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Inquireing minds

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Jerry L / az

05-29-2003 22:57:09




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I have a top link that one guy calls a triple tree top link,I understand the purpose for the link just wondering what the three positions are for Is there a certain position for different implements if so could someone tell me what the settings are. thanks..... ..Jer




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KCM

05-30-2003 06:25:05




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 Re: inquireing minds in reply to Jerry L / az, 05-29-2003 22:57:09  
The three holes are to alter the implement affect on the draft position control. It works on the lever principle: The farther away from the pivot you get, the more leverage you have, and thus more power to move the load, in this case the large draft control spring.

Around late 1949/early 1950 Ford added the "triple rocker". The purpose was for use on lighter implements which did not have the appropriate force at the top link to properly activate the draft control. Moving the top link higher on the rocker allowed implements to exert enough force to more easily overcome the large draft control spring and to provide a more accurate draft control. Not sure exactly which implements used the top two holes, but I believe the cultivator used one (most likely the middle). An implement such as a plow which digs uses the lower hole since it exerts a large amount of force at the top link.

Personally, I always use the lower hole for everthing. For what the tractors are used for now-a-days, it works just fine. I doubt you could damage anything if you used the top holes. The draft control probably just wouldn't work well. Don't have a parts book or service manual handy at the moment, but you would thing Ford would have designed it so no damage would occur if the wrong one was used, even by accident. I'm sure there are hard stops integrated to prevent this.

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Ole Henry (Va)

05-30-2003 05:19:32




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 Re: inquireing minds in reply to Jerry L / az, 05-29-2003 22:57:09  
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think only the 8N's had the 3-hole top-link which are a part of the position/draft control system. The bottom hole has the least impact on the system and moving up (mid and top holes) magnifies the pressure that is applied to the system, possibly to the point of causing internal damage. Bottom line, USE THE BOTTOM HOLE ONLY FOR EVERYTHING! I use the mid and/or top holes for spare pin storage.

John A

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Mountainman

05-30-2003 00:02:40




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 Re: inquireing minds in reply to Jerry L / az, 05-29-2003 22:57:09  
There is one piece of equipment which uses the top hole in the three hole top link, but I don't know exactly what it is. But the general rule is NOT to use the top hole for anything and in fact use only the bottom hole. The earlier N's (like my '49) have only one hole.

The top link is sensitive to drag and if you hit a hard section while plowing it will lift the implement a slight amount to compensate.

But the linkage inside is somewhat delicate and is subject to being bent or broken so that is why we use ONLY the BOTTOM HOLE.

hth

N - joy.

Mountainman...CA

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E. Ray

05-30-2003 04:00:16




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 Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Mountainman, 05-30-2003 00:02:40  
Before knowing about the position/draft capabilities of the 3 point hitch, I have always put the top link in the top hole. From your reply, I can't see how I have not damaged the internal linkage. If I only use the position control and do not plan to plow with my tractor. Will this damaged linkage impair the use of my tractor in position control mode?..... ..... ..thanks..... ...E. Ray



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Mountainman

05-30-2003 13:32:41




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 Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to E. Ray, 05-30-2003 04:00:16  
Good question - I think the problem comes when an implement gets stopped cold like a plow on a root or a back blade on a hidden stump.
With the link in the top hole you are appling more leverage to the mechanism that is incorporated in the design of the three point hitch. Entirely possible you have been lucky - but I would start using the lower hole if I were you.

I think Zane could explain it better.

hth

Mountainman...CA

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Shaun

05-29-2003 23:38:17




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 Re: inquireing minds in reply to Jerry L / az, 05-29-2003 22:57:09  
Jerry -

As a new owner, I posted some days ago a question about what the purpose of the top link actually is but didn't hear any responses.

Is the purpose just that it detects the implement to tractor relationship and alters the draft control accordingly? Or is that not even right? I've stared at my bush hog several times wondering how that top link is benefiting me.

Thanks!

-shaun

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Salmoneye

05-30-2003 04:16:06




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 Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Shaun, 05-29-2003 23:38:17  
Stare harder...

How would a person lift the rear of any implement off the ground without a rigid toplink?...Without it all you would do is lift and lower the front of the implement...

It also prevents an implement from flipping up towards the driver if it catches on a stump, rock, etc....



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Shaun

05-30-2003 10:18:53




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 Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Salmoneye, 05-30-2003 04:16:06  
Hmmm.... well, maybe that's it. I've not lifted the entire bush hog off the ground - and not sure I could. When I lift, the front comes up and would hit the PTO shaft before the rear of the hog would even think about moving. You mean it "should" actually pick the entire bush hog up?

Thanks!

-shaun



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Salmoneye

05-30-2003 13:03:14




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Shaun, 05-30-2003 10:18:53  
BG is correct that you do not 'need' the link to lift if you have a chain...I was assuming that you were asking about running without a toplink altogether...I can lift my 500lb KingKutter off the ground at about a 30 degree angle and run down the road from job to job with not problem with a solid toplink...

There are some (and I am one) that do not agree with using a hog with a chain for a toplink however...Hogging is dangerous enough without having to worry about one more thing...I like the 'confidence' of the rigid link...Sorta like a wheely bar without ever having the driveshaft bottom or bind as the toplink takes all the stress when the hog catches a stump or rock...

All IMHO of course...

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Shaun

05-30-2003 13:54:42




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Salmoneye, 05-30-2003 13:03:14  
Salmoneye -

Maybe the posts got crossed, but just to clarify - I DO have a top link (just wasn't completely sure of all its functions).

