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42 A....valves not working....UPDATE!!!!!!

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Will

02-01-2003 17:42:04




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well i spent alll morning on the old A and found the problem with the help of all you guys!!! went inside the engine and felt around on the camshaft and used a flashlight to take a look i could turn the camshaft with my hand and watched it as i turned over the engine and it didnt move so i found out why my valves were all closed and not working, everything looked good but when i felt the cam gear it was LOOSE all the way LOOSE...NO BOLTS they had all come loose and fallen into the engine..so i drained the oil and low and behold there they were all in the bottom of the crankcase all 4 of them...the man that had this tractor before me tried for 4 years to get this thing running and he came over right away when i had it back together and she started on the 4th try!!! i replaced the bolts with new ones and added some lock washers to them dont know if deere had washers on them or not didnt see washers in the crankcase. the old guy i bought her from ask me how in the world did i know how to fix it... just told him i have some buddies from all over the world that helped me out!! thanks to all of you couldnt have done it without this website or your help!!!!! thanks!!!!

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Dave K

02-02-2003 17:26:24




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 Re: 42 A....valves not working....UPDATE!!!!!! in reply to Will, 02-01-2003 17:42:04  
I have a 1948 A that developed a strange knock in the engine. Could not find anything specific in the crankcase, removed the head and pistons. Still did not find anything. About ready to remove the camshaft when I noticed the bolts holding the cam gear on the shaft had polished nuts in spots. Then saw the same on the inside of the crankcase. Found that someone had installed cap screws, with nuts, to hold the gear in place. Four capscrews, no stud. The cap screws were a little too long so when the crankshaft end play was a little too much (I had removed the flywheel previously for other work and had not set up the end play exactly)the nuts on the capscrews were striking the side of the crankcase. I tried all the parts books and several JD dealers, no one could tell me what was "supposed" to be in there. I decided to remove the nuts and put lock washers under the heads of the cap screws. This effectively shortened the cap screws. That was three years ago, I work the tractor and no more problems at all.

Dave

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Lee

02-02-2003 01:32:15




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 Re: 42 A....valves not working....UPDATE!!!!!! in reply to Will, 02-01-2003 17:42:04  
I'd like to say that the one bolt that had worked loose and fallen out in mine was too long to be re-inserted easily. It was also bent 90 degrees when I too found it in the bottom of the crankcase. This suggests to me that the bolts are supposed to be inserted while the left side cam bearing cap is removed thus giving one the access to insert the longer bolts. The lack of a stud proper means that someone has been in there and fixed the long bolt access problem with short bolts, just as I did on mine. I'm thinking now that one should at least go to a higher grade of bolt and apply very high torque to them in an attempt to keep them in there as there is obviously a problem with them working loose and falling out. JD used some cheap insurance in this regard by making one of the bolts used for this attachment a stud so that at least it would still run.

I do not believe in lockwashers or their purported abilities to keep a bolt from turning out. Good torque and a properly sized bolt for the job will work much better in that regard, be it grade 3, 5, or 8, in my opinion. The locking system used originally was a flat sheet of mild steel that was bent up and chiseled up against the flats of the bolt head to prevent it from turning out. Obviously, if they are not chiseled up right, they don't work very good, and the best method to use this type of locking method would be to purchase and use a new one. And that would require removing the cam to do that. You seem to missing that along with the stud as you didn't mention either, so there is a pretty good chance that you will be doing this again someday.

I hope to go back into mine with aluminum pistons for some higher horsepower as she's just a tad shy of what I want to do (8 foot noble sweep in 2nd). When I do that I will go with the longer grade 8 bolts for the cam to gear attachment as well as some other areas for grade 8 bolts (head and flywheel).

That was a quick turn around!! A very busy Saturday for sure - good job.

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Clooney

02-01-2003 18:00:00




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 Re: 42 A....valves not working....UPDATE!!!!!! in reply to Will, 02-01-2003 17:42:04  
Will, glad you found the problem... If I remember correctly there were only 3 bolts, [well actually 2 bolts & a stud] holding that gear to the cam. ~The stud has a fairly large unthreaded center section to act as a locating pin to keep the gear from working on the cam hub. There should be a large diameter steel plate between the bolt heads & the cam gear that gets it's edges bent over to hold the bolt heads & stud nut from backing out. If you just used standard bolts & lock washers it will probably eventually work loose again.

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Carl

02-01-2003 20:33:03




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 Re: Re: 42 A....valves not working....UPDATE!!!!!! in reply to Clooney, 02-01-2003 18:00:00  
I am working on a 41 A with the same problem except that the bolts were just loose. I cleaned the bolts and the holes with brake cleaner and used John Deere Maximum Strength Locktite (the green stuff) on the bolts and stud. I then bent what was left of the metal plate down over the bolt heads. I was seriously considering safety wiring these bolts but I think the Locktite will work OK. This tractor will be a parade/putt around tractor, not a long day field worker.

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