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Massey Harris & Massey Ferguson Tractors Discussion Forum
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165 has good compression, uses lots of oil

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Gary B.

09-23-2003 10:16:16




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We checked the compression on dad's 165 yesterday after a couple of years of him complaining about the oil consumption. I didn't know how bad it was until he told me yesterday that it uses up to 4 quarts per tankfull of gas! The tractor runs strongly, so we took compression readings. We got 125, 135, 135 & 140. Each number improves about 5 psi wet. I guess I don't think it's rings or valves. He swears it doesn't leak. Could that much oil be going by the valve guides? He says there is a puff of blue smoke when starting and it sometimes smokes under heavy loads. Is it possible there is crankcase pressure buildup causing the consumption? Where should we look next?

Gary

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J.R. NE. KS.

09-24-2003 19:30:24




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 Re: 165 has good compression, uses lots of oil in reply to Gary B., 09-23-2003 10:16:16  
GARY; I HAVE MY MF 165 TORE DOWN IN THE GARAGE, WITH SIMULAR OIL CONSUMPTION. THE MACHINE SHOP WHERE I HEAD RE-WORKED, NEW EXHAUST VALVES,INSTALL GUIDEDS, EXHAUST SEATS AND SEALS, SAID MY VALVE GUIDES WERE NOT PASSING ALOT OF OIL. WHICH I WAS REALY SURPRISED, BECAUSE THE OLD TRACTOR STARTED,RAN & PULLED SOO DAMMED GOOD. MY COMPRESSION WAS AROUND 135-140. WENT AHEAD AND PULLED PAN AND REMOVED PISTONS, COMPRESSION RINGS LOOKED GREAT, BUT THE OIL RINGS HAD NO EXPANSION TO THEM. WICH ENGINE DO YOU HAVE? MINE IS A PERKINS GAS 212UA. MY CYLINDERS HAD ABOUT 2-3THOUSANDTHS TAPER, SO I AM HONING CYLS. AND JUST RINGING. WOULD HAVE SLEAVED AND PUT IN EVERYTHING NEW IF MY CRANK AND ROD BEARINGS CLEARANCES WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN O.K. GOOD LUCK FROM J.R.

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Gary B.

09-25-2003 08:24:55




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 Re: Re: 165 has good compression, uses lots of oil in reply to J.R. NE. KS., 09-24-2003 19:30:24  
Sounds just like dad's situation. Thanks for the info! Yes, I think he does have the Perkins gas engine.

I'm thinking 2-3 thousandths is pretty appreciable taper and may be what weakened your oil rings. Are you sure you don't want to fix it while you're in there? Any other opinions out there?

Gary



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Paul John

09-24-2003 04:43:29




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 Re: 165 has good compression, uses lots of oil in reply to Gary B., 09-23-2003 10:16:16  
There are only a couple things that can make an engine use oil like that, and it may be just 1 thing or a combination of them all
1. oil controll rings
2. valve guides
3. bad head gasket
4. external leaks

If I were you I would look for a top end overhaul, b/c you can replace the valve guides, rings, check the engine, and replace the head gasket all in 1 go. Does the engine burn oil when its idling or at full power? When its under heavy load does it continually blow blue smoke or only periodically? Let me know and maybe we can figure out what it is. Hope this helps. Paul John

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marlowe

09-23-2003 16:41:59




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 Re: 165 has good compression, uses lots of oil in reply to Gary B., 09-23-2003 10:16:16  
you can have bad oil rings and still have good comrression. you did not say if it's ever been rebuilt if so the rings might be in wrong or busted.or your valve guides or umbrellas are bad



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Big Jim

09-23-2003 14:04:11




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 Re: 165 has good compression, uses lots of oil in reply to Gary B., 09-23-2003 10:16:16  
I've never heard of crankcase pressure causing that kind of oil consumption. If its not leaking oil, then it has to be going out either past the rings or the valve guides(or both). You could try dumping some oil through the spark plug holes and recheck your readings to see if they increase on those cylinders with the lower figures. This would be an indication that the rings are bad. At any rate, you would still need to tear the motor apart to fix the problem.

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rick

09-24-2003 03:29:36




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 Re: Re: 165 has good compression, uses lots of oil in reply to Big Jim, 09-23-2003 14:04:11  
Jim Check the head gasket. I have a 35x diesel and it had similar symptoms. Someone had done a top end rebuild but had not tensioned the head in correct sequence so oil was getting from the camshaft gallery to the cylinders on the inlet stroke and then being pressurized in the sump during compression- lots of oil got used up but a new gasket plus a head surface grind cured it



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