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Massey Harris & Massey Ferguson Tractors Discussion Forum
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MF 35, 50's early 60's, Generator VR

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erica_136

02-08-2007 08:51:20




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Someone installed a new aftermarket voltage regulator. This is what I'd consider a universal voltage regulator. It does not work properly. When the key is on, engine off, there is a severe discharge. I noticed the discharge is because the generator is trying to spin (it would if not for the drive belt). When the engine is started the it charges, perhaps to much. Any ideas?

Diesel engine with a common 2 wire generator.

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CENTAUR

02-08-2007 12:01:25




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 Re: MF 35, 50's early 60's, Generator VR in reply to erica_136, 02-08-2007 08:51:20  
Take the cover off the regulator and see if the points are stuck in a closed manner.If so resurface the stuck points with a thin voltage regulator file or a (RIMAC) NUMBER 2 flexstone which is thin #120 grit.This will usually restore any points such as plain cutouts,voltage regulators and relays.You will usually find that you do not have to adjust anything after the points are smooth again. CENTAUR

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soundguy

02-08-2007 21:29:16




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 Re: MF 35, 50's early 60's, Generator VR in reply to CENTAUR, 02-08-2007 12:01:25  
Napa carries a fine ignition hone that should work as well.

I've used one to resurface points, and then still gotten 3-4 years out of them till the rubbing blocks eventually wore down till you couldn't adjust them any more.

Soundguy



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erica_136

02-08-2007 15:31:55




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 Re: MF 35, 50's early 60's, Generator VR in reply to CENTAUR, 02-08-2007 12:01:25  
The voltage regulator appeared new but I'll check it. Maybe the old one is still on there, I'll have to look.



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souNdguy

02-08-2007 11:35:03




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 Re: MF 35, 50's early 60's, Generator VR in reply to erica_136, 02-08-2007 08:51:20  
Sounds like ya got a few wireing problems, and perhaps a bad or incorrect VR.

Not sure I've ever hear dof a 'universal vr'.

I se either A circuit ( provides field ground ).. or B circuit ( provides field power ).

I've never seen one that did 'both'.

Next.. if the discharge only happens with the key on.. I'd say that you have your charge line run thru your key switch. Though i freely admit to having no MF exp.. I don't think that is a stock setup to run genny charge power thru the key switch.

next.. sounds like ya got a stuck cutout that is keeping the aarmature and battery tabs common.. thus when yuo turn your key switch, the battery discharges thru the genny, and it tries to motor.

About the only 'good' thing I see here is the genny. By trying to motor.. it probably means that it is 'ok', at least for now.

Most gennies that will charge, will motor, and most gennies that motor, will charge.

You really need to adress this right away.. the genny is cooking when the key is on and the engine is not running.. and you said it is charging high? sounds like an incorrect vr, or an incorrectly hooked up one.. the genny may be charging wide open... which will eventually burn it up, and boil your battery.

I think it's time you start hunting up a diagram and a replacement wire harnes, and drag out a test lamp or vom.

Or at least point to point wire it for the time being and check it.

find out ( in the manual ? ) what circuit type the genny is. Then look at the vr.. Most a circuit vr's have a bias resistor on the bottom that goes from the FIELD tab to ground. Most b circuit vr's have a bias resistor on the bottom that goes from the ARM tab to the FIELD tab. ( there may be other bias resistors on the b-circuit reg as well, depending on make and design. )

post back before you smoke your wireing, key switch, battery, and generator. Chances are VR is already smoked, or is incorrect for this application.

Soundguy

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erica_136

02-08-2007 15:29:15




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 Re: MF 35, 50's early 60's, Generator VR in reply to souNdguy, 02-08-2007 11:35:03  
The leads to the generator are currently unhooked.

I'll have to look at the VR and get the brand/etc. It sure reminded me of ones I seen on autos a long time ago. I wonder the VR may be for an alternator.

I know it is different than the original. It was installed by the engine rebuilder when he did the engine.

A long time ago someone showed me a bench trick to test the generator, by adding power and see if it spins. About ten years later they thought they had a bad generator. I asked if it would spin when jumpered. He had no idea what I was talking about and no recollection of ever showing anyone the test.

Thank you for all your help, it is very appreciated.

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soundguy

02-08-2007 21:17:59




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 Re: MF 35, 50's early 60's, Generator VR in reply to erica_136, 02-08-2007 15:29:15  
Lots of cross application on auto and tractor parts.. i wouldn't be surprised to see an auto vr in an application where the same or similar vr was used.

Might be a vr for an alt.. again.. not a huge deal as long as the circuit type was correct, and other values close. I've seen cross - hybredixzation of gennies and non application specific vr's.. that's no big deal.

You refer to a motor test.. it's in the ford manual.. so you may look in your MF'er manual.

On an a-circuit genny, ground genny case, attach armature wire to battery, and then ground field.. most good a-circuit gennies will then motor.

On a b-circuit genny, ground genny case, attach armature wire to battery, and then jumper wire from there to field... Most good b-circuit gennies will then motor.

Soundguy

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