Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

Attention Forum Users: On the 28th of December 2023 at 9:00am Central Time, we will be taking the forums down for maintenance while we prepare the new forums for your use. Please click here for more information.

Discussion Forum
:

OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY??

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
BillGA

06-24-2007 17:32:40




Report to Moderator

My HVAC runs low on refrigerant about once a year. The service guy comes and charges $45 for refrigerant and $75 for the trip charge. He's tightened stuff but has never been successful at finding the leak. I do pretty much the same thing with a manifold and refrigerant on my cars for about $15 a pop. Is this something that I should try to do myself by purchasing the manifold equipment and some refrigerant or should I just pay the $120 and be happy it only works out to $10/month?

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
BillGA

06-25-2007 07:48:30




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
Dan,
Your advice agrees perfectly with my conclusion based on the advice from this list. I knew it was a way off-topic question and the answers might be technically flawed, but the general wisdom that I've seen from this board is a resource I've grown to appreciate.
My question boiled down to "Is recharging a HVAC any more complicated that recharging a car's AC?" The answer seemed to be a resounding "Way more complicated!!"
The detailed information you provided will be helpful in working with and evaluating the work of the pro who is on his way to charge the unit and find the leak. Thanks.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
dan2n217688

06-25-2007 05:06:49




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
Ok, I'm gonna make a few enemys here. First of all the best place to get HVAC info is not a tractor forum. I cant believe what I've read here. "The only way to charge a heat pump is to evacuate, and charge to manufactures recomendations" If you could buy the R-22, do you have a scale to weigh it in? Or, "just charge it till the suction line sweats". Or someone telling you what the pressures should read. Do you have a refrigerant manifold gauge? Anyone ever heard of superheat, wet bulb temp, subcooling? Indoor wet bulb, and outdoor temp. is differant in every home. Look, if you want to get the leak fixed, then tell the tech to find the leak and fix it. Pay for the time and repair, get a quote first. But when he does find the leak, the repair cost could vary, depending on where it is. If its in the evaporator coil, I would replace the coil, which would be more money than say, at a soldered joint. Look for oil at the fittings or joints. Thats an obvious place for a leak. You may find that its just easier to to have it charged every year, but leaks dont fix themselves. You see, it's your leak, not the techs. You have control on how its handled. All leaks can be found, but not all leaks can be repaired very easy or cheap. The best and final advise is to pay and have it repaired by a pro, and not all HVAC techs are pros. The dumbest advise I could give you , is to fix it yourself. Dan

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
BillGA

06-24-2007 18:59:37




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
Thanks for the responses. As usual, I've obtained quite an education from the forum members. This seems like something that is best left to the professionals and done the right way. I'll now know what to insist upon to get the heat pump's leak fixed correctly.

Thanks again,



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Hobo,NC

06-24-2007 18:59:14




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
I would go B-hind the service man and make sure the schrader (need a spell check) valves are tight and the service cap has a o-ring seal in the cap. they are like the ones in a tire valve stem and the cap needs a seal. Its common for the service man to sorta not pay enny mind to'em, job security. Most units hole enuff refrigerant that a little leak will git the home owner thew the season so they do not take the time to leak check, see'ya next year

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Dunk

06-24-2007 18:29:30




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
Make you a strong dish washing soap solution, just like to find the leak in a tire, and check it all, all coils, and connections.

Now an auto, with a sight glass is a bit different than a home system.

My question is.. is it a heat pump, if so the only real way to charge it accurately is to evacuate it, and put the calculated from the mfg.s tables charge in it.

Not too many folks do that.

Most folks that do it regularly get a feel, according to the outside air temp, the inside air temp, and what the pressures are running and can get close.

I think you can learn to do it yourself with a little help.

If I can get the inside temp, about 20 degrees lower than the outside temp, and get the low pressure manifold gauge running around 40- 44 degrees on the R22 scale on the gauge (evaporation temp) and the outside high pressure running around 225 - 250 lbs of pressure, it is usually good to go.

There are other things to look at as well, the humidity, as well as the amount of condensate running out the drain pipe.

Charging it and guessing it takes some experience, but there is only one way to get that, and that is to do it.

The ONLY way to do it accurately is to evacuate it, and measure the charge by the mfg.s recommendations.

I hope that made some sense...

If not, Oh, Well..


If you get it overcharged, and get liquid refrigerant coming all the way back to the compressor before it evaporates it will wash the oil off the compressor bearings, and shorten the life of the compressor quite a bit.

If you get it undercharged, you are paying for more electricity than you need to.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Wayne, NW La

06-24-2007 18:09:29




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
BTW- R22 is running close to $100 for a 30lb bottle now.

Wayne



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
dlplost

06-24-2007 18:07:59




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
He's ripping you off by not fixing the system. However his prices seem normal for the industry. Localy here they charge $80 for the trip and minimum of $45 for the refridgerent. He has a leak detector that will detect a leak as small as 1 oz in 3 years. He can also put UV die in the system so he can find exactly where the leak is. Cant do it yourself as R134 is about the only thing you can buy over the counter, and it wont work in that. It requires a Fed lisc. to buy the stuff you'll need.
Usually its just an "O" ring or a cracked fitting from too much tightening.
Tell him to fix it or you'll Find another guy to service the system.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Paul Pa.

06-24-2007 18:07:35




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
Bill I serviced HVAC equiptment for 35 years sometimes it is hard to find leaks but you should have a guy check your system with an electronic leak dector and a good visual check of all pipeing and indoor and outdoor coils. look for spot that seem to be damp with oil also I have found in rare cases the leak can be around the compressor factory welds or terminals. After repair is done insist on evacuation to 500 microns read on an electronic vacume gauge,good luck finding a new A/C contractor willing to spend the time to do it right, Paul Pa

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Tom N MS

06-24-2007 18:01:54




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
The HVAC man I use at my place of employment told me about something that they can add and he has had about 90% success with it stopping small leaks. Might be worth asking about.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Leak Test...John,PA

06-24-2007 18:01:54




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
You can always leak test the system yourself.

Very similiar to automotive leak testing.

Check each joint at the air handler and condenser.

Like posted, you will probably be asked for a license to purchase R-22, even though Walmarts sells R-134a with no license required.

John,PA



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Wayne, NW La

06-24-2007 18:01:43




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
Bill,

EPA is REAL picky about who can purchase refrigerant. You must be certified by the EPA before you can purchase or install R22.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
BCnT

06-24-2007 22:16:22




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to Wayne, NW La, 06-24-2007 18:01:43  
its not rocket science...test is open book...they {EPA} just want proof you saw the law so they can prosecute when ya screw up.

IF you score some Freon 22 just add to suction side till suction line starts sweating and feels chilly to touch...watch line until thermostat kicks compressor off...as long as it doesnt ice up youre good to go.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Greg_Ky

06-24-2007 17:54:07




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to BillGA, 06-24-2007 17:32:40  
Do you have a HVAC license? You need one to purchase R22.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Dunk

06-24-2007 18:07:20




Report to Moderator
 Re: OT - HVAC low refrigerant - DIY?? in reply to Greg_Ky, 06-24-2007 17:54:07  
I don't (not in GA as far as I know, I have a 50 lb can, but I have had it a few years).

But then I did HVAC work so many years ifn I did need to, my old boss would let me use his.

But then that is who I buy it from.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy