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(OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really I'm

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9N'er

06-19-2003 04:10:58




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Just thought I would ask the 928N Ford tractor world if anyone has ever built a house, barn, tractor or anything of importance and significance to you and had to deal with friends, family, and co-worker backlash and experienced weird, strange, condescending, patronizing rude or hurtful comments from them?

My wife and I have been living in a 16x20 mice and ant infested camp building for 4 years moving from a nicer house to this old camp to save our money, do as much physical labor, clearing, work, and efforts to build a nice house on a nice spot of land that was within our limited means. We do the best we can. We started the house two weeks ago, but the most surprising thing has been the reaction from associates in our world. The social reaction from town's people, friends, family, and coworkers has been sort of like a strange, and snide reaction.

Well, we're overlooking it as much as possible but it seems that there are more naysayers than there are people who are just respectful or supportive for a small family following through on their dreams. And, I am not one to brag, boast, or talk. I have always made it a point to only tell when asked and to keep our dream private as much as possible. Arrogant is just not me.

9N'er

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ZANE - GO FOR IT 9Ner I D

06-20-2003 05:48:41




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
My house cost me 3500.00 and an old IH bulldozier to build 40 years ago. I did it almost completely alone. My wife was pregnant and I was making about 80.00 a week. I made 60.00 a month payments for five years and had no doors inside the house except the bathroom. We still live in the same house. (Better insulated and much improvements)

Just be thankful we live in a country where it is still possible to be independent.

God bless America!

Zane

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9N'er

06-20-2003 01:45:14




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
Thank you for the comments and stories. On somedays when I am run down, tired, overwhelmed and beat those other things that people like to nit over tend to sting more.

This is a good site with a lot of life stories that provides a "everything is right and normal" perspective when things seem to get out of hand or overwhelming.

Let me say this abut housebuilding: it's a roller coaster ride. One minute we're up, and the next minute we're just wondering what we got ourselves into!

Thanks for the messages. 9N'er

p.s.

And oh, for all the effort that's required in this, yes I want to make it a nice place. For some you know I just built a a woodshop/furniture shop that I hope to build into a retirement business when I retire from my day job in 15 years. It is a classic early Shaker building. The house will be a Shaker Meeting House, modeled after a Shaker Meeting House in Sabbathday Lake, Maine. It's a gambrel with three shed roof dormers, an atached mudroom with that having a wrap around farmers porch, and a rather handsome building overall. True to early traditional Shaker style everyhting is balanced and has symmetry: two chimneys on each end of the house three centered shed roof dormers, a central front door and two windows on each side of the front door. I selected the design to help add to the rural and traditional character of the road we live on, and to match the shed roof dormers from the farm house down the road built in 1810.

Someday I'll post a picture and someday I'll hang my shingle along the road for those wanting traditonal, colonial and Shaker furniture and cabinetry. The house will also display the furniture, finish work, and cabinets, mantels etc. produced from the shop. Well, that's my thinking for now and always subject to change...meaning that the only thing for certain in life is change. Thanks to all.

9N'er

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dave 50 8n

06-19-2003 18:39:51




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
Took me 3 yrs from blding approval to s/o on my garage. Never done it before and probably scared..ran out of moola too. Finally decided to "just do it." Putting up a wall one day, and a kid drove by and yelled, "HEY< HE"S GOT ONE WALL UP!!!!" It looks nice now.

Funny thing, now that it's done, my relatives seem to respect me more....hmmm.

Following dreams in movies makes great script...especially when you know the ending. It's not as assured in real life, but the need to follow the dream still persists!!

Your comments on the board are well thought out, so I'm sure you'll build a great,well thought out place!
Good luck Tom!

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Bill(NC)

06-19-2003 18:17:25




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
This discussion reminds me of a neighbor that moved in about a mile down the road. Our neighbor hood consists of nominal size homes on 1/2 or more acres of land. Each home is fairly neat and it is a nice place to live. This person moved in about two years ago and immediately put up a 6' X 9' billboard in his front yard. It is like a t--- in a punch bowl. I'm sure he either didn't care about his neighbors or he does not have a clue. He is probably not getting points around there.

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AL

06-19-2003 17:30:43




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
10 years ago, my wife and I decided to get everything paid off and move to the country. We bought 20 acres of land on an owner finance deal, 3 years later got a 401k loan and built a house on the land.

