Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

Attention Forum Users: On the 28th of December 2023 at 9:00am Central Time, we will be taking the forums down for maintenance while we prepare the new forums for your use. Please click here for more information.

Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Leasons for the day

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
PJW

02-14-2004 07:41:39




Report to Moderator

Got a couple of questions for the discussion board. I went to lunch the other day with a farmer friend. I drove and my truck and it has a stick. As the farmer watches me drive he tells me that I shift wrong. According to him the only time you use a clutch is in first gear.

As our conversations continued we got on the subject of tractors. I have a petrol tractor and he had more advice on the subject. According to the farmer I should add brake fluid to the fuel tank to keep the carb clean.

For the last 30 years every vehicle I have owed has been a manual transmission. I have also owned my tractor for 20 years. And Since I don�t have any problems with my tractor or truck, I won�t likely take his advice. However, I don�t pretend to know it all (like my farmer friend) so thought I would run his advice past you guys and see what you thought.

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
Shane

02-16-2004 05:09:34




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
As a farmer who has many different types of trucks and trannys I can tell you that it won't hurt your tranny any to shift without clutching... if done right. And to do it in a 4 speed tranny is difficult, the gear ratio's are too far apart but it can be done and when done right nothing is under pressure and being harmed. On a "tractor" there are somewhere around 9 or more gears so the ratio is closer and easier to "speed shift" which leads to a clutch lasting much longer. Double clutching is a bad idea unless you like changing clutches.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
MarkB

02-16-2004 03:57:27




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
Prior to synchronized transmissions you really couldn't clutch while shifting. Shifting without the clutch allows you to control the engine speed so you can "feel" the gears.

With modern transmissions, shifting without the clutch puts a lot of wear and tear on the synchronizers. It's not a bad idea to practice shifting without the clutch just in case your clutch linkage fails some day, but don't do it all of the time.

If you want to minimize wear and tear on your transmission, probably the best thing to do is "double clutch": Put the clutch in, shift to neutral, then release the clutch and (if you're upshifting), let the engine slow down the transmission input shaft. The put the clutch back in, shift to the next gear and release the clutch. To downshift, you do the same except rev up the engine in neutral to speed up the input shaft. You'll notice that your shifts are much smoother because the synchros are already lined up when you go into gear.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Oldtimer

02-15-2004 19:00:43




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
All us oldtimers know how to shift without a clutch, also all the truck drivers who learned before driving school. The only reason to use a clutch in this day and age is lack of training. It is a lot cheaper to shift a standard right than to replace a clutch. I see these kids out on the road now who have came out of school and think they know everything and they put a clutch in every 6 months while some of us oldtimers have driven the same clutch for over 30 years. As far as brake fluid in gas, yes it was done years ago before the epa changed brake fluid to the junk it is today.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
fixerupper

02-15-2004 18:59:24




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
If you have been clutching successfully for 30 years, why change now? I assume your truck is a real truck with a non-sychronized tranny and not just a pickup that is called a 'truck'. There are so many different truck transmission/engine combinations out there that it's hard to say whether using the clutch for every shift is necessary or not. To shift some trannys without a clutch you have to be very accurate and then some others are very forgiving. Whether or not the driver has a good feel for it has something to do with it also. I don't use the clutch for shifting, but maybe I am more concerned about my left leg getting tired than the welfare of the tranny. As far as the brake fluid thing goes, brake fluid does clean things off but it is a bit harsh on some synthetic materials and it also attracts moisture. Depending on the quality of fuel you have available to you, and your filtration system, if you use your tractor regularly, your carb should stay reasonably clean without adding anything extra to the fuel.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Fluid drive?

02-15-2004 18:37:22




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
I am a 60 year old mechanic. If one doesn't want to use the clutch, they need an automatic transmission. No owners manual states that the clutch is not necessary after 1st gear!! Using brake fluid as a fuel additive is just asking for trouble. With most fuel additives, you have the same results as putting a drop of rubbing alcohol in a glass of water. The ratio per gallon of fuel is too low to have any effect. These companies make big bucks from people who thank it works.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Stihltech

02-15-2004 18:19:01




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
Let's see, shifting while the syncros are under a load or using the clutch to remove the load and then shift. Seems like the clutch will make the tranny synchros have a longer life.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mike in AR

02-15-2004 17:58:36




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
I knew a fella who's job was rebuilding transmissions for a major truck co. He said you could tell the ones which the driver didn't shift with the clutch (they were all Fullers), and even though their shifts were as smooth as someone who clutched, the transmissions only lasted half the time.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bus Driver

02-15-2004 16:16:28




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
I would ignore the advice of that friend.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
goofus

02-14-2004 10:32:11




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
Sounds like he was over anxious to be helpful. Probably didn't mean any harm. Could be a trade secret though about using brake fluid, mixed in gas to clean the carb. I would like to hear some other opinions about that. I have been using Stable, and Chevron's Techron. Both are kind of exspensive, and must be used before the carburetor becomes gummed up. My mother n law becomes histerical, everytime I tell her to dismantle and rebuild a carb. goof

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
John,PA

02-14-2004 08:34:55




Report to Moderator
 Re: Leasons for the day in reply to PJW, 02-14-2004 07:41:39  
Years ago, some of the elder mechanics did this as common practice. Although I have never used brake fluid, I do, from time to time, put some STP fuel treatment into my fuel tanks.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Rusty Jones/ The Mower Ma

02-14-2004 09:14:49




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Leasons for the day in reply to John,PA, 02-14-2004 08:34:55  
I think, back in the early days of "crash shift" trannys, you could shift without using the clutch! The trannys didn't have synchro-mesh innards, which they have nowadays! I believe if ya try that today, ya may break those little synchro rings inside, and you'll be back to double clutching in short order! I drove a B-60 Mack truck, tandem axle Fire Company tanker, 2500 gallons of water, to many fire calls. I could get it along pretty fair, shifting without using the clutch! (Called a"crash-box!")It had a 5-speed and a 4 speed auxiliary trans. It took some practice in getting it over the road, but i could do it fairly good! And, it saved wear and tear on my wooden left foot! And, the car i drove to the fire hall was one of those rear-engine Renault Dauphines! Talk about being able to change my outlook pretty quickly!! RJ

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Stick

02-14-2004 10:06:31




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Leasons for the day in reply to Rusty Jones/ The Mower Ma, 02-14-2004 09:14:49  
That's what synchro-mesh is for! If you know what you're doing, a modern synchro-mesh tranny can be shifted without the clutch smooth as silk and will usually outlast the engine it's bolted to. When the clutch is used, they are far more forgiving than an old transmission was. Back in the days of straight cut gears, it was tough to shift without the clutch and sometimes even with it, and double clutching was common. Nowadays few people even know what the term means, never mind know how to do it.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy