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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Welding gear

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Bernie in MA

02-11-2004 13:18:27




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I bought a press brake,cheap, with a broken gear. It's cast iron 3" thick x 20" dia. I plan to acetylene weld it using cast iron rod, preheating it to about 1200* and cooling it slowly. My questions are: should it be vee grooved or j-grooved and will it stay flat by itself or should it be clamped/bolted to a steel plate while I weld it. Thanks in advance for any help.




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T_Bone

02-12-2004 09:11:05




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 Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie in MA, 02-11-2004 13:18:27  
Hi Bernie,

I would use a 60� center groove joint from both sides if the cast is broken all the way thru with a 3/16" root opening with a 1/8" land, then tack weld two pieces of 3" x 3" x 3/8" angle on both sides with two pieces of angle per side that attachs to a pivot mount so it can be turned over easy on a 5� pitch from one end of the pivot to the other end. This will be a much easier position to weld in and like George, I think It's best not to stop welding until your done. The angle will keep the joint aligned before welding. This wheel weighs about 267lbs so the pivot jig will make it easy to handle and turn while welding.

I would then preheat too 900� to 1200� as the crtical tempertaure is 1450�, then tack weld several places on both sides, then start welding in the center working yourself to the outside diameter while staggering welds on both sides, then as you get the root pass completed on both sides I would weaken the tack welds from the center outward, then continue with the second pass.

If all looks well then I would cut the tacks on the angle so that shrinkage can occur as your welding but yet still be used as a pivot mount. Too late cutting the tack welds will shurley cause the wheel to stress crack, too soon and the welds will break from too much weight. As you can see this is not a one man orperation and your ducks best be in a row. I believe it's 1" per 12hrs cooling rate ( My mind is not that clear this morning) George has an excellant idea with the fire brick for a temporary oven.

T_Bone

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markct

02-11-2004 18:53:55




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 Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie in MA, 02-11-2004 13:18:27  
so ya bought the press brake bernie, i remember ya asking about it a few months back. i was at an auction in rockland mass a few weeks ago, had some nice 14ft amada press brakes, went for around a 100 grand, all sortsa fancy stuff, and they also had a few old mechanical press brakes, they went for alot less but still alot for the condition they were in, 4 grand for a 40 ton chicago press brake. good luck fixing up your brake, they sure are handy, if i didnt have access to a few of them at work i would want one of my own too!

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Bernie

02-12-2004 06:05:09




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 Re: Re: Welding gear in reply to markct, 02-11-2004 18:53:55  
I bought it at a big auction in CT last fall, paid $600 for it. With the CT sales tax, auction fee, and trucking 100 miles to my place I have just under $1000 in it. Saved enough money so I could buy a used 1-ton truck I needed :-). It's a 45 ton x 6', Wisconsin Forcemaster. Anybody ever heard of or know anything about them?



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markct

02-13-2004 09:45:19




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 Re: Re: Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie, 02-12-2004 06:05:09  
never heard of the name, but sounds like a good deal, did it come with any tooling, that can get expensive too, and unless your doing precision stuff dont buy european tooling, stick with american tooling, with a mechanical pressbrake you dont need the acuracy of european tooling anyhow



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Pat(MA)

02-11-2004 16:53:14




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 Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie in MA, 02-11-2004 13:18:27  
IMHO, V groove both sides but only with an arc gouging rod. If you grind with an aluminum oxide disc you will drive AL into the cast.



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george md

02-11-2004 18:05:00




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 Re: Re: Welding gear in reply to Pat(MA), 02-11-2004 16:53:14  
Pat , he said he is going to acet cast iron weld it , keep the arc away so not to mix a steel in the cast . george



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dice

02-11-2004 16:45:29




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 Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie in MA, 02-11-2004 13:18:27  
Clamp metal, V groove, preheat, min 700deg, keep hot, check with temp stick don't guese, weld with nickle rod with buzz box set on dc+.



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Bill 52 8n

02-11-2004 15:47:22




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 Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie in MA, 02-11-2004 13:18:27  
How big of a piece are you welding back in? I would groove it on both sides if possible. If you weld it only on one side, the residual stress will warp it even with a clamp. If you weld on both sides and postheat it the whole gear and let it cool it should stay pretty straight.

Bill



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Bernie

02-11-2004 15:55:26




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 Re: Re: Welding gear in reply to Bill 52 8n, 02-11-2004 15:47:22  
It broke in half, almost exactly in the middle. I thought I would clamp/bolt it to a piece of 3/4" plate, heat it, weld one side, cover it with kitty litter, and let it cool for a couple days. Then turn it over, reclamp it and weld the other side. My friend says it doesn't need to be clamped down. I don't agree; that's why I'm here.



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george md

02-11-2004 19:36:23




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 Re: Re: Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie, 02-11-2004 15:55:26  
Bernie,

Grind a large vee in both sides almost
to the center but leave enough to locate position.
Not much use of clamping it down as you will need
to turn from side to side while welding . You will need a bed and walls of fire brick to form an oven
and some to close in the top while preheating ,
postheating and while cooling . An asbestos blanket
is very useful while cooling to cover the brick to
slow the cooling , should take about 12 hours to cool to touch . Use a propane fired torch like a weed burner to
preheat and keep it hot while welding , and to do
a very warm post heat when done .

When you start that job , do not stop for any
reason , finish it while it is hot !!

here are some pictures of jobs to look at

www.georgemillermachine.com follow the link to the sequence george

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old

02-11-2004 13:25:24




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 Re: Welding gear in reply to Bernie in MA, 02-11-2004 13:18:27  
I'd grind a V in it and also clamp it down



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