Today, everything is paid off. All of my former co-workers (I quit my job, i'm looking for another) thought we were crazy. They thought the way to happiness was to get a lower interest rate on their credit cards and to try and outdo their neighbors on houses, cars, etc.

I got a lot of rude comments from friends, former friends, and enemies. But you know what? The house is still not finished, but we don't care. I have a LOT less stress in my life now, i'll live the way I want to and the heck with what everyone else says.

Oh, and by the way. We're having a great time. Working on the house, working on our tractors, watching wildlife, its great.

You've got lots of people in the same boat as you. It's a great boat. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

-AL

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JimNC

06-19-2003 16:46:07




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
9N'er

Yes, Me and my Wife have had the same reaction from other family members on both sides about us home schooling our children. It goes against the "norm" that they know, so the only way for them to react is negatively. I am not the smartest man and My wife is no a professor, but our children are doing better now than they were in the public school sys. Matter of fact, we are graduating our oldest Sat afternoon. We have three children and live in an old house that cost us $1000. It has those old tile type shingle siding, some of which is broken and falling off. I have rewired and replumbed everything myself. This house has no insulation (hot in summer, cold in winter), is just over 800 sq ft. I am 38 and this house and land are paid for. Just bought another 1/2 acre or so next to mine (finally got rid of bad neighbors). The only reason I have not done anything to the out side of the house ie vinyl siding or brick is I am not sure I can do the job good enough to suit Me. What I meant to say before I went somewhere else was, If you and your family are happy then what everyone else thinks about it is moot. Some are just jealous because they will still be paying a big mortgage when you are living in a paid for, self built house with a little cash left over to spend elsewhere. I say YOU GO BOY!! Don't let what others think or say get ya down. Don't second guess what you are doing. GO, GO ,GO. There are plenty of books you can buy that tell you how to wire your house, plumbing, framing and all.

Sorry for going off in left field.

Jim

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souNdguy

06-19-2003 11:46:33




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
Makes you wonder why those people just can't be happy for you since you are working toward your dream goal.

If it's legal, and it makes you feel good.. do it!

best of luck!

Soundguy



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Truck

06-19-2003 11:18:19




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
9N'er, if you are doing as good a job on the house as you did on your tractors, the comments are certain to be fueled by pure jealousy.

Are you in an area where your camp is the norm for housing, and you are building something the locals would consider huge, garish, and ostentatious? Do you make it a point to show off your expensive cars, new construction equipment, and expensive toys the locals could never afford ? Well then expect jealous remarks, hurtful comments, and surely a huge hit on your tax bill once you finish.

My bro bought the most expensive house in the neighborhood and showed up with a huge truck and a Lincoln.Both had tons of miles , but coming from Arizona, they looked like new cars to the Vermonters where he moved. The local furnace guy probably doubled his normal rates when he worked for 'em. Now my bro has a rusty pickup and a sorry looking tractor and he fits in better.

But from what I know of ya I bet you just have a lot of older well maintained stuff and you ain't a showoff. They just wish they could do the work you do as good as ya, I bet.
We like ya here anyhow!
Truck

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Matt from MN

06-19-2003 10:44:23




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
9N'er
Stick with it. I get the same thing all the time. I work in a bank and you can imagine the remarks and looks I get when I talk with my co-workers about staying up until midnight tearing my 8N apart and when they see my oil stained hands and dirty finger nails, or when I borrow the neighbors back hoe to dig up my frot yard and repair the sewer line myself. I also get looks because my wife and I bought a duplex and rent out the upstairs for some extra money, every one I work with says I should kick out my renter and use the whole house myself. What would my wife & I and 2 toddler girls need with a 5 bedroom house? Just more to clean and maintain, besides and extra $400/month is nice. It is a shame that so many people these days look down on people who are trying to get ahead and take pride in doing a job themselves. They will just never have the satisfaction that we get upon completing a project on our own.

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Brian-2N

06-19-2003 10:01:20




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
9,
When I built my place in New Hampshire, I didn't tell anyone except the family. The first anyone knew was when I gave my boss the new address. Screw 'em, it's none of their business and I hate answering questions.
I have a neighbor whole built himself a very unusual dome house. Others in town laugh at him, but he's one of the nicer people I know and I'm sad that he is moving away.
I generally respond to others by chanting our favorite mantra, "Live Free or Die!" Also being from New Hampshire, you know the meaning behind the words like I do.
I've made it a habit not to live my life by what others think. It's lonely sometimes, but I can look at myself in the mirror.

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Rob N VA

06-19-2003 09:53:45




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
Reminds me of the uppity jerks that live here in central Virginia. There is a lot of "old" money here in Charlottesville, and the majority of them feel that if you get you fingers dirty, then you are beneath them, and treat you as such. What they don't take into consideration is that someone somewhere along the line had their hands dirty so that they could be so rich and "better" than everyone else. That kind of attitude drives me nuts! Keep on Keepin' on there 9Ner, you are doing the right thing and we are behind you 100 percent!----Rob

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JerryU

06-19-2003 09:48:57




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
FWIW:

In my 50 some years I have been married and not married. I have had money and been poor. I have had friends and I have had friends turn on me.

Happiness is in the heart, not in other people. Your strength and your life is in you, your wife, children if you have any, and your creator. Be at peace we these and the rest won't matter much.

JU



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Willy-N

06-19-2003 08:38:45




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
Make yourself happy first! As far as the rest, the ones that give you a hard time probley are not happy with what they have or don't have the drive to attain their dreams. Of course their dream may be just doing things the easy way too. I get ribbed for my place but it did not come on a silver platter, we saved and worked hard to build it. Go for it build your dream home and enjoy it, reap the rewards of your hard work. Just be ready for your taxes going up big time!! That is the only drawback I know of. Mark H.

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Reminds me...

06-19-2003 07:40:38




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
...of a little quip I heard once.
"Don't tell folks about your troubles. Half of them don't care and the other half are secretly glad you're in such a fix."
Hang in there 9ner. If you know in your heart you're doing the right thing then that's really all that matters.
I've always been glad to see folks living out their dreams. Good luck with the house.
Jerry
aka Ultradog MN



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Willy-N

06-19-2003 08:30:46




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 Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...rea in reply to Reminds me..., 06-19-2003 07:40:38  
How is the new spark in your life doing? Any changes yet? Mark H.



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Ultradog MN

06-19-2003 20:03:57




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 Re: Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant.. in reply to Willy-N, 06-19-2003 08:30:46  
Thanks for asking Mark.
But...
You don't get to be a 50 yo bachelor by being in a hurry. Heh heh
I keep thinking there s still time for that kind of thing.
I've been working up in Wisconsin for 10 days straight. Living on an island. No computer. No phone. I'll see her this weekend. If she goes dancing. How have you been?



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Willy-N

06-19-2003 20:59:37




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arroga in reply to Ultradog MN, 06-19-2003 20:03:57  
Been going to Car Shows with the Power Wagon. Won a 3rd place in one (Open Trucks) and "Most Customized" in another one. Even went in a Parade with it. Been a blast, I have put over 900 miles on it since I have finished it with no problems. Putting some tunes in it next week for those long drives. Going to hide the AM/FM/CD Player in the Glove box and the speakers behind the seats. Mark H.



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From humble beginnings...

06-19-2003 07:39:55




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
My parents set up housekeeping in 1937 in an old uninsulated 2 car garage, with kerosene lamps and a small wood stove and no running water, in Flint, Michigan.
In 1942, they moved to Ypsilanti, Mich. to a new 20X24, 2 bedroom house on a crawl space. My father built a garage out of used lumber (WW2 was in full swing), hand dug a basement and added a utility room.
In 1950 (I was 7), they bought an old run down farm house and barn on 27 acres, about 8 miles away, near Belleville, Mich. It had a hand fired coal furnace and no bathroom. For the next 18 years, before my father died of a heart attack at age 53 in 1968, they improved the house to include 4 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms, a laundry room all within the existing house and a gas furnace.
In 1964, my father tore down two old barns and used the materials to build a "new" 24X40 barn.
All the while, we were farming about 120 acres, 80 of it rented, and he was working in a factory.
In 1966, my father bought a small 2 beedroom, one bath house for $600 that had to be moved 8 miles. We placed it on 3/4 acre of the home place and, in 1967, I moved my wife and 1 year old son out of a mobile home park and moved into it 2 days before I left for army basic training.
We lived there 17 years and raised our 3 kids and I don't remember how many dogs and cats. While there I added 2 beedrooms and a bathroom upstairs, built a 24X24 garage attached with an 8x10 breezeway. We put a 12x12 addition on the living room and remodeled the 1934 kitchen up to all new cabinets. I also installed aluminum siding on the whole structure.
In 1983, we bought 6 acres, about 10 miles away in Ypsilanti Township. We bought a 2 bedroom mobile home in 1984 and moved out of our house.
We lived in that mobile home for 16 months. My oldest son left for the Marine Corps 2 days after we moved so there were only 2 teenagers to deal with in these "new" accomodations.
In 1985, we built our 3 bedroom, 1 bath, walkout basement "dream house". Here it is 18 years later and we don't like it.
I have the space to build again but we probably will not do it. I have other hills to climb.
My point in all of this is, ingore the lazy a--ed jealous people who frown on your efforts.
My father always commented positivly about the farms that looked a lot worse than ours. He said, "they are trying to be productive".

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Oops...Barnstormer

06-19-2003 08:29:27




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 Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...rea in reply to From humble beginnings..., 06-19-2003 07:39:55  
That is my story...From humbel beginnings...and I'm sticken toit.
John Sanderson

ps The 1951 8N Ford and I have been together 50 years this year. It is our "Golden Jubilee".



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Bill(NC)

06-19-2003 07:10:55




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
The only time I've ever seen a neighborhood get a general bad feeling about anyone was when the person was doing things outside their norm. This could be good or bad. If you are doing things outside the neighborhood norm, perhaps you should expect some reaction.



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Steve from MO - I live in

06-19-2003 06:17:02




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
No one around here can stand to see anyone else get ahead. My wife and I, and most of our real friends live well below our means and save or invest the difference.



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Rich, NJ

06-19-2003 06:07:28




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
The world is full of people who can't stand anyone who isn't as stupid as they are. Ignore them! Yes I've been in the similiar position. The people who didn't criticize me are still my friends, the ones who did criticize me are not! My own feelings towards the successes of others is " Go make your first million, I want to be able to tell people that I knew you when!" I'm not rich, but I have more than most. My children will have more than I. Most of us have been improving ourselves since man stood upright and walked out of the caves. Those who don't move upward degenerate into very backward people who become the butt of jokes by others and ultimately die out. Any time you have a dream or a opportunity to honorably make your life better or more enjoyable, take it ! Just my thoughts, Rich

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Bob Weber

06-19-2003 07:36:42




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 Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...rea in reply to Rich, NJ, 06-19-2003 06:07:28  
We live below our means as well, and put about 40% of our income into savings, stocks, college funds, etc. I really don't have a desire for the big house, fancy car, etc. I drive a 1986 Chevrolet that still has working air conditioning, what more do I need? I love the comment about the 40K SUV guy with the overdrawn bank account. I see lots of my neighbors who I'm sure are in the same situation. A garage and house full of shiny, and nothing to fall back on if hard times hit. My wife and I had the same goals when we met, and that was to raise a couple of good kids who should have it better than we did. So far, so good. 9N'er, sounds like you're doing what YOU want to do, not what THEY want you to do. Keep it up, and in the end you'll be the one with the smile on your face!

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So I see...

06-19-2003 06:38:55




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 Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...rea in reply to Rich, NJ, 06-19-2003 06:07:28  
"Those who don't move upward degenerate into very backward people who become the butt of jokes by others and ultimately die out"

That you have been to Milton, Vermont...

;-)

Salmoneye



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dhermesc

06-19-2003 06:16:24




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 Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...rea in reply to Rich, NJ, 06-19-2003 06:07:28  
I know the feeling, my wife and I own our third home in 7 years, two where repos bought in cruddy condition and one was a huge old thing owned by a little old lady who died. All where bought very cheap and two sold very well (still working on the third one. Our friends and neighbors can't believe we keep doing this, but my goal is to build our dream home with little or no debt. I think we are about one or two restorations away from it. Nothing was ever so funny when one of my high flying buddies pulled up to the ATM in his 40K Suburban with me as passenger and found out his account was overdrawn!

