Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo Auction Link (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

Discussion Forum

Weak gas weld question

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
Bob - KS

04-29-2002 14:32:40




Report to Moderator

I've been trying to learn to gas weld and with the help of the articles here and searching the forums I've begun to get a clue. One question I haven't found a definate answer to - the welds I'm creating are typically weak as if the metal has turned to carbon sort of (looks more like flux than metal). When I'm using the torch, the metals puddle, and run together usually without need for extra rod, but tap it with a hammer and the welds break apart. What I've read here seems to imply that I'm using too much oxygen and turning the metal to carbon but before I try again I wanted to check with those of you who do this sort of thing to see if I understood what I'm reading. If it matters, it's a Victor torch set with gas at 5 and oxy at about 10, and a #2 tip. This has happened on several thicknesses of metal - usually all rusty stuff salvaged from the scrap pile. I'm a clueless newbie so any suggestions are more than welcome. I wish I had a juco near me - but I live in the sticks.

thanks in advance for your help,
Bob

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
mohammad

02-24-2004 00:46:18




Report to Moderator
 Re: weak gas weld question in reply to Bob - KS, 04-29-2002 14:32:40  
coper welding



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bob - KS

05-01-2002 08:28:31




Report to Moderator
 Re: weak gas weld question in reply to Bob - KS, 04-29-2002 14:32:40  
Just wanted to say a big thank you for the help. I actually made my first gas weld last night. Doesn't look like much but it hangs together. After thinking about what you all had said I realized more is not especially better when applying heat in this case. It appears my biggest problems were that I'd have weld puddles in about 15-20 seconds and when they ran together I'd stay on them for another minute or so to make sure they were nice and smooth and 'pretty' (and very concave...). Sure did make a good sparkler effect too! Add in a good healthy dose of rust (which apparently doesn't make a good flux ;) ) and it's no wonder I had such a mess.

Again I just wanted to say thank you to each of you for your help and time. I know it has to get old answering the same questions over and over but sometimes if it's said a little differently the light bulb finally comes on.

Best to all,
Bob

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
T_Bone

05-01-2002 10:38:00




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: weak gas weld question in reply to Bob - KS, 05-01-2002 08:28:31  
Hi Bob,

Well I've been on this forum for about 2yrs and don't remember any question close to this one. :)

It never gets old answering questions. Had alot of very talented people not answered mine then I wouldn't be able to help here!

T_Bone



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
slughammer

04-30-2002 09:15:55




Report to Moderator
 Re: weak gas weld question in reply to Bob - KS, 04-29-2002 14:32:40  
Bob, gas welding without the use of a filler rod requires several criteria to be met. These would be joint type and gap size, cleanliness, and flame/torch size vs metal size. Right now it sounds as if you are making a slag puddle. Filler rod not only allows you to add metal to a joint, it also helps flow the slag out of the joint (this is very important, and that helps the base metals mix. Unless you are doing something pretty or delicate with exactly the right joint type, use a filler rod. There will be a time and place that you will make a weld without a filler rod; but for me, those times are few and far between. Good Luck and do everything that T-Bone said. - Slughammer

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Dan

04-30-2002 04:32:47




Report to Moderator
 Re: weak gas weld question in reply to Bob - KS, 04-29-2002 14:32:40  
Bob
You are oxidizing the heck out of your base metal. 10 psi of Oxygen is incredibly to high. Your pressures should be equal. Meaning if your using 5 psi of acetylene then use 5 psi of oxygen. Actually unless your welding on thick material 5 psi is to high. Here is an example of setting that I might use with 1/16" material. Number one tip and 3 psi oxygen and 3 psi of acetylene. Also, remove the rust from your material this is iron oxide which adds more oxygen to your weld puddle

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
T_Bone

04-29-2002 18:41:25




Report to Moderator
 Re: weak gas weld question in reply to Bob - KS, 04-29-2002 14:32:40  
Hi Bob,

For now I'll assume you have your torch adjusted for a neutral flame. If not heres your first problem.

What is probably happening is your overheating your base metals. It should take about 1 mintute to form a weld puddle.

Another problem is your base metal is too dirty. If your not using a flux then the base metal has to be clean, grind or sand to remove scale/rust/dirt/etc.
Depending on how dirty even flux will have a problem without precleaning.

You also need to preclean your filler rod. Emery paper works well.

When you add filler rod don't move the rod to far out of the outer flame cone area when not in use as it will oxidize. This will cause prosisity within the weld puddle.

If your weld puddle face looks concave when completed then your not adding enough filler rod. Add enough filler rod for a convex weld puddle face but no more than 1/16" convex above the base metal.

See if this helps and if not post back again and we'll continue.
T_Bone

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
bbott

04-29-2002 17:47:42




Report to Moderator
 Re: weak gas weld question in reply to Bob - KS, 04-29-2002 14:32:40  
You just don't set the gauges pressures and go.

You have to look at the flame at the torch tip and adjust the torch valves for a neutral flame. A book with good illustrations, a video, or an instructor are what you really need.

But, here goes...

In a very short and likely flawed description, there's an oxygen cone inside the torch flame (a brighter and paler blue). When you bring the blue oxygen flame part into a nice 'clean' cone shape you have a neutral flame. If your blue cone are extended and feathering out, too much O2, yellow flame, indistinct cone, or smoke, too much fuel.

here's a link to a company selling videos.. it has a few online pictures.

Link

If you go www.google.com and search on 'adjusting torch for neutral flame' you'll get lots of links and articles.

HTH

bbott

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy