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2N front axel stops

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Dan

12-03-2000 20:08:02




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After breaking the lower radiator hose inlet I decided to tow the 2N (with loader) from the hunting camp to my garage and get things fixed up. I bought a new radiator, axel pin and bushing. After removing the axel support I noticed that the axel stops were bent. What is the best way to fix this? Should I heat the support up and then bend it back and add some bracing to the bottom side? Or should I just add some filler to the top side of the support where the axel hits? Another question I have is where should the thermostat go in the upper radiator hose? Near the top of the hose or at the bottom near the engine? Right now it is near the top of the hose but I'm not sure if thats right.

Thanks
Dan

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Dell (WA)

12-03-2000 21:38:53




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 Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to Dan, 12-03-2000 20:08:02  
Dan..... ..thermostat in upper radiator hose closest to engine. Pointy end toward engine. Some place an additional radiator hose clamp around 'stat, others just above t-stat toward radiator, still others don't bother.

As for the axle stops being bent, one of the casualities of having a frontend loader. I think I'd try some heat and straighten 'em. I'm not sure what you mean by "filler". If you mean "bondo", won't take the pounding. If you mean some welding, ya' maybe.

Myself, I'd seriouly look at widing the frontaxle one set of holes after you get your frontaxle kingpin right with the world..... ...Dell

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Chris N''Texas

12-04-2000 10:12:43




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 Re: Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to Dell (WA), 12-03-2000 21:38:53  
Myself, I'd seriouly look at widing the frontaxle one set of holes after you get your frontaxle kingpin right with the world..... ...Dell

Wouldn't this put more pressure on the middle of the axel. So that when you pick up a very heavy load, could you split the frontaxle. Guy at Ford shop told me this. True?
Thanks
ChrisN'Texas



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Larry 8N75381

12-04-2000 18:51:50




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 Re: Re: Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to Chris N''Texas, 12-04-2000 10:12:43  
I would like to know exactly what the guy at the Ford shop meant by break the front axle. I'm not sure his understanding of mechanical forces, or engineering statics, was accurate. He may have been speaking from just expearence. So the reason an axle broke may not have been what he thought was the reason. I'll try to explain so you can understand what things are important.

Here is how it works. The weight of the loader, tractor, etc. that is held up by the front axle ALL must be carryed by the front axle pin. Widening the front wheels does NOTHING to change that weight. Assuming the wheels are the SAME distance from the axle pin, they both carry half the total weight on the axle pin. NOW if you set one wheel to the 72" width position and the other to the 48", the closer will carry a greater proportion of the weight. But the axle pin still has the SAME weight on it.

When you reach the point where one wheel is "in a hole" so it is not touching the ground, then and only then will ALL the weight (obviously) be carried by the remaining wheel. NOW if ALL the weight STILL were passing trough the axle pin, then there is an unbalanced torsional force set up WHICH IS NOT ALLOWED! SO, the weight is transfered from the axle pin to the axle stop. That is ALL the weight that was on the axle pin!! That is because the stop is in between the wheel and the axle pin. The axle pin now actually pushes up on the axle, to keep it from pulling out of the front of the tractor. The force of the wheel and the axle pin is up and balances the force of the loader and tractor being applied down at the axle stop. All forces are balanced so things are "static" - unbalanced forces cause acceleration and things to MOVE!

So it is no wonder that the axle stops are a little bent. They were subjected to the whole front end weight. AND that weight was most likely not applied slowly, rather BANG! like a hammer blow.

Now to be complete, I must say that widening the axle WILL put added stress on the axle between the wheel and axle pin. Think of it this way. If you were to make a cut thru the axle half way between the wheel and the axle pin, what forces would you have to apply at that point to keep the tractor in balance. First you would need a upward force equal to the force on the wheel that the ground provides. BUT now that force is only half the distance to the axle as before. Now you have an unbalanced torsion force - force times the distance equals torque. The torsion force is balanced by a force at the top of the axle pushing (compression) and an equal force at the bottom of the axle pulling (tension). An example of this would be when you break a stick, the one side is compressed and the other is pulled. Usually the pulled side will break first. But sometimes before it does you can see the compression side bark bunch up as it is pushed together.

Therefore, with the axle spread out the half way point is further from the axle pin and thus a greater torque is created. Given the size of the front axle AND the fact that the overlap section is right where the half way point is, I don't think that will be the "weak" point of the axle.

Regards,
Larry

ps. Since I took Engineering Statics twice - had to, fluncked first time - Nailed it second! - I can do force diagrams in my sleep. :-)

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Dan

12-04-2000 10:10:22




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 Re: Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to Dell (WA), 12-03-2000 21:38:53  
I'm confused. Wouldn't widening the front axel increase the pressure on the stops when one wheel goes up on a high spot? I.e. increasing the leverage on the axel



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Dell (WA)

12-04-2000 11:47:38




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 Re: Re: Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to Dan, 12-04-2000 10:10:22  
Its trigonometric, the wider the wheelbase, the less the angle for the size of the bump.

NOTE: I suggested you consider the effects of widening you front axle 1 hole. Its your decision.

Lets face it, N-Tractors are not the greatest frontend machines, but if that is all you have and that is what you need, then by all means use it that way. Just realize it really wasn't built for it. I think its a tribute to all the safety factors built in to the machine that it does so many things that wern't even in the designeers eye or dreams..... ...Dell

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Chrisn'Texas

12-04-2000 10:14:37




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 Re: Re: Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to Dan, 12-04-2000 10:10:22  
Posted by Dan I'm confused. Wouldn't widening the front axel increase the pressure on the stops when one wheel goes up on a high spot? I.e. increasing the leverage on the axel

Dell, Ya, that too?
Thanks
ChrisN'Texas



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norm-wy

12-04-2000 07:48:48




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 Re: Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to Dell (WA), 12-03-2000 21:38:53  
Dell
You stated in your post "thermostat in upper radiator hose closest to engine. Pointy end toward engine." My thermostat has a stamped "to rad" on the pointy end. Whazzup??



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Dell (WA)

12-04-2000 11:33:54




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 Re: Re: Re: 2N front axel stops in reply to norm-wy, 12-04-2000 07:48:48  
Norm..... ..go with the engraved directions, more better than my memory (grin)..... ..Dell



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