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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

partsman's lament

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old partsguy

04-12-2004 19:19:59

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anyone else on these boards sell parts for a living? seems like no one ever has much good to say about us or our profession.i read complaints about the "kids" behind the counter.if you want to be an eletrician you can go to trade school..same with a carpenter,bodyman,mechanic,etc... however, there is no school for becoming a partsman.you learn by doing.as a counterman i am required not only to find parts,but troubleshoot problems as well..bear in mind the shops have computers to do this...we don't.i also have to know about paint products and how to apply them.we not only have to know about cars and trucks, but tractors and farm machinery as well.another requirement is bookkeeping skills to keep my inventory straight.also have to be a competent bill collector for the ones who don't pay on time. i work at this 46 hours a week.i have done so for over 25 years..oh yeah, i get 11.00 an hour to do this.it is not a glamorous high paying job. i salute the young "kids" who have b#lls enough to give it a shot. i a have seen lots of them try for a while and then quit to get a better paying job in a factory that requires less effort.i would ask each and everyone of you to think about this next time the young guy in the napa, o reilly's, carquest or whatever tries to help you..give em a break and they will give you their best..thanks, partsguy

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bob g ny

04-14-2004 08:13:21

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

I have worked in the parts business for 20 plus years and i think the biggest problem is these new chain parts stores. I have worked part time for one for 7 years and have seen alot. Managments way of thinking is you can put anybody in for for as little money as possible with no auto experiance and thats the way it is. They really dont realise that when people keep getting the wrong parts you loose alot of business. I have worked with even asst. managers who cant even change a tire . These companys have to learn that experiance is what makes the business not just cheaper prices.

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Fred Kobs

04-14-2004 02:03:00

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

After pulling wrenches for 24yrs. and living kinda hard, my ol bones just couldn't take the abuse anymore and I started in on the other side of the counter. I have been guilty of "parts man bashing" over the years. Now that I'm selling instead of buying, I can honestly say I've seen both sides, both the good and the bad. I work with mostly guys under 25 and I can tell you that they really put forth the effort to get the right part the first time. What people don't understand is that there are so many changes and variations even in a given model year on anything newer than about 1995 the manufacturers don't give all the info. or even allow access to some of the simplest parts or information. And then you throw in all the "junk" a part store has to stock to get the general public in the door, it is mandatory to have these "kids" running the counter 'cause they are the only ones that can keep up on the newer stuff out there. Most of the crew I work with couldn't tell you about internal motor parts but have dealt with computer controlled motors all their lives and know the electronic end of it as well as I do. The fact that most parts are on computer makes it so you have to look a long time for a counterman over 45 that can operate the computer, let alone sell parts and these days we have a 4' unit with 5 packed rows of books on it and half the parts aren't in the books either. Then you have the new wave of customer to deal with. Used to be the guy buying parts was at least capable of changing oil, plugs, etc. Now they come in and tie up the day while you explain lefty loosey/righty tighty to them. Don't get me wrong, there are still a bunch of capable weekend warriors out there but there are some that words can't describe. The other day I couldn't convince a guy that he couldn't use fuel line and hose clamps to fix a steel brake line that rusted out. After I refused to sell him the stuff from the bulk hose, he went out to the pre-packed hi-dollar stuff and spent more than the parts would've cost to do it right. BTW he had a 2yr old daughter tagging behind him..told him her life was riding on his brakes. I agree that most of these kids can't find a bearing w/out a number on it. But for what they get paid, they do an excellent job. Also have to keep in mind that every model year there are another 75+ different models out and there are still all the old ones out there so the amount of info to dig thru is mind boggleing. I had to find brake shoes for a model A 2 days ago. Sorry I rambled on. Fred

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JMS/MN

04-13-2004 22:51:57

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

As usual, Paul has a very good, thoughtful comment- about how management SHOULD realize that the partsman is the main interface between the customer and the company. After over 30+ years of farming and buying MANY (with old, used equipment-duh!) parts, I've generally had good experiences with partsmen. I deal with 3-4 tractor dealers in the immediate (30 mile) area, and find all of the partsmen very knowledgeable and helpful. Oftentimes they leave parts for me outside the door, for later pickup. I do buy parts books for major machines and most tractors I have, so that helps with having the right part number when I call. When I am working on a side project and need to search for a part that might work for that project, they often spend a considerable amount of time to find what I need. Sometimes they spend an inordinate amount of time on a search, and sell me nothing, but other times they spend a few minutes with me and bill me $500 or so. When I farmed full-time, I spent over 20 grand a year on repairs, primarily on several local dealers. Although I occasionally buy from outside sources, I believe in supporting local dealers, otherwise, we soon find ourselves driving much farther to get to a dealer. Recently I encountered a farmer at a local dealer who had driven almost 100 miles to get oil filters for his AC tractor, because no one was closer. When I deal with NAPA or similar stores I might encounter a younger, less experienced person, but they are generally very helpful. It is not easy being a partsman. I've seen so many farmers come in to a store who can't describe what they need, have no idea that there are serial number breaks on a particular machine, etc. I carry a wallet card with serial numbers, or have memorized numbers of major machines, and that is an advantage to the partsmen. And don't bellyache to the partsman about the price of the part! He just works there. Get used to it.

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L arry E

04-13-2004 19:25:34

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

Sounds as though some people are afraid to change.''WHEN YOU ARE THROUGH CHANGING YOU ARE THROUGH''

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Ron in Nebr

04-13-2004 14:45:24

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

You're wrong on one count. At Southeast Community College in Milford Nebraska, which also happens to be one of the top technical schools in several other fields, there IS a two and a half year "Parts" program, where students earn an Associate's degree in being a "Parts Person"(Not sure what the exact title is, it's been close to 20 years since I took the Automotive Technology course there).

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Jerry A.

04-13-2004 11:08:48

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

A GOOD partsman is worth his weight in gold!

They've answered many a dumb question from me and certainly steered me to the correct part(s) when I couldn't figure something out. The good ones know the equipment just as well as the mechanic.

Hats off to the folks who keep us in parts!!!!

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jim

04-13-2004 09:24:33

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

I am an owner of a lawn & garden business. When I hire a new parts man, he always starts in parts room putin away parts to learn what he/she is doing, then they work with an experienced parts person to learn what he/she is doing. No young person should be starting on the parts counter, they should work from the bottom up, the way I started. The way I look at it, either the owners of these companies are doing something wrong in what or whom they hire. Most of the problem with these parts kids is that they think they know everything, so they will not listen to anyone who is trying to teach them how to do their job. I know some of the people I deal with, I try to help them find something over the phone and I get the attitude that they do no need my help, they know it all. So until they will listen adn try to learn, do not give me the song and dance about giving them a break.

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Bill

04-13-2004 07:25:50

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

I worked behind the counter at a napa and a Hardware store. Its really comes down to putting in the extra effort to find the parts needed.The computers are to say the least just a tool that has a listing of parts used for that application for that year. The books dont tell you for example that most point systems on the old Ih tractors are aftermarket delco systems, so when the young kid looks the part up you may get the wrong part cause the book lists only the ih point equal and not the after market that someone threw on 40 years ago. So next time before you shake your head think of whos behind the counter, I loved my jobs, but left to a factory job to pay the bills for my family.

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Mike M

04-13-2004 06:59:39

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

I have worked in parts departments at various dealers. I have also ran my own business for awhile and bought alot of parts. I have been on both sides of the counter. For those that curs us parts guys You ought to try it sometime.Just because your young doesn't make you bad as does old not make you good. I grew up with the books,have used microfiche,and now computers.I can tell you that these computers leave alot to be desired.Lots of misprints and misinformation.In the old days you could just correct it or add a subsitution with a pencil. I can also remember someone telling me that when a customer comes in for parts most generally they are allready in a bad mood because something has just broken. Just remember that when you come in the door WE DIDN'T BREAK IT don't take it out on us.

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paul

04-13-2004 06:13:35

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

Yes, it's a tough job. Management should pay attention - this is generally the biggest 'interface' with the customer. Have a bad or very inexperienced parts guy, & people will look elsewhere. Have to, as you aren't getting any help there.

People are looking for the skills you mention from the other side of the counter. My problem is that I have all old farm equipment, so I need an old parts guy who knows what it is I'm working on, and understands that my part number has been cross-referenced 3 different times to a new part number. If I have something simple, the new guy is fine. For my challenging items, we'll have to stand there 15 minutes & then ask the old guy anyhow - might as well go to the old guy right away, or come back when he's there.

But certainly you make some good points. I really never have a problem with a parts guy - new or old. It's a reflection of management if I can be helped or not - not any one parts person.

I do avoid one JD dealer now - the new kid made some remarks about no one doing it my way any more, or my equipment parts needs are really odd. That kind of attitude is not needed by a parts person. I do understand if my needs are difficult for the new guy to find, and I won't complain about extra time or inexperience. I do not need attitude tho.

--->Paul

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Rusty Jones/ The Mower Ma

04-13-2004 08:36:23

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Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to paul, 04-13-2004 06:13:35

Well, I tip my hat to the parts guy who really takes an interets in helping folks when they ask for parts! We have a large hardware store here, just on the outskirts of Pittsburgh, (North) that has a large inventory of parts for most everything made in the lawn mower business! I'm referring to the smaller parts, not trannys or engines! Although, they used to be able to get anything you wanted, but had to order it! Granted! The parts guy there was very helpful-you could ask him for advice, and he'd give it! Well, the LAST time i went there, the good p.m. had left, and they'd hired some goof who didn't want to get off his butt, so he'd look at yer part, then tell ya it was too old, they didn't have it, wouldn't even try to get it, wouldn't look for it,or he'd be outside smoking his cigs, so, after waiting for 20 minutes for him to finish his smoke, i finally gave it up, never to go back there! I haven't been there for over a year! Don't know or care if he's still there, or if the place still sells parts! And, one time i went 10 miles to another store to get points and condenser for an old Briggs vertical shaft. Now, from my experience with that engine, i knew that the points would work on most all of the small engines, as would the condensers! So, i went, without the Serial no. model no., etc., and asked for a points/ condenser set! Well, the usual questions ensued, so i pointed to the counter cover, with briggs engine parts displayed on it, and pointed to a points set illustrated on it! After much argument, and a 20 mile round trip back home to get the numbers facing me, i just asked for "That set right there!" So i paid for the set, went home, installed the points/ condenser set, and it fired right up and ran. Now, this business, before they opened the new store, when i'd go in and ask for those parts, the guy would go open up a drawer, fish out a point set, loose, a condenser,loose, collect the money and away i'd go, and they'd work just fine! Never looked up part numbers, or asked for serial numbers, etc. Well, that was before everybody got "eddicated! Rusty Jones

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Vern-MI

04-13-2004 04:27:39

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

There are professionals in every profession and there are those who just shouldn't be there. I have been to doctors who have asked the right questions and pinpointed the medical problem on the first visit and I have also been to an ear, nose, and throat doctor who could not figure out that my tonsils needed to be removed. The same thing holds true for Partsmen, Barbers, Plumbers, Engineers, Designers, and every other profession.

The problem with incompetence is that it is so annoying as compared to a professional who really takes their job seriously and provides a valuable service. I have had a Partsman help find a Misubishi engine valve which would fit my Model "T" and also have had a Partsman tell me I could not re-route my heater hose or change the heat range on my spark plug. Which one of the Partsmen do you suppose I told others to stay away from?

Unfortunately the customer must have sufficient knowledge and information to know when they are being given inappropriate information and service from the provider. We must also learn to praise those who are experts and quit whining about those who are incompetent. That is difficult because it is human nature to shed blame.

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Dave H (MI)

04-13-2004 06:34:22

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Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to Vern-MI, 04-13-2004 04:27:39

I'll probably catch a lot of flack on this, but you need to learn the difference between a profession and an occupation. Most of the above are occupations not professions. A person can act professionally in any occupation, but you need to attain certain degrees and certifications before you are actually a professional. It's a moot point, I guess, in these times where the origin of words is being blurred but I hate to see someone work hard to attain a goal and then be classed with a busboy as a "professional".

Don't bust my chops about that last sentence. I behaved professionally when I was a busboy.

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john in la

04-13-2004 01:34:57

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

Well I have never worked as a parts guy but from a x mechanic and home do it yourselfer I must say thank you to the old time parts guy. Yes I am guilty of asking the parts man to explain a system to me or asking for suggestions on a problem. While I have been told a time or two.. WHAT?? You suppose to be the mechanic... For the most part the parts man has been able to help me find a problem I knew nothing about or re-look at something that I just over looked in my haste to repair the problem. This old time parts man knew who made what parts and what they were suppose to do. He/She knew that if you wanted a clutch he had to look in the Borg-Warner book and if you wanted a seal you would look in the National book. He could also take a seal and measure it and compare to listings in the book to find the correct one for you. He also knew parts by name and could find common parts by looking on the shelf and not in the book. If say you were rewiring a tractor with non tractor parts he could help you piece it together just by knowing the parts and how the common ones worked.
The problem I have with the newer parts guy or young kid as you all call him is not really his fault. He is a kid that is most likely in school learning to be a doctor or to repair computers or what ever may even be a high school drop out. He wouldn't know a brake rotor if you dropped it on his foot. He could care less he has Joe's mechanic shop fixing his car. Most likely went out looking for a job at Burger King but a friend told him Fred's auto parts was hiring with no experience.
I blame the whole system including me. Every one is all ways looking for the best price so what happens. The parts store owner has 5 people working at $11.00 a hour. He gets a couple of computers that are programmed to ask questions and then spit out a part # so he lays off 4 of his 5 workers and keeps 1 man that knows the difference from a muffler and a water pump to solve problems and hires 4 new people at $5.15 per hour and spends 15 minutes showing them how to work computer. He can now sell his parts for 10% less forcing every parts store owner within 5 miles to now do the same thing to stay competitive. So in other words if you go to elcheapo parts store expecting to get elcheapo prices also expect to get elcheapo I don't know what you are talking about; man I can't wait to get out of here to see Betty; service. Even if you do not use elcheapo blame those that do for forcing others to reduce labor cost to be competitive.
So again I say to the real parts man thank you for all your help and putting up with the idiots that when asked what kind of car we working on they say the blue one and point in the parking lot.

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Kelvin

04-13-2004 16:24:39

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Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to john in la, 04-13-2004 01:34:57

I wish I could find a job selling parts for $11/hr. I spent 5 months selling parts for $7/hr. once. You can earn as much bagging groceries around here.

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George

04-13-2004 00:11:50

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

Yes, inexperienced counter help is a PITA, but my biggest gripe with parts houses is that phone calls take priority over those in the store, money in hand. I know of no other business where this happens.

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Jeff

04-12-2004 23:35:50

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

OK here we go!
A PARTS MAN'S LAMENT
I work behind the counter of a parts and accessories store. Sometimes I'm called a genius, sometimes I'm called lots more. I'm just a simple parts man, but when a job goes sick. The "experts" come to me and ask "What makes this damn thing tick ?" I'm supposed to know the numbers of valves and bolts and gears; on every product that been made for more than fourty years. Mind reader and magician, and handyman as well. I'm supposed to be Edison plus Alexander Bell. But life would be a pleasure and I'd smile from ear to ear, if people just would tell me the MODEl,MAKE AND YEAR!
Happy dreams...Jeff

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Jeff's Poem, re-done

04-13-2004 12:13:36

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Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to Jeff, 04-12-2004 23:35:50

OK here we go!

