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8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight??

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Dave Hilley

01-27-2001 04:47:26




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I installed new sleeves in my 8-N, and they were tight. I honed sleeves, and checked piston skirt had .002 to .003. End gap on rings was .015 to .018. Crank is .010. Had to pull to start, it only ran couple Min. Then tightened up and stalled. It will start with 6 V on tis own, but tightens up
after 10 min. or so. It is not the crank tightening. Any ideas??




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David Hilley

01-28-2001 14:20:19




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 Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to Dave Hilley, 01-27-2001 04:47:26  
I double checked bearings and caps, had them all marked also. Also loosened all bearing caps, No difference. Without pistons in crank turned normally with mains torked up to spec's. Pistons with rings went in very tight.Am going to tear it back down on Monday. Will post notice what I find.



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RON/PA

01-28-2001 05:15:00




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 Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to Dave Hilley, 01-27-2001 04:47:26  
HI DAVE, JUST OFFERING MY OPINION, I WOULD BE VERY MUCH INCLINED TO FOLLOW ALONG THE PATH OF THE PLANT DOCTOR, I HAVE USUALLY FOUND THAT ANY TIGHTENING AFTER A REBUILD HAS BEEN CONFINED TO THE CRANK/BEARING/CAP AREAS. ANY TIGHTNESS IN THE SLEEVE AREA WOULD NO DOUBT SCAR THE SLEEVE, AND EVENTUALLY RUIN THE RINGS OR SLEEVE, AT WHICH POINT A WHOLE NEW SET OF SYMPTOMS WOULD APEAR WHEN YOU TRY TO RE START. BEST OF LUCK
RON/PA

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will

01-28-2001 05:03:22




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 Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to Dave Hilley, 01-27-2001 04:47:26  
Dave, The pistons without the rings installed should move up/down the sleeves freely. Did yours?
If they didn't, you don't have adequate clearance.



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Plant Doctor

01-28-2001 04:27:03




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 Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to Dave Hilley, 01-27-2001 04:47:26  
Dave: If it is a fact your piston clearance is correct and ring end gap is within the correct specs, I would suspect bearing problems. Are your bearing caps on correctly? Drop the pan, loosen all the bearing caps and try to turn the crank manually. You should notice some piston ring drag, but it should turnover relatively easy with a socket of crank. If it seems to be OK, then tighten the bearing caps one at a time to determine if one is excessively tight. First be sure all the caps are installed correctly. Did you plastic gauge your rods and mains during your installation? I maintain a shop here on the farm and take in a lot of outside work to help keep the boat afloat. I have seen .020 bearing packaged in .010 boxes and now we check everything. We even mic the cranks and have sent several back to have them done over again. This is why it cost more than it should to get your tractors and equipment repaired. We/the machanic has to check everything twice. If he doesn't the repair will come back and the shop will take the hit. Here in my shop we make sure everything goes out the door as near to perfect as possible without driving the cost to the customer beyond resonable. Back to your problem, let us know what you find, I am interested to know where the problem is.

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raytasch

01-27-2001 06:32:15




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 Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to Dave Hilley, 01-27-2001 04:47:26  
Does it have oil pressure and coolant? Why did you have to pull start it first time, was it tight? An N engine should not be tight so tight after an overhaul that you would have to pull it to start it unless your battery is dead, starter bad or you have 'skinny' battery cables. Might want to pull the plugs and try turning it over by hand. If it is binding pull the engine back down and find out why. Do not understand your last statement about 'crank tightening'. Wish you much luck, ray

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dave

01-27-2001 07:42:26




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 Re: Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to raytasch, 01-27-2001 06:32:15  
Ray, The cables were large ones good battery could not hardly turn over by hand. Pistons went in hard. No problem with crank. 30 LB. oil press. RE-bilt oil pump, Radiator full coolant, All tolerances within specs. Hate to start all over.Dave



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raytasch

01-27-2001 07:53:23




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 Re: Re: Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to dave, 01-27-2001 07:42:26  
Dave, How rough was the cylinder hone job? What grade stone? Pistons should not go in hard. An N engine should turn fairly easily. Might be someone else would have an idea but I would surely want to know why it was tight. I am assuming when you say it stops that it just tightens up and stops and not running out of fuel. When it stops will the engine turn over or do you have to wait 'till it cools? Does the clutch work OK? ray

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AL@NC

01-27-2001 08:43:31




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to raytasch, 01-27-2001 07:53:23  
Sounds like you have a piston binding as they should not be tight. I would pull the pan and head to check and locate the binds. I would NOT run the engine untill the problem is resolved.



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dave

01-27-2001 08:40:21




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to raytasch, 01-27-2001 07:53:23  
I have to wait a bout 1/2 hr, then it will start.
I used 220 grit stones on my cly hone



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Frank from Maine

01-27-2001 18:12:55




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to dave, 01-27-2001 08:40:21  
How can your ring and piston etc. readings be within spec's and they still be tight...better measure again...:-)



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TimK

01-27-2001 22:29:08




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 8N New Sleeves- Pistons Tight?? in reply to Frank from Maine, 01-27-2001 18:12:55  
I agree with all the responses so far. I rebuilt my first N 2 years ago. The pistons did not go in hard. And I don't think the type of honing stone will bind the pistons. I believe that you either have 1. measured the clearance wrong or 2. you have an out of round sleeve. I don't think It's an oil pressure problem because I think if it were, it would seize and not unseize. You have a too much friction problem. Sorry, but I think you have to mike things again. Even after all my pistons were installed with the valve train in place, I could sill put a wrench on the front pulley bolt and turn it over by hand.

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