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Antique Tractor Paint and Bodywork

CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S.

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JDGMC

01-14-2006 07:32:01




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I'm in the process of restoring both a JD 730 and 830. I know just enough about painting to be dangerous. I work at a sign manufacturer so we paint there too. I've been attempting to read-up on as much as possible from you guys but still have questions before I get started with the painting phase.
I'm just now starting to assemble a few things (like air cleaner, water pump, fuel filter, etc.) on the 730 and had asked for advise a few weeks ago on the best way to get some paint on these parts, before assembly, to make the final paint job easier and more complete. I've got the tractor apart and in my really nice shop with epoxy floors and all and really wouuld rather not get paint overspray on everything when painting the portions of the tractor that can't be easily removed. My first question back then was "do I use JD rattle cans?". I got the expected negative responses - I know this is not a well liked approach. Should I set up my paint gun every time I've got a few parts to paint, before reassembly? I went to my local paint store yesterday and discussed various paints with the owner (who is a body guy). He absolutely hates Imron and since they sell Dupont and not PPG, he mixed a sample of Dupont Nason Fulthane urethane antique JD green. I think the number is 262IB. I started with FIT's information on his web site. Do you guys recommend this brand of paint? This guy claims it is quite easy to work with and he's had great results. I know I've got the Iso's to deal with. I realize that this is a long post but I wanted to get the whole thing out. Please give me some feedback.
JDGMC

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Tom-Pa

01-19-2006 10:53:41




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 Re: CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S. in reply to JDGMC, 01-14-2006 07:32:01  
I would like to put a comment in here. I talked to the PPG reps when they came to my work place (Airline) and gave a class. Question I had was what is the difference in Auto and Aircraft paints. He said that the Aircraft paints hsd to stand up to Phosphate Ester hydraulic fluids. (This I know from personal experience. It can make a very good paint stripper at times.) The formula that we use is not a commercial type. You cannot buy it on the open market or from a jobber. Also, the aircraft dedicated paints will not hold up to auto gas. They will readily discolor. Where auto paint formulas will resist auto gas.
Just my 2 pence worth.
Tom-Pa

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Jonmac3480

01-16-2006 15:21:06




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 Re: CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S. in reply to JDGMC, 01-14-2006 07:32:01  
Yeah I agree with all the guys that left a comment on here. Emron is good but you have to be really carful with it. My neibor is really sick from it right now he has spots on his liver from the cemicals in the paint. It screwed his liver.He alos wore a really good mask witch is scary. Every time I paint I take the tractor car what ever it might be I take it apart as mcuh as I can. I am resotring a Farmall Super A right now and everything is being rebuilt and everything is being painted seperately everything then it is being all put back together. If you paint it in your garage try to make a way were you can get the tractor near some were with a allot of ventalation. Because if you dont you wont be able to see from all the over spary and chemicals and you might find yourself felling pretty good. What i usally do is i paint in my garage and i get about sixteen 2 by 4 and make a box that the tractor will fit in except for putting them on the the ground then I get some black plastic or clear from lowes or homedepot. and cover the box with a staple gun now you have a spray booth and invest in some cheap fans too keep the fumes moving outside dont use one's you really care about becasue they will get ruined.About paint I use PPG I like how it works its a nice paint it hardens fast. Also were you buy your paint is important its all in how they mix it up. Always use a paint with a hardner and reducer. You will save yourself allot of head aches trust me. If you have anymore questions fell fre to e-mail me at grahammacdonald@cox.net

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CNKS

01-16-2006 17:06:25




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 Re: CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S. in reply to Jonmac3480, 01-16-2006 15:21:06  
Just so others understand, you don't want to suck fumes through your cheap fans. If you are using them to push fresh air to remove the fumes, and the air flow prevents fumes from actually getting to the fans that's ok, but it can be hard to do. Otherwise you are asking for an explosion, because the wiring, brushes, etc are exposed to the fumes. I use explosion proof exhaust fans. They are expensive. NEVER use hardener without a supplied air system. You say your neighbor was using a good "mask". There is no good mask when it comes to isos.

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JDGMC

01-14-2006 20:12:14




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 Re: CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S. in reply to JDGMC, 01-14-2006 07:32:01  
Thanks for the replies. I will definitely forget about any ideas of playing with the rattle cans. You've pretty much settled that issue forme. I'll try to take apart as much as I can to get those pieces painted separately. Since I'm not attempting to go for the expo quality of restoration, I'll try the Nason since my jobber is very familiar with it. I'm going to try to get some paint on the frame of the tractor without making a big mess. Its not only the floor but all that nice new white steel. I guess I can always hang some poly on the sides and the top since my ceiling is 14 feet high. The problem will be getting the fumes out. I don't have a convenient way to do that since the tractor is sitting in the middle of the 40x40 shop. I'll have to get something figured out or I won't have much for visibility.
By the way, I'm already prepared to get a Hobby Air system to deal with the isos.
Thanks again for your input. You guys have a wealth of knowledge for hacks like myself.
JDGMC

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Frank Stalfire

01-14-2006 18:21:24




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 Re: CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S. in reply to JDGMC, 01-14-2006 07:32:01  
Many people do Hate Imron, mostly because it is expensive and hard to spray if your not given some good pointers, I guess if I spent $300 dollars for a gallon of red and the job came out terrible I would be disgusted too, Just recognize this response is most likely because of inexperience with Imron, the product is bullet proof.
Remember everything has it's place, Imron 5000 is one of the best most longest lasting paints for things exposed to the elements all the time, a tractor kept inside always except for half a day in the sun evry month for a show wont need top of the line protection, and as expected, protection and durability are expensive but determine what level of protection you will need. As for the different paints, if Imron is the Mercedes than Nason is the Chevy and DuPont auto line is the upper end Asian, Honda, Toyota

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Rod(NH)

01-14-2006 16:17:23




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 Re: CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S. in reply to JDGMC, 01-14-2006 07:32:01  
Hi,

Ditto what CNKS said. NASON is DuPont's economy line of automotive paints and is a competitor to PPG's OMNI. I have never used any but have no doubt it is a quality paint for the price. I am curious to know why your DuPont jobber "absolutely hates IMRON". It should be considered top-of-the-line as far as quality and durability goes. They don't use it for planes, trains and fleet vehicles for nothing you know. The only thing against it is cost and high iso content.

I don't know what you have for safety equipment but I would be much more concerned with your health using iso-containing materials than getting overspray on the floor. As CNKS says, the overspray-on-the-floor issue can be handled by putting down some plastic film. The film could also be used elsewhere, such as over toolboxes etc. The iso matter is more difficult and costly to properly address, unless you are already set up for it - but that's a personal decision for you to make. You may also have a visibility problem depending on what the volume of your space is and what mechanical ventilation rate is available to remove overspray.

I also don't know what you have for a spray gun but if you are doing parts individually (as you should be, IMO) you might want to consider a spot gun. The gravity ones are easy to clean and it's not that much of a deal to set one up for a few individual pieces at a time. The entire chassis is best done with a full sized gun however, unless you want to attack that piecemeal also by masking off areas one at a time. My own rule of thumb on spot vs full size is not to tackle a part with a spot gun that cannot be covered with one coat using whatever quantity is available in the cup - usually about 4-6 oz. You'll get the best coverage by stripping the chassis the maximum practical extent first, but it all depends on what you want to obtain as an end result.

third party image Rod

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CNKS

01-14-2006 09:40:37




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 Re: CNKS, Rod(NH), Frank S. in reply to JDGMC, 01-14-2006 07:32:01  
My previous answer has not changed -- the only way to get uniform coverage is with it disassembled. As to your floor, can cover the area you are painting in, and clean it up afterward. Hard to have a nice floor and paint too, so I gave up on mine. DuPont, PPG, and Martin Senour, along with others I'm not familiar with, make equivalent paints, -- the dealer is likely more important than the brand -- Frank Stalfire can tell you all you need to know about Nason.

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