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Tractor Pulling Discussion Forum

New NATPA class

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Puller

01-23-2004 18:22:15

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Heard after Whichita pull NATPA is thinking about a new weight class. A 3000 lb Div. 3 and 4. Sounds like 3250 Div. 3 and 4 has alot of people mad about what size tractors should be pulling in these classes. I was just wondering can a Super C IHC run the combine motor in Div 3 and 4 now.

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M.A.F.

01-24-2004 18:11:50

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Re: New NATPA class in reply to Puller, 01-23-2004 18:22:15

The 3250 lb. class was intended for the smaller tractors,including the Allis B's,C's, Farmall A's,BN's,C's,12's,14's, John Deere B's,H's, and simular low R.P.M., small C.I.D 1 plow tractors. The problem with the Fords is that they run so many R.P.M.'s, and everyone knows that with high R's comes higher H.P. The Molines start out with 165 C.I.D., and they also run more R.P.M.'s than a WC Allis. The E-3 Co-Op's have 153 C.I.D, and they too run many more R.P.M.'s than the W.C.'s. More important than all that, all of these larger tractors are listed as 2 plow tractors. They don't belong in 3250 anymore than a M or 88 belongs in 3500 or 4000. Also, if a 3000 class is formed, many of heavier legitamite 3250 tractors won't be light enough to pull in it anyway. We just have to trust in our N.A.T.P.A board members (TRUSTEES) to resolve this issue A.S.A.P. If these larger tractors insist on pulling this light, than we should create a 3250 div. 5 for them to play in.

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slow mo57

01-25-2004 05:43:03

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Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to M.A.F., 01-24-2004 18:11:50

My falt miss read H part I thought it was a farmall H.You are right on that part.But moline made smaller tractor that pull B.F.avery--moline.

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slow mo57

01-25-2004 05:15:17

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Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to M.A.F., 01-24-2004 18:11:50

Look again at H*s rpm and CID. It is more rpm than 335 CID is close.As for the ford it may show at 134CID 30hp but you do not have any lug power.The engine has no CI to keep the sled going when it starts to pull hard.

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farmall

01-25-2004 05:12:07

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Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to M.A.F., 01-24-2004 18:11:50

Well said!

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Shutt30

01-24-2004 20:23:01

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Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to M.A.F., 01-24-2004 18:11:50

Rpms are nothing compared to the cubes that are in the wc's. They let them run wd 45 and d-17 engines as upgrades. Then they throw in a 6.0 crank. Unless you own your own machine shop or a bank you can't compete with that kind of cubes. Look at the one E-3 Co-op that did any good in the 3250 lbs class, one year of doing good and they are kicked out. They did not dominate this class, just very consistant. I called and talked to a NATPA director and he said that the 3250 class was made basicly for the B JD's so they would not have to pull against the WC's. lol

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01-24-2004 13:03:22

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Re: New NATPA class in reply to Puller, 01-23-2004 18:22:15

I would just like to know how many 300 cid AC pull in div II. If the speed is set at 3.0 mhp what is the differince in the light class?

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Puller

01-24-2004 17:40:27

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Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to JC, 01-24-2004 13:03:22

I posted on here last night about Div 3 and 4 not about Div. 2. Has anyone heard anything about the 3000 lb class Div. 3 and 4. I heard this a week after Wichita Kans. pull and have not heard anything sence then. As for Div. 2 its about as fair as it can be. Tire size drawbar height and stock external parts are about as far as you can go.

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slow mo57

01-24-2004 17:11:18

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Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to JC, 01-24-2004 13:03:22

Ac have a edge 40+ hp stock on good tracks because they can maintain 3mph and others start to lug and fall off pace.I just feel it would not hurt to put a few class lighter for smaller tractors in div2.The 3000 class has good #s with small tractors in are area.

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John B.

01-23-2004 21:54:57

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Re: New NATPA class in reply to Puller, 01-23-2004 18:22:15

Why is the div. 2 always left out. How about a 3000# div. 2 class. All the big tractors want to move down & squeeze the smaller tractors. Why the almost 1000# jump from 2550# to the 3500# class? Most places have a 3250# class for div. 3 & IV but not div. 2. Theres a lot of tractors that are over 2550# but can't compete with the Wc's & Wd's. A Ford Jubalie or 600 has to give up 100 cubes to the alis's & that's before they even do any motor work. With a little motor work their giving up over 200 cubes. Why not give it a try?