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Rich, NJ

06-19-2003 06:47:52




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 Re: Re: Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant.. in reply to dhermesc, 06-19-2003 06:16:24  
Not to brag, But I suffer from bout with that Celtic disease that all Irishmen have. It's called The "I want to be a landlord syndrome." Go and see the movie Gone With the Wind. Scarlet O'Hara's father makes the feeling that we Irish have for the land quite clear if it needs clarification to anyone. Wife and I bought the saved our pennies and bought the first house with minimum DP. Doubled on that and bought the next one for cash. It was a wreck and we fixed it up. Saved my pennies and bought an old farm with minumum DP. Kept house number 2 and rented it out. Ran the farm while working. Then I subdivided and built the current home with NO Mortgage! I sold the old farmhouse and just sold the last piece of land. In the mean time, I've owned a two family in Trenton, A small bungalow here in town, A house in another town. and a place in Pa. I think I worked twice for every dollar I've gotten. The wife works and between the two of us, We've been able to visit Ireland and the UK, California and Hawaii. and a few other places closer to home. I've put my three daughters through college. I always wanted to fly and a few years ago I made that dream come true. I got my pilot's license and I bought my own Cessna 172. When the TBO for the engine came due, I did the swap. (With an A and P looking over my shoulder and signing me off on everything) BTW I drive a 99 Ford Van that I got coming off a lease. and a 1989 Saab 9000. I'm a HS dropout and self taught Tool and Die maker. I aquired a Real Estate lic. and I've worked as a Leased Property manager. The general criticism I heard the most was from family members,"Why don'tcha just go buy a nice house in a developement somewhere like other people do?" Instead I was getting these old wrecks and fixing them up and renting them for a while. As a HS dropout, I've done more, been more places and had more experiences than most of the college grads I've known. I don't apologise to anyone for taking a life that was given a zero chance of success and making it into something. Rich

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rbell

06-19-2003 06:02:43




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
9Ner, you don't have to look far to see people that are smart @%$$es, and think they are superior to others.
Wether one asks a simple question that is replied to with snide remarks about intuitive simplicity, or someone is jealous because you won't owe the bank when you are in your new home, it all goes to how one was raised.
I was taught to be joyful for others when they succeed.
Congratulations.

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cargocult

06-19-2003 05:46:10




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
third party image

I know just how you feel! When I came back here, I "lived" in an old 24' Travel Trailer for several years while building a small house, mostly by myself. Yep, there were no creature comforts, but I don't have a mortgage, so it's all for the good. Hang in there! Folks like us are the basic American pioneers! When hard times come, we shall survive! As opposed to folks who have massive debts. Right now, they are on top, but the end is in sight! Both of my operable vehicles are from the 80's, and since they are Chevrolets, they are still running fine! Certainly not the most modern vehicles, but they will keep up with the speed limit! And I don't have a monthly payment. Maybe that's why I've been able to take several trips to the PI! Would rather drive a funky vehicle here in Virginia, and be able to fly away in the winter when it gets cold! It's all in your own philosophy! Be true to it!!

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harvey

06-19-2003 05:27:52




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
1. First of all try not to be overly sensitive.
2. Second, remember that they are probably envious of you and your wife as I am.
3. Third, keep shotguns, rocks put away.
4. Fourth, remember, there are more horses’ asses in this world than there are horses.



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Hill_Boy

06-19-2003 05:25:13




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
What kinda comments?
What kinda negative?
Are you building something that is out of the norm?...Igloo or something?

Explain a little !

And.....you only live once...and sometimes that isn't very long....follow your dream....be happy with yourself and what you accomplish.....and by all means....cherish and honor your wife!



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Humble

06-19-2003 04:49:28




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
9ner,

I'm experiencing the same thing. We saved for years to afford a modest piece of property to build on. We've skimped on things for years to afford our dream. Now that we're starting to build, we get all sorts of comments from friends and neighbors. These same people make much more $ than we do, and blow it on everything, but we are the "rich" ones. We are finding our true friends through this. And when we choose not to associate with the sarcastic people any longer, I'm sure we'll be branded as snobs. Oh well. At least we'll have the satisfaction of getting what we worked so hard to afford.
Hang in there.

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don t. - 9n180179

06-19-2003 04:46:27




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
Bottom line....Are you happy w/your life and the way your living it? Are you breaking the law?
Personally, I wouldn't worry about it. Lots of people thought I was nuts for moving into my current home. It was so bad my dogs wouldn't go inside. 5 years into the 3 year plan, we love it. Would do it again in a heartbeat.



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Don't take it personally.

06-19-2003 04:28:21




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 Re: (OT) I'm not pretentious or arrogant...really in reply to 9N'er, 06-19-2003 04:10:58  
I have found that most of the snide remarks come from jealousy...

I bought a $300 dollar Dodge truck that has been my daily driver for going on 2 years now...A 'friend' of mine made a comment that I was getting too 'rich' for him cuz I now had a 2nd car...A $300 truck makes me rich?...LOL...

Salmoneye



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