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Adjusting MIG for sheet metal

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Leon

08-14-2000 12:45:00




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I have been using my MIG welder for about 6 months now, and am fairly used to it.

However, I always have trouble getting things set right when I have to work with thin sheet metal, especially if it is rusty. I use the chart on the welder as a guideline, but sometimes I can't get their settinsg to work well.

It seems like I either burn through the stock, or I don't get reasonable penetration. It is hard to find a good current/wire feed setting, and hard to find a voltage setting to match.

I have a MillerMatic 250, which has wire speed (current) and voltage settings.

My thinking is this- tell me if I am wrong. I assume you should set the wire speed so that you get the right penetration without burn through. Then adjust the voltage so that it makes a nice "sputter" sound. To low voltage will give very slow pops, and too high voltage gives continuous arc that tends to use up the wire too fast.

Tell me- when adjusting, do you keep a hand on the voltage knob while drawing an arc to find the best setting?

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tyler

05-29-2004 17:28:42




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 Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to Leon, 08-14-2000 12:45:00  
i turned the voltage knob while welding now i have to get a new welder. also started a nice size fire.



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Steve U.S. Alloys

08-14-2000 13:33:11




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 Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to Leon, 08-14-2000 12:45:00  
Hi Leon,
Set your voltage at the 10:00 o'clock position and then adjust the wire speed to the desired amperage. You can go by sound when adjusting the wire speed.

Keep in mind that the voltage is effected by arc length in addition to the setting you control on the panel. The longer the arc, the higher the voltage. The higher the voltage the more spatter and the less penetration. You really can't get to the manufacturers spec on voltage w/o a voltmeter option.

MIG machines penetrate when pushed. This is the opposite of the stick machine.

I assumed you were using a gas shielded wire. That isn't going to weld dirty. You need to remove the rust from the parent material. Rust is also a source of hydrogen which can lead to hydrogen induced cracking and it is also a source of oxidation which is also detrimental to sound weld quality. The rust may also effect your ground which will make the wire speed erratic.
Steve

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rodney johnson

08-14-2000 20:59:57




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 Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to Steve U.S. Alloys, 08-14-2000 13:33:11  
ray insists not to push with mig but to drag slight angle off fron 90 degrees to the work peice, some of the gas suppliers say to push forward 60 degrees so that the gas is ahead of the weld, ray insists that this will cause the heat to roll foward ahead of the puddle impurities and low peneration to follow and poor cyrstalization of root weld, he demenstrates this in bending the material or welding one stich weld and breaking it off, i find as well near 90 degrees gives a nice clean weld. the lincoln 225 at work run good at 20 to 21 volts and 270 to 275 wire speed, also your travel speed has a lot to do with a clean looking weld and yes by listen to your machine you will come to know what it wants, heard the noise expressed as a egg frying? lol ray said the poping noise is too much wire heat (fuel for the fire)or too slow of travel you get to experiment when using a rotator nothing better when mig is tweeked to the work!!!

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rodney johnson

08-14-2000 21:15:28




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 Re: Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to rodney johnson, 08-14-2000 20:59:57  
oooohhhh crap!! forgot to tell you to stay in the corner when welding! our shop just got our cwb certified and we mill and bend our own pieces and you see when your not in the cornor, bending never lies, come out from that corner and you have poor peneration every time, ray says every day "stay in the corner" LOL



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Leon

08-15-2000 06:49:09




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to rodney johnson, 08-14-2000 21:15:28  
What do you mean, the corner? I don't follow what you mean by "stay in the corner".

Also- just a technique question- do you typically start an arc and then turn knobs with one hand while welding with the other? Or do you adjust, weld, adjust, weld...



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rodney johnson

08-15-2000 17:29:23




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to Leon, 08-15-2000 06:49:09  
just that in the cornor where the two pieces meet in any joint it applies to all welded connections... heavy piece to a thinner piece your going to use heavy piece to distrubute the heat to the smaller one. the flow of materials still must reach the cornor of the welded materials in order to get peneration, most cases it not actually the cornor, but you must get wire evenly that the shape of the weld follows a desirable formation, me and the other guy under rays supervision thought we were in the cornor, untill we had our pieces bent, there you can see a slight hairline, also applies to start and stops in a weld can also be seen, in the eyes of cwb of being certified its a failure, now the guy who welded sheet metal on his tractor fender may not give a dam, but will if he has paid for it, rays relentless stay in the cornor has paid off, it seems to matter once ya get one bent, ray has pointed out that once or twice on some tractors & dumps running down the road with some heafty cracks running out from a weld, so its really up to you how much importance you place on your welds and your techinque, from the business point of veiw and the trend of quality, quantity, qutotation of price and time, these iso standards closing the gap of who will be in the business and those who won;t we have had customers that supply to manufactors if they do not comply, they will be out in the cold. by my boss going to this standard i can be sure i will be employed, from the position of the loan officer its a bit of security in his favor, now the guy with the tractor with cracked welds may get hung up a the weigh scales untill a mobile welder comes his way to fix your work or repair, a happy customer tells 3 people unhappy customer tells everyone who listens, now with the internet they can!!

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Steve U.S. Alloys

08-15-2000 12:37:09




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to Leon, 08-15-2000 06:49:09  
Hi Leon,
I thought I had better add something because I don't want to be too confusing in regard to the polarity adjustment on your machine. You may have one that uses the shims to set the voltage to match the machine to it's environment. If you see reference made to voltage on the shim chart, then you will need to manually change the polarity by taking the cable lugs loose inside the machine just in front of the spool and located on the floor plate. For gas shielded hard wire,you need to be on DC reverse which makes the electrode positive. You can see which lead goes to the spool and which lead goes to the ground clamp. If you just can't get things worked out,I don't mind spending the money to call you if that would help you out.
steve

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rodney johnson

08-16-2000 19:45:46




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to Steve U.S. Alloys, 08-15-2000 12:37:09  
your good guy steve, had our stick machine apart for a cleaning was running rough had a fried wire the ground wire touched the body of the machine awhile ago, was looking at the wiring schamic there it listed how to set the high and low voltage, was wondering if you have a listing for stainless steel flux wire, my boss has sorced it and can only get 100 lb spool wonder if you know any suppliers that have smaller spools and of coarse cheap lol hey if you have a web site that we can view see what your up too! have a good one

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Steve U.S. Alloys

08-17-2000 05:57:53




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to rodney johnson, 08-16-2000 19:45:46  
Hi Rodney,
Thank you for the kind words. I sent you an e-mail.
Steve



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Steve U.S. Alloys

08-15-2000 10:47:35




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: adjusting MIG for sheet metal in reply to Leon, 08-15-2000 06:49:09  
Hi Leon,
You can adjust those potentiometer type dials on your MM250 while welding. Most people just try it though and then re-adjust.

The thing you don't want to adjust while energized is the type that clicks from one setting to the next like the Lincoln 225S for SMAW or the old Miller 35 wire welders. It burns the contact points.

You might want to check your polarity. The person that had the machine before may have been running open arc wire. You'll find the polarity shims under the side door just above the inlet guide where the wire goes thru. There should be a chart that shows you how to position them.

If you mainly have trouble when the arc starts like burn back, you may need to have the trimmer pot adjusted. That lets the motor start a bit slower as you strike the arc and lets the speed come up afterwards. I've had trouble with those before on brand new machines right out of the box.
HTH,
Steve

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