You say you can lift the entire 5' hog off the ground, eh? Hmmmm... what am I doing wrong then? When I lift, the front of my hog comes up, but my PTO shaft would smack the hog before the rear wheel even left the ground.

Because if I look the this right, when the lift arms come up and the toplink is at a given length - in theory that toplink is now pushing the back of the hog down due to the hinging effect, right?

How do you get the lift arms to pull up the entire bush hog? I've GOT to be missing something... ha, ha.

Thanks!

-shaun

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Rob

05-30-2003 15:29:12




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Shaun, 05-30-2003 13:54:42  
Sounds like you have your top link way long. I can lift my 5' hog til the back idler wheel is 4' or 5' off the ground. Lift arms are full up. Front of the hog is 8 inches from the rear wheels and above the rear axel.
Set your mower at the height you wan't to mow and adjust your top link so it is neither pushing nor pulling, not under strain. Seems like I have 3" or so of thread at each end of my top link. You can grab the top link and rock it side-to-side at that point. It isn't under stress sitting on level ground at op height. That's how it works good on the 2N.
Oh yeah, drop the pto drive line before you go playing around with it. Thank you.

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Shaun

05-30-2003 15:46:22




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Rob, 05-30-2003 15:29:12  
<>

Ah ha... is that the key? I assumed the shaft was staying attached. Are you saying "drop" as in "disconnect"? Then, mine might lift everything that high. My toplink sounds configured much like you describe - under no tension and the thread length sounds close to mine as well.

Ok, now just to clarify... are you saying your hog actually lifts so far that it's over the tractor's rear axel? Whew... that thing must be WAY up there.

I guess I was assuming the pto shaft always stayed attached.

Thanks! Oh, don't have a photo do you?

-shaun

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Rob

05-30-2003 16:03:24




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Shaun, 05-30-2003 15:46:22  
No Shaun, I meant when you were back there playing around with your top link and lifting the hog up and down. That's when I wanted you to disconnect the pto drive shaft. Put the shaft back on when you have everthing adjusted the way you like. It's a safety thing.
Yeah the lift arms go all the way up and like someone described, it's at like a 30 degree angle, 20 degrees, with the back end high and all of it above the rear axel.
Maybe someone has a pic. I might hitch it up tomorrow and snap one. Just took the drawbar off yesterday. Maybe Sunday. Monday....are the fish biting? Is it gonna rain? Is the grass still growing? So much to do, so little time.

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Shaun

05-30-2003 17:14:23




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: inquireing min in reply to Rob, 05-30-2003 16:03:24  
third party image

Thanks, Rob! Hmmm... based on how I see the front of my hog come up (to the point of hitting the pto shaft), I can't imagine how I can get it to lift the entire hog. It almost seems like the toplink would need to get shorter as the lift came up in order to keep the hog's deck at an angle to avoid the shaft.

This doesn't work differently on different hogs does it? Is the toplink height off the deck something that's universal?

Gosh... without being at the tractor location, this is kinda like some cruel mind game... ha, ha.

Thanks for the help!

-shaun

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Dell (WA)

05-30-2003 19:02:38




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: inquireing in reply to Shaun, 05-30-2003 17:14:23  
Shaun..... ...other than the top link being disconnected in your picture, I don't see anything intutitively wrong with your brushog set-up. And if you're pinning yer toplink into that slot, thats wrong. Should be a solid 3/4" pin-hole somewhere..... ....Dell



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Shaun

05-30-2003 19:16:46




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: inquir in reply to Dell (WA), 05-30-2003 19:02:38  
Dell -

Yep, I did attach (actually it was by the time I purchased it) the toplink and yes it was attached to that slot.

So... I guess that leads me to this question: Where would that solid 3/4" pin hole supposed to be? Not the slot, eh? Uh oh...

Maybe I need to round up a Howse hog user for a comparison photo. Thanks!

-shaun



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Rob

05-31-2003 02:20:56




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: in in reply to Shaun, 05-30-2003 19:16:46  
third party image

Shaun look at the hitch points on my bush hog. Your pic makes it look like your top link is lower or the lift arms are higher. My lift arms are very near horizontal. The hog's top link hitch point is 8" or so higher then the hitch point on the tractor. Maybe that's the diff.
I have a full shot that shows a better perspective but I wanted you to see the the hog's deck has an indent to allows for the drive line when I lift my hog. I don't don't see that indent on your deck.
You should be able to see other pics of the hog and hitch at the following link.
I like that swinging drawbar guy!

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Shaun

05-31-2003 08:28:38




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re in reply to Rob, 05-31-2003 02:20:56  
Rob -

Thanks for the photos! Sure is easier to see what's going on in a photo, eh! Yes, it does look like my toplink is lower than the one on your tractor but the lift arms look close. And you're right... my deck doesn't have any indention for the driveshaft.

While I have mine pinned in the slot, Dell said there should only be a hole - not slot. Rob emailed and said his Howse was the same way but with the toplink shortened all the way to the front of the slot, his would lift off the ground but he still had to watch the shaft as it will still hit.

Wouldn't have thought so many differences in hog styles. I'll check it out soon on my next visit to the tractor/property.

Thanks again for taking the photos!

-shaun

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bg

05-30-2003 07:48:26




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 Re: Re: Re: inquireing minds in reply to Salmoneye, 05-30-2003 04:16:06  
You don't have to have a rigid top link to lift. You could use a chain, if all you want to do is lift. Some guys use a chain on a bushog so it can jump stumps and follow ground contour better.

The rigid toplink is essential to the Ferguson system because it use the leverage of the pivot-action of the implement to send corrections, via the control spring and plunger/yoke to the control valve to raise or lower the lift arms.

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