17:48:18

Uh, Brian, I don't think you're going to be able to measure the capacitance of a fried capacitor.

My guess is they just put in the biggest capacitor that would fit in the space available. I think Fred's right: try to find something for a similar welder that you can actually get parts for.

There might be something on the Allied Electronics web site that will work. The main question is whether this is a polarized (electrolytic) capacitor or not. Dave should be able to look at the capacitor and tell if it's polarized. Either there will be + and - marking on the terminals, or one end will have crimp around it. Once Dave knows what KIND of capacitor it is, I think it's just a matter of finding a replacement of about the same physical size and of appropriate voltage rating.

Allied Electronics

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brianh

07-10-2004 06:06:15

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Re: Re: Re: PH welder in reply to MarkB, 07-09-2004 19:30:32

He said the unit worked fine when he took the capacitor loose from the frame of the welder. The cap is still functional, it's just shorted to the case. We can still read it and determine the value. This happens in high voltage equipment all the time.

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Bob

07-09-2004 22:35:05

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Re: Re: Re: PH welder in reply to MarkB, 07-09-2004 19:30:32

The capacitor is very likely an oil-filled, non-polarized capacitor for power factor correction, and possibly arc stability.

A good guess would be somewhere between 5 and 30 mfd at 300 to 600 VAC.

Some such capactors used to be filled with oil containing PCB's. Don't get in contact with any leaked or spilled oil, and dispose of properly.

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Fred OH

07-09-2004 08:40:01

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Re: PH welder in reply to Dave Sherburne, NY, 07-09-2004 06:39:10

Dave, if you can't find out what the value of your capacitor is...maybe you could go to a welder site like Hobart or Lincoln or such and look at the value on theirs. Shouldn't it be similar? I would think (without looking) that it would be something of a low mfd like 10 or 20 and voltage rating of a hundred on more should be okay. I think it just gives a little "poof" of extra to get the rod started. If you got one with too much "poof"...it would just burn a hole in anything thin that you were starting to weld, I think. But, 6x6x8 is pretty big...better wait till the electricians have their say. Fred OH

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