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Green Weenie

01-23-2004 19:19:40

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Re: New NATPA class in reply to Puller, 01-23-2004 18:22:15

I really don*t know. They are allowing the 335 Molines in the class and there lies the rub. The Molines run over 30 horse stock, I imagine if the combine motors run in the same H.P. range that it would be hard to keep you out of the class.

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slowmo57

01-24-2004 06:24:53

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Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Green Weenie, 01-23-2004 19:19:40

335MM engine is only a small CI engine.the msssy 33 is only 201 CI and not a loud to pull below 4000 class.But wd45 runs 226CI & 40+ hp in 3500 DIV2 where are your small tractors going to pull when big AC pulling in 3500.Most wd45 are alot for even some bigger tractors to handle.I think wd pull in 4000 up just like the rest of tractors 200CI or 40HP stock wd45 is closer to farmall m in HP & ci than other tractors in its class.The wd45 shipping weight put it 3500 but the little MM ,JD,AC,FARMALL,FORD all need a home to.div 2 &3-4.

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A PULLER

01-24-2004 10:27:07

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Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to slowmo57, 01-24-2004 06:24:53

335 is a small cubed engine till you bolt in an irrigation motor and all the other things MM has to make more power, then its not a small cubed motor anymore.

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slow mo57

01-24-2004 17:21:49

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Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to A PULLER, 01-24-2004 10:27:07

If it has the wrong engine than stop it.But so do alot of other makes of tractors and they need stopped to.That does not just mean combine engines.That mean all wrong engines.All makes have twin parts for them.

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Jeff

01-24-2004 07:27:49

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Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to slowmo57, 01-24-2004 06:24:53

Since Div 2 is for mostly stock tractors what difference does the cubic inches make? I have an Oliver8 that is stock 231 cubic inches and have beaten JD A's with over 300 cubic inches stock, Farmalls SuperM's with 260+ CI, and several others with bigger motors. Untill you get up into 3rd or 4th gear thee is alot more to winning than cubic inches. Tire size and balance are real critical. I have pulled against really strong JD G's in the 6500 class and have been beat and have beaten them. As long as they have a speed limit and tire size restrictions I've got as good a chance and anyone else.

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slow mo57

01-24-2004 17:54:10

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Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Jeff, 01-24-2004 07:27:49

If you do that good how much harder would it be to beat you if you had more power sence you no how to set up your tractor and are a good driver.

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John B.

01-24-2004 09:15:06

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Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Jeff, 01-24-2004 07:27:49

Your 88 @ 231 compared to a 300 jd is only 70 ci. Your 88 compared to a 260 m is only 30 ci. We're talking about a 134 ci. ford compared to a 300ci Alis. Do the math. Would you like to pull against a bunch of 500ci M's all the time? Everyone knows that a little over bore & a 45 crank in a wc will be at or over 300ci. Even stock we're talking almost double the size of motor of a wc compared to a Jubilee.Then your going to say why not just pull a Alis. I say just look at the 3500# class and you'll see why. To much of any color tractor in each class makes for a long day. All I'm asking for is a fairly level playing field where we can compare like sized tractors against like sized tractors.

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Jeff

01-24-2004 21:44:11

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to John B., 01-24-2004 09:15:06

I am pulling a bone stock 88 against some tractor that are turning upwards of 75-80 hp also. I have been beat and have beaten them. Speed limits and gear limits are a great equalizer as alot of the high RPM and high Ci engines are made for faster speeds. If you have more power than you can hook to the ground it is wasted. One guy we pull with has a WD with a combine motor in it. He will spin out before he lugs out because of it.

As for being easy to beat me, it's not really that hard. I don't brag on here or stuff like that and I have only been pulling for about 3 yrs but I know what I have seen.

It's not right to put a tractor with a 100 CI advantage in a class with smaller ones but they can be beat. I think one person said that they need to keep the original engines or at least engine sizes in them and I agree with that also. This particular fella with the combine motor said he was going to pull in the open classes only cause he wasn't farm stock anymore. well guess what? Didn't do it. HOwever when he gets it wighted up to pull in the 5000 with me I'll still pull against him and not gripe too much cause the rules are really grey in that area.

Now to plug our local pull. We are having a antuque tractor pull May 1st in Dresden Tn beside the Chevrolet place. Track farmer sled will be used and Southern Il rules apply. Will be having the 6250 King of the Hill class with the winner taking home $500. Ya'll come on donw and pull with us!! You'll have fun if nothing else !

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Older Puller

01-24-2004 22:23:01

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Jeff, 01-24-2004 21:44:11

Jeff, how well do you do in the 7000# or 8500# class? Are you able to out drive the higher hp. tractors in the heavier classes also? You should be if what you say is true. If they have the same drawbar height, weigh the same and with similar tires, and also run with a 3 mph. speed limit. Try it sometime then post back and let me know how it turned out. My guess is you will find out why there are different weight classes.

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Jeff

01-25-2004 14:20:30

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Older Puller, 01-24-2004 22:23:01

Well I would be happy to try it but I only have enough weights to hang on mine to go up to about 6500. I think the issue in this conversatin is not the smaller tractors weighing UP to the heavy classes but the bigger ones going down. One day I will probably borrow enough weight to go up some and when I do I'll post and let ya know how it goes.

In these lighter classes, are any of the smaller cubic inch engines bogging out?So far mine has just spun out but haven't lost power yet.Any tractor can get in too high of a weight class that i won't argue.

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John B.

01-25-2004 18:05:03

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Jeff, 01-25-2004 14:20:30

You hit the nail on the head Jeff. In order to compete you have the have enough power to get to where the high Hp. tractors are spinning out. If their going say 150 Ft. & spinning out hard & you motor out at 110Ft. you can have all the driving skills in the world but you have no chance of winning. Now if their spinning out hard at 100 & your almost motoring out at the same distance you still have a chance of winning.

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ChadS

01-24-2004 09:44:50

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to John B., 01-24-2004 09:15:06

In my opinion,, it is difficult to decide what make and models of tractors can pull in a certain weight class. Me,, I say vote for unity!! Thr rules are there in black and white, Just follow them and don't try to stretch them, The only way to police hot rod tractors, in the stock classes is a speed limit,rpms limit and gear limit. I could care less if I am pulling against a 500 cu in M, or 88 oliver, in a div 2 or 3 class, as long as they follow the rules like every one else, keep it under the speed limit, and what have you,, it is just as fair. I see everyone scared of running against big cubed tractors, Well not scared, but concerned, Gentleman,, that is a distraction, The big cubes are concerned with how their tractors react, and respond to modifications. The stockers, should be focusing on the same thing, How to properly set up their pullers. I use the term tractors lightly, I use the puller term because that is what they are redesigned to do. As far as what make and models to allow in the classes, I think that is predjudice. If that was the case and everyone decides on what makes and models are allowed to pull, they should have thier own class, an oliver class, a JD class, a IH class, a Ford class etc,, but no,, that is not how it is done!! it is done by weight. Lets look at the big picture here, if you have a tractor, that can maintain the speed limit, meet the tire specs, hitch specs and safety specs,, then you have just as much chance to win as say the big cube tractors. Pay attention to your tractors, and how they react,, it is not a contest of color in my eyes,, it is a distance pull, or a percentage pull, or what ever!! If the Allis is so much better than the Ford jubilee,, lets compare a 152 ci, Farmall H to a jubilee. Not much cu in difference there,,, If someone is serious about pulling competively,, the big engine is nice,, but that is their option, there is no such thing as stock tractors!! I guess the bottom line here in mu opinion, is don't worry about what the others are doing,, worry about what you need to do to your tractor to make it pull in the class you set it up for. color, makes and models is irrelivant,, it is weight, balance driver skill, and if you want to throw HP in there, so be it,, but All the HP in the world does nothing if you don't know how to utilize it. Just my opinion Chad

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In a nut shell

01-25-2004 23:04:35

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to ChadS, 01-24-2004 09:44:50

Chad, I don't think anyone needs to be thrown out. Not asking for that. The plain and simple of it is We're just looking for less weight difference between the first two classes in div. II. 2750,3000,3250, pick any one and I'de be happy. When this thread was started it was ment not make less hooks for anyone or limit their classes avalable, but to give the smaller tractors over 2500# a reasonable chance of placing well in a class. Whats the down side of another class or two?

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ChadS

01-25-2004 23:44:02

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to In a nut shell, 01-25-2004 23:04:35

I would not like to see anyone not be allowed to hook, and compete.. There needs to be more classes in there for the small tractors, Our club almost lost everything under 4000lbs,, we asked for that not to happen. Only thing I would say is that in no matter what class you pull in,, there are tractors that have been hopped up, some beyond what the class that is in,, you will have that at every pul ther is all over the world. I have a Super C that would love to pull light classes, but in retrospect would have to pull div 3 because of the combine engine it has. Let them all pull, and keep it fair, and watch out for tractors that are not supposed to be in there.. Most pullers have stated that they don't like pulling against modified tractors in a div 1 or 2,, I agree with them, tech crews should determine that. I would say start at 2250, and have 500# increments,, somewhere to start is better than no class to pull in. Just watch the rule enforcement, so all of the winners, don't get the famous cheater tag stled to their sleeve. Winning a pull should be like being king for a day,, not have the other fell like they were cheated.. and that Is all most pullers say anymore. You guys could be the example, and the rule!! Show em how to do it, and do it right!! Chad

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Green weenie

01-24-2004 20:11:25

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to ChadS, 01-24-2004 09:44:50

Chad, I have some points that I do not agree with you on, I am a charter member of Natpa no bragg just fact. After pulling with folks for years you get to be more than friends its almost like a family thing, You know what I am talking about,so when you see them get screwed it gets to you also,any way thats my feeling. You stated that the classes were not formed for any particular brand of tractors, I think you are wrong. Div. 2 started out as a class for STOCK TRACTORS and you could weight up to one class. I*ll bet money marbles or chalk that in the 3500lb. class 75% of the tractors that pulled 3 three years ago or less and the class is dominated by ACWC case and point what stock WC can pull 4000 lbs on 36 or 38 inch rubber and not power out? Ask Russ Barth he does it all the time and is leading points in 2 with a stock tractor and he is not alone with his wc.Allis Class I think so.Who ever heard of a3750 another Allis Class? 4250 Div.4 Olliver 88 class I*m leaning that way how about you? I hope you see my point on that subject.Another thing that gets me is how the tractors drop down in divisions,one of the biggest paybacks we have in the season is the Princeton pull,those 4 tractors drop down to 3 like flys because of the hook numbers especially4500 to6000lbs. but one thing that I learned in Princeton is that when they use their pullback sled it is 3.5 not 3.7 or 4 mph.At a true 3.5mph it is almost impossible for a big motor to lug that low and to drop a gear makes them overpower. 3.5 is the rule stick to it.If the organization would just enforce the rules to the letter and equally it would eliminate most their problems,case and point, the rules clearly state that Olliver66 ACWC Farmall H Ford 600 and like size tractors not allowed under 3500lbs.335 Molines are not like size tractor they are bigger more Horsepower stock than the afore mentioned tractors and I would say within20% plus or minus in weight, what is right allowing them to pull in3250? The RPM chart outright sucks...in all divisons except1and2.When I came back from Wichita a lot of you thought it was sour grapes but actually I did well in my classes, I brought home the wood(plaques)25dollar hook fees and I get ribbons and plywood.After all this sniveling the obvious question is why don*t you quit, the fact is I*m a junkie this tractor pulling is worse than a drug habbit,but every once in a while even a junkie has to confront the pusher.I enjoy this type of discussion I think it is healthy for the sport.I know all the big shots of the board monitor it.It lets them know little brother is watching them too!

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Chads

01-25-2004 06:51:35

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Green weenie, 01-24-2004 20:11:25

OK, I see your point. If it is the problem of determine if an engine is stock,, and we all know how picky the tech crews can be,, why not hand them a compression guage, and check the div 1 and 2 classes for excess compression? If it the fact that just about all "stock" tractors are from 100-150psi of compression, Right? At least I have have yet to see one with out having something done to the engine to increase it that much, (over 150). Compression,, will find strokers, it will tell if it is stock or not,, I se the problems with everyone complaining about div 4 in div 3, div 3 in div 2 and so on. If a method needs to be established to check for strokers, in div 1and2, check the compression. why not? They check for every thing else right? Chad

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Green Weenie

01-25-2004 09:14:15

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Chads, 01-25-2004 06:51:35

Chad you took the words right out of my mouth!!Of all the things to tech motor size should be the easiest. Compression is one way also they have gauges that can tell you cubic inch to the knats butt,it is used in sprint car racing all the time. If the organization has money for lazer devices for measuring distance that didn*t work they can lay out some cash for these meters, right now the attention is focused on a device that tells rpm going down the track, I would love to see the pull div.4 and 5 could support, with their hook numbers they would be lucky topay for the scales! These guys are my freinds too, but we have to be realistic if you are going to dance take care of the one who brung ya. The organization has to focus on the mph tractors and bring their head out of the clouds. Just my 2 cents and also fact!

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ChadS

01-25-2004 09:26:07

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA cl in reply to Green Weenie, 01-25-2004 09:14:15

Now the next item is to set a limit on how much compression should be allowed in each division. I would recommend, for div 1 and 2,, 100psi, up to 150psi. div 3, up to 225, and div 4-5 anything above 225. Heck, compression guages are not expencive,, around here they are about 20 bucks!! Like I said, if educating tech committies on local and national circuits, you have to at least be able to reconize a stock block, and their counter parts, look at any type of deadman device, and look for pirate devices that set rpm at the time of the rpm check. What is an extra 2 or 3 mins to check compression? If they want to keep it stock,, than this would be the only economical way to do it, and be fair. Just my 2 cents worth. Chad

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slow mo57

01-25-2004 10:31:34

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA in reply to ChadS, 01-25-2004 09:26:07

Well said or top three before they get payed.

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Not really

01-24-2004 22:00:11

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Green weenie, 01-24-2004 20:11:25

Its the Ford 800-900 thats not allowed below the 3500# class. The 600 has 134 ci [32hp] compared to the 800 @ 172ci [47 hp]. There are several Ford 960's that pull in the 3500 class. I'de be glad to pull against them at 3000# but @ 3500# the extra 500#s plus 15 hp. they're gonna beat you most of the time if your driving skills are about equal. One other note, even if you put a 172 in a 600 and did away with the sleeves, you still wouldn't have the ci of a bone stock WC. Once again, all i'm asking for is a little lighter class than 3500#. All colors accepted, heads up div. 2 pulling. I have one more question, why is there a div. 3&IV class in the 3250 and 3750 but no div. 2?

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Green Weenie

01-25-2004 08:59:01

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Not really, 01-24-2004 22:00:11

Their is a need for a div.2 and also a div.1 class in 3250 as far as I am concerned A div 1 class was more or less made for show tractors that are stone stock, that is the way we get new people attracted to the game, but unfortunately guess where the div.2 tractors that can*t hack it are going. We have got to control division dropping!!!

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slow mo 57 Again well sai

01-25-2004 10:33:53

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA cl in reply to Green Weenie, 01-25-2004 08:59:01

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ChadS

01-25-2004 09:35:57

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA cl in reply to Green Weenie, 01-25-2004 08:59:01

You know, I agree. You mentioned everyone dropping back classes that have big paybacks,, and more than likely it is the big hp tractors that are dominating lower divisions. it is impossible to police cubic in in these tractors,, simply put, there are too many to check,, they should line them up before the class starts, check compression, well go through tech,, then the only thing left is to check hitch height, and specs, and after the pull, rpm check them again. Div 1 and 2 is a growing class, and what I had said before about color classes instead of weight,, well that is a pipe dream,, my thoughts would be to limit weight classes by shipping weight. But that does not work either. Oliver 77 was 3800 shipped empty, at least that is what the operators manual says, What to do?,,, what to do???? And will the NATPA listen? or keep the "better than thou attitude"?? Chad

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slow mo 57

01-25-2004 10:41:55

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA in reply to ChadS, 01-25-2004 09:35:57

It would take few MIN to tech top few tractors harder.Not all need it every time if differt people win they will get their turn to.If not it would not be worth it to win then be called a cheater.

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ChadS

01-25-2004 11:50:35

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New N in reply to slow mo 57, 01-25-2004 10:41:55

True,, very true. I think if they really wanted to, this would work, and help sort out the tractors. maybe have an extra day, just to have them teched. and,,, make it a manditory certification for every one who attends the pull. Most pullers take a weekend or what ever to go anyway. so an extra day would not be out of the question. They do have a good organization,, it is the people who are trying to pull fast ones over on every one else is who are making cheaters out of the winners. The winners circle,, should be like being a king for a day, not being branded a cheater. I think I would make a good tech person,, that is my opinion,, but man,, would I be tired at the end of the day,, would not mind it,, but maybe have a lazy boy recliner there between inspections,, LOL Chad

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Green Weenie

01-25-2004 12:20:06

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Ne in reply to ChadS, 01-25-2004 11:50:35

I do not think tractor pullers need to be tech officials. I have never seen it fail that in any community of any size their is not a trusted mechanic lives there, let the pull promoter pay this person to tech these tractors and I should add or persons,why should we as pullers have to police ourselves? how far should dedication go and what promoters are starving out? This sounds radical I know but I am sick of the who you know or the inside political clout that is in the NATPA,what other organization is their that you do not personally have a vote on the leadership, I mean in the free world.

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ChadS

01-25-2004 15:13:21

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to Green Weenie, 01-25-2004 12:20:06

Every where you go,, there is going to be that kind of politics. A freind helping a freind be legal. If you make rules that cannot be bent, then, that takes away the power of the "Member on the take" If it is black and white,, no arguments, My opinion on tech crews, is one should at least know what a tractor is, LOL,, second, be elected, and tested on his/her skills, or knowledge on tractors, engine parts, and be familiar with the rules. Most auto mechanics cannot tell the difference in most tractor parts. it should take 3 people, one to do the initial test, anothere as a helper, and one to be a final decision maker, 2 out of 3 votes, say it is in, or out, and must be fair, and impartial. no second guessing, no buddy buddy, just the facts. and follow the rules, that is how the perfect world would be,, to me. LOL Chad

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farmall

01-25-2004 14:16:45

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to Green Weenie, 01-25-2004 12:20:06

You do not have a vote on leadership? You must not be a member. I am and voted. Do your homework before you complain!

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Green Weenie

01-25-2004 16:19:54

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to farmall, 01-25-2004 14:16:45

I do not know to what outfit you are refering but if it is NATPA, I have been a member as long as you possibly could have been, and have never had a vote on chairman or president since the big crying session at the national meeting in Springfield Missouri so partner get your facts straight! Furthermore We have never gotten a precise vote tally on the board members, you don*t know if it was a landslide vote or a squeeker. Do we need to discuss the accuraccy of the minutes, I think not.This type of record keeping has created a whale of a bunch of problems, don*t take my word for it ask the tech committe members or your newcomers to the board, my money is just as good as yours and it is time for change!

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farmall

01-26-2004 06:19:48

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to Green Weenie, 01-25-2004 16:19:54

Then vote for change! But quit your dam whining!

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Green Weenie

01-26-2004 14:17:16

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to farmall, 01-26-2004 06:19:48

Is this your best comment you can come up with when some one calls you on an issue?

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farmall

01-26-2004 15:14:21

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to Green Weenie, 01-26-2004 14:17:16

I agree with you! NATPA needs new leadership! To be a good leader one should look at the betterment of the hole organization, not read into the current rules in favor of themselves or friends. By the way this happens more than many realize! Rules are rules inforce them! But I still like the NATPA, just dont care for yes men and pollitics.

When voting for new trustee's, remember this and vote accordingly.