A PARTS MAN'S LAMENT

I work behind the counter of a parts and accessories store. Sometimes I'm called a genius, sometimes I'm called lots more. I'm just a simple parts man, but when a job goes sick. The "experts" come to me and ask "What makes this damn thing tick ?" I'm supposed to know the numbers of valves and bolts and gears; on every product that been made for more than fourty years. Mind reader and magician, and handyman as well.
I'm supposed to be Edison plus Alexander Bell.
But life would be a pleasure and I'd smile from ear to ear, if people just would tell me the MODEL, MAKE AND YEAR!

Happy dreams...Jeff

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jeff

04-13-2004 15:38:28

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Re: Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to Jeff's Poem, re-done, 04-13-2004 12:13:36

OK we have a poet that don't know it out there! I thought it would be nice to share an old bit of paper that was up on the wall of a John Deere dealer from about 1978. They sold out that summer. I had hand written it on the back of a punch card and thought it was just plain neat! By the way.. you left in the miss spell. Also it was about 4 AM and I was getting home from work. My $.02 Jeff

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EngineerJoyce

04-14-2004 06:15:03

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Re: Re: Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to jeff, 04-13-2004 15:38:28

Sorry, Jeff.

I read it, then at the end, it seemed that I had missed something, so upon re-reading it, I finally realized that it rhymed! Being the weird person that I am, I just had to break it down for my own readability pleasure - then though I would re-post like that in case somebody else was as slow as me!

The mis-spelling: I assumed it was intentional.
Very nice rhyme - you never know when you will need something you never got around to throwing away.

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jeff

04-14-2004 14:25:57

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to EngineerJoyce, 04-14-2004 06:15:03

Just bustin. The original was hand written on an old box lid nailed to the wall over the parts counter and I just put it the way they had it. If you sit and think " wow this might just be from around WW II or early 50's" then it fits in a bit better. I was born about 50 years too late! Jeff

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Wayne

04-12-2004 22:39:24

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

As a mechanic and one who will readily admit to talking bad about the "parts man" on occasion I can Honestly say I know where your coming from. There are some really knowledgable parts men and women out there, be they young or old. The ones I'm talking about are a huge service to all of us mechanics, they are a clearing house of information. They talk to the mechanics every day and hear the problems they run into. When the next guy comes in and says hey my tractor is doing such and such, they remember that "Fred" had the same problem last week and changed this or that part and solved the problem. If there is a problem in the computer they know how to read the book. If it isn't in the book they'll go out of their way to find the part for you anyway. This is the kind of parts man that makes my job alot easier. To those of you that fall into this catagory I say Thanks and keep up the good work. Now my biggest complaint. My problem is never that somebody doesn't know something. Heck, even the mfgs have problems telling you what they've done with their own product anymore. My complaint is when there is a question and the parts man/woman is too dam- lazy to either ask somebody, or otherwise try to find out the answer. Parts men may not have a school to go to but like anything else if your gonna do a job then at least take an interest in trying to learn your job. Read some of the Hot Rod magazines, Forwheeler magazines, pick up a service manual sometimes and thumb through it, or whatever. See what is done with some of the different parts you sell. Wether you work at an AutoZone, equipment dealership, or where ever,if they have a shop, take some slack time to go out in the shop and hang out. Heck take your own time if you have to, and talk to the mechanics. Yeah I said take your own time. I didn't learn to be a mechanic while getting paid, I learned by taking my own time and hanging around with Dad, the neighbors, or who ever. Anywhere I saw an occasion to learn I was there wether is was being a mechanic, plumbing, electrical, painting, whatever, it was adding to my knowledge. Go figure, if you could go to a school to be a parts man, you probably wouldn't get paid anyway, and believe me OJT is 110% better than any classroom. Basically it's about taking an interest in what the parts your selling and what they do. Know that part A might need gasket B and remind the customer of that. They might have forgotten or may not know theirself. Either way your knowledge makes you look good, makes them happy to have everything they need, and you get that extra parts sale. When I tell you I want a clutch and pressure plate don't punch in a few numbers and then stand there giving me a stupid look and ask me wether my truck has an automatic or standard transmission.....True you can stump some of the newer guys by asking for a radiator cap for an old VW Bug (air cooled, no radiator), but a clutch for an automatic, that's a stupid question from anybody that even remotely claims to know anything about parts, even on their first day..... unless they just crawled out from under their mommas skirt..... . And lastly DON'T TELL ME that the part I'm holding doesn't exist just because it isn't in your computer....I just left the machine that I removed it from and have the model and serial number, I skinned my knuckles getting the part off (and am still bleeding so I know it isn't a dream), so I'm already having a bad without you making it worse with a case of ignorance....Don't tell me my part doesn't exist... Tell me you'll find it and then make an honest effort...That's all I ask..... .. I was once told that "There are only so many types of parts, it just depends on how you put them together as to what they do." This is true no matter wether your talking autos, farm equipment, or construction equipment. None of it's hard if you think about what your doing and have even the most basic knowledge..... All that said, Old Parts Guy, you sound like your just what your name is implying, an old time parts man, and again, Thank you, from a mechanic, for all that you do..... .... For those rest of you that fall into the last catagory,I say, please get a job doing something else or at least try to learn your job like I had to learn mine. I'm more than willing to look stuff up on my own if I have to, but watch me do it so you can help the next guy, don't just shuffle off into the corner for a smoke break, or jump to the next customer just because he has something "easy". I have enough to do already without having to do your job and mine too. Just my .02+ Wayne

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Kerry

04-12-2004 20:59:13

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

Yep, been there, done that. Maybe it's because some of the "kids" don't spin wrenches as a hobby and a job like I did. When somebody told me what they needed, I had probably at least seen it before.

I wasn't really complaining, it just seems like some of the kids now don't know how to help you if it's not in the computer. When I asked them for the catalog (after asking what brands of bearings they had), they handed it to me, I found the part number, and they ordered it. They were as helpful as they could be, they just didn't know how to look it up if it wasn't in the computer.

Humm, I'm only 44, but I'm sure beginning to sound like a curmudgeon - talking about the "kids"! I'm really not griping, they just haven't been taught how to check the specs of a part and cross-reference it. Or, maybe some of the chain parts stores don't do it anymore, takes too much time, no profit, etc.

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John *.?-!.* cub owner

04-12-2004 19:44:13

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

It's been many years ago, but I worked as a counterman while I was going to college, and I understand what you are talking about. I guess i'm lucky by living in a rural area. The countermen are your neighbors, and the store owners always make sure there is at least one "old timer" there to keep them lined out. The result is "If THEY can't find it, nobody else is gonna either".

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old

04-12-2004 19:36:25

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Re: partsman's lament in reply to old partsguy, 04-12-2004 19:19:59

I don't work at a parts store but I do understand where your comeing from, but on the other hand I've also seen these new kids and some of the old guys that if they can't find it in the computer they can't or won't find it. I have even tried to get a job at a few stores and they will not hire me, because I don't know. But when I need a part I will even help that new kid find it for me, I know some of there books almost as good as they do. I know its a ruff job and I feel for you but maybe your one of the few good ones left.

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Larry in Tn

04-13-2004 06:18:25

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Re: Re: partsman's lament in reply to old, 04-12-2004 19:36:25

I must confess that almost every encounter I've had with "parts" people has been positive. I guess human nature makes us remember the bad times and never the good ones.
I spent 35 years in a sheltered work enviroment at a GM plant working as an electrician. The guy in the tool crib always got the material I needed and he was always right. I never really gave the man the credit he deserved.
After retirement I started a small business. I was not anywhere near ready for the experience of dealing with the public. My hats off to anyone that can stand behind a counter and endure some of the grief that walks thru the front door.
Actually, the parts people I deal with in this area are "class A." They all have been at it for years and most of them are family owned stores which means that each one was trained by his dad or grand dad. The local NAPA is a good example. They are expensive but I've never had to take anything back becaue they dropped the ball.
Larry

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