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Tractor Pulling Discussion Forum

Stock Tractor Pulling

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WTW

08-27-2007 10:16:25




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With all the whining and complaining the last few weeks on this page about who is stock and who is legal who is cheating and how to keep tractors in the class that they belong got me to thinking how to settle this issue. Here is my solution / answer to this controversy. First establish the so called stock rules. Second have a protest claim program like the car racing folks do only this time do it on the whole complete pulling tractor. If you have a stock pulling tractor that meets the established rules you would have nothing to loose but much to gain if you for sure knew your competition was cheating. The protestor could protest anyone in his class that he thought was cheating, the protested tractor would be tore down (worse case scenario remove the cylinder head) to measure allowed bore and stroke. If tractor in question was in spec the protestor would give his tractor to the protested to cover his unnecessary teardown expense. If the tractor was found illegal (outside the limits of the stock rules) the protestor gets the other guys tractor. This would put a stop to the modified tractor in the stock class and it defiantly would put a stop to the whining. I would not be afraid to put my stock tractors in a class with this type of claim rule but you can bet you�re a$$ I wouldn't put modified tractors in it. The rules could be set at what ever limit the majority wants and if your tractor was with in them why not go for it. MHO

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rich4

08-29-2007 12:25:37




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 10:16:25  
I have not done tractor pulling, but I have done amatuer car racing under a rule book. We have allways had a tech inspection before the race and in the big events the top 3 cars got scrutinized after the race. Otherwise practically any competitor could raise the legality of another competitor at any time. We never had a serious problem with people bending the rules. If you have a rule book and no-one enforces it, then likely there will be cheating. Important things like hitch height, weight needs to be checked by class rules every time. Bore and Stroke are harder to detect, but can be surmised. My racing was not for money but if the pulls are for money then maybe an option to check the bore and stroke is in order. My 2 cents.

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mlpankey

08-28-2007 13:48:04




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 10:16:25  
do away with the stock pulling classes only run antique . theyll spend the money to pull antique or quit either way theyll still cry about something.



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No Chance

08-28-2007 07:22:29




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 10:16:25  
How about this, the person doing the drivers meeting before the pull and being very adament that this is a stock pull. And this same person having over 400 cubic inches in a tractor that stock was 270. I guess it is who you are and where you are.



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Jack a

08-28-2007 05:44:41




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 10:16:25  
I would want that rule but when you use words like whining well you're putting a negative spin on things. I follow the rules and expect everyone else to do the same not twist words like stock to mean something other than stock. If the rules state it then that's it. If you want the rules changed to read something else then lobby your club to do so and quit your whining.



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WTW

08-28-2007 07:05:51




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to Jack a, 08-28-2007 05:44:41  
Jack, No offense intended on my choice of words. I guess after being president, board member, director and tech official I have heard so much that whining was one of the words that just came to mind and wasn't met to offend you or anyone else, just a word of poor choice. Sorry. It is not near as bad or offensive as others I hear. I try not to get in the argument of defining what stock is, rather enforce the rules under what the club members have voted on and defined as stock. The rules could be just as strict or lenient at different associations and still be listed under stock. What I do is read the rules before I attend any event and if they do not suit me I stay home or find some other association to pull with. Usually we find another to go to. I have pulled tractors in 13 different states and one thing for sure, rules are from one extreme to another especially stock rules and I can say I don't entirely agree with any of them but can pull with most of them. DW

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Jack a

08-28-2007 09:56:26




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-28-2007 07:05:51  
Got it. Most pulling rules do not just say stock but go on to define what stock means by these certain rules. My beef is with those who get by by saying "my grandpa used it just like it sets". Whether or not it is true doesn't matter. The rules for some pulls says no modifications. That's that to me.



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Mopower

08-27-2007 13:25:17




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 10:16:25  
Once again, I like the way you think WTW. Not bad for a Deere guy. (Only kidding.) Those rules would make even the hard core stock guys be a bit more careful.