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Green Weenie

01-26-2004 21:44:06

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to farmall, 01-26-2004 15:14:21

Finally something that you and I agree on,the way the voting process is now creates quite a problem for the majority of members.We have to take an extra day off work, and the added expense of eats and lodging to make the meeting before the pull,a lot of members just can not afford to do this especially now times being what they are. I personally would like to see them send a mail in ballot to all the members or at the very least make an absentee ballot available. If you were present at last years meeting they asked if voting at the meeting was acceptable to which they got a resounding yes, of coarse it was ok with the people present because they could be there, I thought that was kind of funny! For all its quirks it is still the best game in town as you stated, but I still think open communication such as we are having is very productive. Have a nice day and a better tommorrow!

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farmall

01-27-2004 16:22:55

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to Green Weenie, 01-26-2004 21:44:06

With your good ideas, you should run for a trustee. There are a few that are up this term.

I agree every member should be able to vote on club issues. Current system is not getting many members present at meetings. Come up with a plan and suggest it at this years meeting!

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slow mo57

01-24-2004 17:41:44

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to ChadS, 01-24-2004 09:44:50

Tell me this if power is not a factor why do stronger tractors hang in the top of the class and weaker ones bump the top just some times to win. The tractors that win the most usaly have hp and good set up.

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John B.

01-24-2004 12:48:16

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to ChadS, 01-24-2004 09:44:50

Actualy we're both saying the same thing. Give me a class in my ci. range like the 3000# class & I wouldn't care if the 300 cubed alises were pulling in it. We'de have a chance to out drive them. You can only do so much driving but at a certain weight the smaller tractors are struggling while a tractor that is twice or three times bigger is not even motoring down. Put a stock Jubalie against a stock Alis B @ say 2700 & you'de see what I mean. I'm not asking to elimanate any tractors, all I'm asking for is a class that would be fair to more tractors in that smaller ci. range.Tractors like a 8 or 9n that weigh 2600# or 2700# have to add 25% to the total tractor weight just to pull in the next class. Would you want to pull your 4500# tractor in the 6500# class all the time. Think about it!

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Lloyd

01-26-2004 08:45:41

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to John B., 01-24-2004 12:48:16

Weight,balance,and gearing is what its all about.Here is an example,I pulled a JD2510 diesel at our county fair pull for years in the 7000 and 9000 lb.classes,this tractor has about 55 hp,always did well in the 7 but in the middle in the 9.I was finally able to get it weighted right for the 9 and guess what,I won the 9000 lb class.Now I didn't beat those 4020's,1066's and like tractors by a few inches but try 30 FEET,thats right 30 FEET.Now to make those guys feel worse, third place was a 4020,2nd place was my cousin on the same 2510,I beat him by 3 feet.That was about 20 years ago and people still talk about today.So remember weight,balance,and gearing.Can you say TWICE THE HORSEPOWER AND TWICE THE CUBIC INCHES.

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Ok,-----butt

01-26-2004 15:38:44

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA class in reply to Lloyd, 01-26-2004 08:45:41

Weight, balance& gearing. Well Loyd, What gear would you pull in with a 9-n Ford @ 3500#. Remember, you only have three to start with and first gear is close to 4 mph. Get real and compare apples to apples. At 3500# your already 1000# over shipping weight. Why are you against a weight break of less than 1000# when most of the classes above split at 250#. As for your pulling story, I well believe it happened. Were you able to repeat this feat week after, year in and year out? Probably not if their still talking about it from 20 years ago.

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A little comparing

01-27-2004 01:53:34

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA cl in reply to Ok,-----butt, 01-26-2004 15:38:44

In basketball in Ind. they have several classes. Why is that? Each class has the same rules, same size court, rim size and height, lenght of game ect. Then why, with all things being physically equal, don't all the teams play in the same class? Pulling is just like BB. in Ind. The same Wt., hitch ht., tire size and speed limit doesn't neccesarly mean they are equal on the pulling strip. Almost everyone has a story like Loyds if they have pulled for any lenght of time, but its hard to stay enthused if you only win once every 20 yrs. or so. As for voting, I've never said I was unhappy with the leadership. I just feel theres a lot of smaller tractors that would compete if there were a class. I know this was not the case years ago so that is probably why the officials have never added any classes at the time.

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Green Weenie

01-26-2004 21:50:15

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New NATPA cl in reply to Ok,-----butt, 01-26-2004 15:38:44

WellSaid

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