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Minneapolis Moline Tractors Discussion Forum
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damaged piston block

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Jerry Grant

02-17-2006 12:47:58




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I am restoring a 1946 ZTN. The engine was stuck from the beginning, so obvoiusly, you have no idea what you are getting into. I just lifted off the 2 piston blocks. 2 pistons are seriously stuck, one in each block. Water damage from the exhaust manifold. (Keep these tin cans on the exhausts of those old tractors. It does not take a lot of water to create a lot of damage.) They are now soaking with penitrating oil. Every day I pound on them, no luck yet. Any suggestions: However, one block has been destroyed. (I will need a new one.) A spot about 1" square in the cylinder wall has collapsed into the water jacket. Did the water do this or did this happen when it was running? The crank and rods are seem to be just fine. Any ideas? I appreciate any comments. Jerry

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Howard H.

02-20-2006 11:24:59




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 Re: damaged piston block in reply to Jerry Grant , 02-17-2006 12:47:58  
Hi -

I just put a chain around the whole block - and then put a small hydraulic jack in the cylinder against the piston and harnessed by the chain.

I"ve popped an A JD loose that way - I had so much pressure on it, I was expecting it to break something, but finally - a loud pop - and it moved about 1/4 inch - finally got it loose and I think I"ll be able to put rings in it and just hone the cylinder - it didn"t even hurt the piston...


Howard

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Jerry Grant

02-21-2006 08:54:07




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 Re: damaged piston block in reply to Howard H., 02-20-2006 11:24:59  
I would think the chain and jack is a very good way to press them out, however, the piston blocks on the Minnie Mo's are one piece with the horizontal valves directly overhead so you cannot get a good straight shoot at the pistons. Jerry



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Jerry Grant

02-20-2006 09:06:11




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 Re: damaged piston block in reply to Jerry Grant , 02-17-2006 12:47:58  
Thanks for your comments Kevin and Roger. I have head of the grease method before. I may try it. Also, I never thought about the possibility of breaking the piston block up to save the rods. The interesting thing here is that the cylinder wall that is broken is pushed into the water jacket, not the other way around.It really does not freeze much here in Central California. Maybe 10 to 15 times a year and the coldest I have ever seen here is only 4 or 5 degress below freezing. Maybe if there was standing water in the cylinder 3 inches deep, it could have done this. Of course this 60 year old tractor has been around a lot longer than me. Jerry

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roger hinton

02-19-2006 12:12:26




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 Re: damaged piston block in reply to Jerry Grant , 02-17-2006 12:47:58  
Jerry, I know what your going though I"am working on an RTI now. It sounds like your on the right procedure and your engine sounds a lot better than mine. If yours was a case of freezing up and busting then the hole in the cylinder was proabley caused by the water jacket breaking into the cylinder. The only parts I could salvage from the cylinder blocks were the rods. I had to break the cylinder blocks apart with a hammer to salvage the rods.The pistons will be damaged by hitting them on the top. I have used Kelvin"s method before and it worked great but the blocks were worth saving also letting the blocks soak in kerosine for a week will help also. Good luck Roger

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Kelvin

02-18-2006 17:13:38




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 Re: damaged piston block in reply to Jerry Grant , 02-17-2006 12:47:58  
Most likely the water standing in it froze and burst that jug.

I have used the grease gun method to push the pistons out. Lap and put the valves back in if they are out, put the head back on with the head gasket, It helps to pack the cylinder as full of grease as you can get before you start. fit a grease zerk in the spark plug hole and pump away. I only use a lever type gun. Takes about 3-4 pounds per cylinder.

Every time I tell someone about this, there usually pops up a warning about it. And I guess you could burst something, Use your own judgement. The grease usually starts oozing out the valve and head gasket if the pressure really gets excessive.

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dlp

02-22-2006 16:28:52




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 Re: damaged piston block in reply to Kelvin, 02-18-2006 17:13:38  
I have never tried this method, I do know it works, but what if you filled the cylinder with water instead of grease? It can be a lotta grease to pack in there. Water will not compress. For that matter, I guess hyd oil would work also.



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Jerry Grant

02-23-2006 10:23:14




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 Re: damaged piston block in reply to dlp, 02-22-2006 16:28:52  
With grease, you can prepare a grease zert and pump the grease with a grease gun. With water and oil, you need a fitting and a way to pump the oil or water or air for that matter into the cylinder with sufficient pressure. Not sure how you would do that.



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