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Massey Harris & Massey Ferguson Tractors Discussion Forum
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fergy positioner

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Iain Gibson

05-10-2005 23:37:02




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Can anyone help me with a design for a position control system, I would like to make my own being a competant machinist and fabricator. Photos's plans, patents etc would be most appreciated.




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Jeff-oh

05-11-2005 07:49:13




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-10-2005 23:37:02  
Complete plans are located in the parts and pieces photo area under "Galleries" to left.

Do a search on position control.

The measured drawing is hard to read so if you post your e-mail I can send you a clean copy. (E-mail must be in the post as the board does not allow attachments to be sent via their system.

Jeff



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Iain Gibson

05-11-2005 14:26:20




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Jeff-oh, 05-11-2005 07:49:13  
Hi Jeff,

Your help is greatly appreciated. My email is: [email protected]



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Iain Gibson

05-11-2005 15:07:14




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-11-2005 14:26:20  
I have looked clsely at the photos of positioners listed here under parts and pieces. I can follow how it works except for the functionality of the bracket that is held there with a wing nut? Can any one offer a good written description of this.

Does anyone live in Australia or even Brisbane with one of these?



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Jeff-oh

05-12-2005 09:30:03




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-11-2005 15:07:14  
(First part is from a previous post I made...) See end for functionality of each.

Draft control and position control are two separate systems that work with the 3-point. The Ford-Ferguson 9N and 2N as well as the TO-20, TE-20 series and possibly the TO-30 & TO-35 only had the draft control. Here is basically what they are.

Draft control: Maintains a constant drag force on the tractor for soil engaging implements.. i.e. plows. This keeps the tractor pulling with the same amount of force as you proceed through the field.

How it works: When a plow is in the soil the tractor pulls it forward on the two lower points of the lift. To keep the plow from rotating on that axis the top link is there. Thus, there is a forward force on the top link. As the soil gets thicker and the implement is harder to pull the force on the top link increases. When the force gets high enough to compress that big spring under the seat the rod going through the spring actuated the hydraulic pump to raise the implement. As the implement is raised the force drops back to the desired level. This was Harry�s brilliant engineering addition to the industry. All his systems have this.

Position Control: Maintains a implements height (or Position) off the ground. i.e. a mower. The fingertip control sets the height of the implement, however, it is very hard to set the controller at a truly neutral position� i.e. where the lift is not continuing to raise or fall just a little. This movement may be less than � an inch a minute. But if you are mowing, then this little movement can give you varying grass cut heights over a couple of hour job. Thus, the need for position control.

How it works: The easiest position con troll is to hard link the implement to the tractor. i.e. limiter chains. This has the obvious draw back of being limited in height selection and difficult to set/reset.

The other method is a hydraulic feed back loop in the control system. This method links the lift arm rotation to the fingertip control lever. Thus, as the lift drops, the lift arms rotate down and the feedback linkage pulls the fingertip control lever back commanding the lift to rise. As the lift rises the lift arms rotate up and push the fingertip control lever forward, commanding the lift to lower. As you can see, this system is constantly commanding the lift to return to the originally set position� thus position control.

Now there are at least three current methods to add position control to your tractor. There are two commercial products for around $80.00 and a make at home plan that you could do for around $10. They all work about the same and all are effective. If you want the plans for the make at home I can send them to you if you leave an e-mail address.

Fergy Positioner... Hard links the lift-arms to the quadrant control. As the lift "drifts" from position the whole quadrant rotates and netural position is re-established. To function the quadrant control must ba a little loose so it can rotate.

Zane Thang... Has a fixed cam on the lift arms and a rod that goes to a receiver attached to the quadrant control handle. At the chosen height the length of the rod is fixed and thus as the lift "drifts" the handle moves and the lift returns to neutral position.

Available plans here: The box bracket (the 2X3 box channel beam material) is fixed to the lift arms and rotates with the lift. To that you attach a cam (the bracket held with a nut and spring) with a friction pad between the two. (1/8 inch cork). The cam is hard linked to the quadrant control handle via the 4" rod. Thus, the various position are obtained by varing the angle between the cam and the box beam bracket.

Sorry for being so long winded.... I just went to the picture to see what you were describing...

The wing nut and associated bracket is a manual stop the operator can set to get the same position setting over multiple uses.... example to mow at the same height all summer long. This is not a necessary piece, that is why it is not included in the measured drawing.

Jeff

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Iain Gibson

05-11-2005 14:39:25




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-11-2005 14:26:20  
Jeff,

Is this design similar to what people refer to as a Zane Thang? If so how does the fergy positioner work as sold by Stephen. Are there any photos of that?



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Iain Gibson

05-12-2005 14:22:01




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-11-2005 14:39:25  
Please send readable plans to:

[email protected] and
[email protected]



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Jeff-oh

05-13-2005 08:24:18




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-12-2005 14:22:01  
I sent everything wat it not received?



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Iain Gibson

05-12-2005 15:27:16




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-12-2005 14:22:01  
If you are unable to send me the readable plans quickly.. although that would be very helpful...

Can you tell me some critical dimensions,

1. The total linkage arm length (from end of cam to point on control arm.

2. How far apart are the holes on the cam plate?

3. At what distance from the knob end of the control lever do you fix you linkage arm.


[email protected]



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Jeff-oh

05-12-2005 09:53:22




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-11-2005 14:39:25  
Photo's of the Fergy postioner are available at their web site.

The Zane thang is basicly a bracket and a steel rod. There use to be a picture of it on this web site, but it has been removed.



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Jeff-oh

05-12-2005 09:36:27




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-11-2005 14:39:25  
Photo's of the Fergy postioner are available at their web site.

The Zane thang is basicly a bracket and a steel rod. There use to be a picture of it on this web site, but it has been removed.



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Jeff-oh

05-12-2005 09:34:54




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 Re: fergy positioner in reply to Iain Gibson, 05-11-2005 14:39:25  
Photo's of the Fergy postioner are available at their web site.

The Zane thang is basicly a bracket and a steel rod. There use to be a picture of it on this web site, but it has been removed.



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