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WTW

08-27-2007 15:00:45




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to Mopower, 08-27-2007 13:25:17  
Thanks, I will take that as a compliment! You got my point, if they meet the rules they should not have any concern about participating under them. Your right, if the rules make them nervous there is a reason!



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Amos M.

08-28-2007 08:32:07




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 15:00:45  
Home for about 12 hrs. with the big truck & back to the Bluegrass again. Saw this post, figured I'd add to the debate, or lack of...Can't sleep anyway cause the furnace guys are making a bunch of racket in the basement installing the new one...

They have the protest pot thing up here in Michigan's thumb. It's 300 bucks that the protester has to put up. Not sure if that's a good number. That amount might scare some folks away from protesting someone, unless it's a no-brainer.

I'm a big fan of the speed rules. Especially the way the NATPA does it - 1 horn in the first 50 or 100 ft., and after that the next horn gets you DQ'd. Some of them ugly red ones (sorry...) and them yellow one's and so on have a pretty stiff 1st gear, so I guess a 2.5 to 3.0 mph limit would work, and no "1st gear only" junk. Far too many old tractors have a real slow 1st, including my real pretty red Cockshutt. But you need a sled with an AUTOMATIC horn system, none of this "push the horn button when you feel like it" garbage. I've seen that happen before. And forget a dyno rule - I've seen alot of strange things happen...

OK, about tires & wheels - this should get the hornets buzzing. What about wheels - some came with cast/pressed options, and some only offered cast. Let's say you set a limit at 15.5...then you might have the orchard/wheatland pullers hollering. Now the real issue that will get the hornet exterminatin' Orkin man to drinkin' - what's a none-altered, uncut tire? Here's my thoughts without getting too long-winded. If you have a no-cut rule, and the tractor pulls away from the sled and the footprint of the tire doesn't make full even footprint (or close to it...), toss him out. My 16.9's are top-cut, and it's real noticeable with the footprint it makes on a pulling track, or even my driveway. Forget arguing a sharp front edge...it won't stay sharp for long. It's the backward sloping of the lug that gets the bite from the pressure on the front half or so of the lug.

OK, the cubic inch thing...How much tolerance are you willing to give? It would be awful rare to find a 50 yr old tractor that ain't been overhauled at least once. Most were overbored with factory kits, M&W and so on. So how much will you allow? Mill the head and increase the horses. How much can you mill it, or can you even tell it's been milled? So you got the compression ratio at 10 to 1 or better. OK, racing gas to the rescue. But it's colored and smells different, that'll get you tossed. Home grown fuel to the rescue or E85 (I believe it has a 105 rating...). OK, we'll fix his wagon and check the specific gravity...

The Orkin man is now drunk...no way he wants to kill those hornets, there's too many of 'em and they're really mad...

By the way, Dave, this is Andrew's old man. Still says you're #1 in his book of who's who...

You all keep the shiny side up...

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buickanddeere

08-28-2007 16:20:47




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to Amos M., 08-28-2007 08:32:07  
I agree Amos. Those are the only methods to give the true stockers a chance.



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Greg_Ky

08-27-2007 13:21:47




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 10:16:25  
Just get a "Whistler" to measure compression ratio and a "P&G Meter" to measure cubic inches.



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jd b puller

08-27-2007 15:05:29




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to Greg_Ky, 08-27-2007 13:21:47  
Greg, where do you get those magic devices and how much do they cost. I thought I looked into the displacement measure thingamabob a year ago and it was over a grand.



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Greg_Ky

08-27-2007 22:44:40




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to jd b puller, 08-27-2007 15:05:29  
The most expensive is the "Whistler" I will check into the P&G Meter. The link below is for the "Whistler"



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No tools

08-27-2007 12:51:57




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 Re: Stock Tractor Pulling in reply to WTW, 08-27-2007 10:16:25  
No the only true way to stop the cheating is to right the rule book and stand beside it.Like this we will have two class tractor modified & stock.

Now first of all we pull the modified class first we record the tractor serial number.

No#2 the stock tractor pull class now sign up we note the serial number of tractor If a lying tractor comes through he history Because he done prove he was'nt stock.

That ought to do it.

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